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Chad Ford Mock Draft 1.0: Raptors select Enes Kanter (Enes v Jonas starts post #139)

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  • #91
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    As has been discussed before, and I know I mentioned it, his medical exams would have to check out.

    With that said, as has also been mentioned numerous times, where is the evidence he has knee issues? There has been nothing substantiated, nothing except rumours and whispers. The guy might have had tendenitis or pain from a growth spurt. The guy is 18 and 6'11".

    To say he has "knee history" is not only misleading, at this point I would say it is false.

    When medicals are held and knee issues arise, then I'd start looking elsewhere. Until that time, Kanter seems to be a great pick.
    ok maybe I should rephrase myself. I think I have been tainted by too much NFL and the way they do business but I personally would not give guarantee money to any player who does not 100% clear the medical team. if there is any type of growth defect in his body I will not draft him, if the cartilage in his knees is not perfect I would not draft him, stress fractures, ligament damage, tissue damage... I would not draft him. The kid is nonathletic as it is injury will only slow him down further, he is good but not that good. PLUS there is already an existing separation in the locker room of this team.

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    • #92
      This is from David Locke, the play-by-play guy for the Utah Jazz:



      Commenting on this game only, he just looks super raw. I especially liked the sequence that runs from about 1:26 to 1:35, where Valanciunas displays his butterfly goalie skills.

      Even from the highlight mixes with only his best plays, the only time he looks "smooth" is on the alley-oops, but that doesn't really say much.

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      • #93
        grindhouse wrote: View Post
        ok maybe I should rephrase myself. I think I have been tainted by too much NFL and the way they do business but I personally would not give guarantee money to any player who does not 100% clear the medical team. if there is any type of growth defect in his body I will not draft him, if the cartilage in his knees is not perfect I would not draft him, stress fractures, ligament damage, tissue damage... I would not draft him. The kid is nonathletic as it is injury will only slow him down further, he is good but not that good. PLUS there is already an existing separation in the locker room of this team.
        Picking someone only when they are cleared by the medical team is an obvious point, no? I don't think anyone here is saying pick Kanter no matter what. It's always pick so and so if they check out.

        And you've got to be kidding me about the "existing separation in the locker room." I'm glad front offices don't actually listen to their fans on roster decisions. Talent is talent, and a bad team doesn't need more reasons/excuses for not getting top-rate players. As it is, some people would have you believe we can't have American players because they'll always leave us, we can't have European players because the American players don't get along with them, and we can't have non-American, non-European players because people will call them Europeans anyway. Popovich must be an amazing coach to get his assortment of Euros and non-Euros to play nice. Guess we should just scrap the team.
        Last edited by Quixotic; Wed May 11, 2011, 07:53 PM.

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        • #94
          grindhouse wrote: View Post
          ok maybe I should rephrase myself. I think I have been tainted by too much NFL and the way they do business but I personally would not give guarantee money to any player who does not 100% clear the medical team. if there is any type of growth defect in his body I will not draft him, if the cartilage in his knees is not perfect I would not draft him, stress fractures, ligament damage, tissue damage... I would not draft him. The kid is nonathletic as it is injury will only slow him down further, he is good but not that good. PLUS there is already an existing separation in the locker room of this team.
          There has never, to my knowledge, been anything like the bolded rumoured or reported. This would be an obvious red flag, if true and I would agree with you. However, again, there has been nothing ever confirmed.

          Non-athletic? He is no Tyson Chandler or DeAndre Jordan that is for sure but he is fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot) and is something many bigs lack. He is much more athletic than the comment gives him credit for. He can touch the top of the box and dunk from the foul line - that already bests a number of successful bigs in the league.

          An existing separation in the locker room can happen anywhere. I have a feeling the separation in the locker room has more to do with defensive liabilities and on court/playing time double standards and expectations rather than places of birth.

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          • #95
            grindhouse wrote: View Post
            ok maybe I should rephrase myself. I think I have been tainted by too much NFL and the way they do business but I personally would not give guarantee money to any player who does not 100% clear the medical team. if there is any type of growth defect in his body I will not draft him, if the cartilage in his knees is not perfect I would not draft him, stress fractures, ligament damage, tissue damage... I would not draft him. The kid is nonathletic as it is injury will only slow him down further, he is good but not that good. PLUS there is already an existing separation in the locker room of this team.
            Did you watch those Videos of him posted above? You're saying this guy is non-athletic? Not sure I agree with that at all.

            What do you mean by 'existing seperation' in the locker room?

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            • #96
              I think he's referring to the speculation here:

              http://www.raptorsdigest.com/could-e...y-the-raptors/

              Big deal. You're not going to find any non-winning team without "cliques". Whether its native English speakers vs non-native English speakers, new players vs players who have been on the team for a while, hard-workers vs slackers, good defensive players vs bad defensive players, those with playing time vs those without, or extroverts vs introverts, you're not going to find 15 guys in a locker room all doing a perpetual circle jerk while singing kumbaya when they're not winning 100% of their games.

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              • #97
                "Could Enes Kanter Destroy the Raptors?"

                That is the DUMBEST headline for an Article I've ever read.
                Thanks for clearing that up though.

                I don't think the players are as ignorant and racist as many think.
                If the guy can play then he will respected. If Bargnani has issues fitting in, it has nothing to do with the fact that he's European, and everything to do with the fact that he doesn't play as hard as ANYONE else on the floor.

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                • #98
                  listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.

                  Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.

                  Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.

                  forgive me once again, "fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot)" this is the NBA, not college (which he didn't play in), not high school, or nike hoop summit for someone who is not very athletic at 6'10 in the NBA he better be able to create separation.
                  Last edited by grindhouse; Wed May 11, 2011, 08:27 PM.

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                  • #99
                    grindhouse wrote: View Post
                    listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.

                    Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.

                    Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.

                    forgive me once again, "fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot)" this is the NBA, not college (which he didn't play in), not high school, or nike hoop summit for someone who is not very athletic at 6'10 in the NBA he better be able to create separation.
                    You are forgiven unfortunately you are not going to be taken seriously from this point forward in the conversation.

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                    • lol

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                      • grindhouse wrote: View Post
                        listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.
                        1. How does his young age play negatively? Do you see teams going after 22 year old college seniors because they're older and have played longer? I get the sense of what you're trying to say here, but it's not his age but lack of playing time/experience. As long as he has the ability, who cares how young he is?

                        2. I don't know why you're coughing like Kanter did something immoral or taboo. Kanter's ban was purely a technical point that because he had been paid more than the minimum living expenses back when he was playing for a professional club, he was considered a professional player and ineligible for the NCAA. It was different from the majority of cases where a player accepted money to play for a certain school or to provide an NBA team some kind of advantage over another. Would you make as big a stink had he made the money mowing lawns all year at age 16? It was a job, and he was paid for it, and unfortunately it was basketball-related so it made him a professional.

                        3. I think you're old enough to know the difference between rumor and fact, right? I'm not saying he definitely doesn't have knee issues, but instead of relying on "whispers" like some high schooler listening to Monday morning rumors about who put what in whose hooha over the weekend, why don't we just wait for when the draft prospects go through their medical checkups.

                        4. You must be an unusually sensitive individual to care so much about such potential conflicts. There's a big difference between not wanting a player (i.e. Beasley) because he's a nut case, and not wanting a player because he might not end up best friends with our myriad of non-franchise players.

                        grindhouse wrote: View Post
                        Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.
                        We're not getting upset at you, just rolling our eyes because you take one piece of information and completely blow it out of proportion. It's no different from if I inferred from your parents not being 100% happy their entire lives, that it was because you were a mistake. See what I mean about blowing things out of proportion? The only concern we have is with our losing culture. As long as Kanter is a hard worker, who gives a rat ass about anything else?

                        grindhouse wrote: View Post
                        Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.
                        Really? You must not have seen much. In fact, what bad luck have we really had? Bosh getting his face broken. Reggie getting injured both years. Davis getting injured before the season. What else? TJ Ford and the other Bosh injuries don't count. It's not so much bad luck as much as it is the players themselves. Heck, Milwaukee has it even worse if you consider that they constantly lose Bogut to injury, and Redd hasn't been the same since his injury. Or if you want real bad luck, how about Portland losing their intended new franchise player (Oden) for the entire first season, as well as much of the following seasons, then finding out their new franchise player (Roy) no longer has cartilage in his knees? Or even worse, look at the Clippers' history, and I don't mean just the last couple seasons. If you've ever heard about the Clipper's curse, it's because their injury history makes a very strong case for there being a curse. I think most people were betting on Griffin getting injured as a result, and look, he was out for a year! The Raptors' injuries only seem like a big deal to you because you're not following all the other teams.

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                        • That was a great post.

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                          • Gm's in the beginning took young player's because they were freaks of nature, like with any business organization tried to copy business models to replicate success. After the Iphone was created how many companies tried to copy their success and failed. There are those who set trends and those who follow.

                            don't over hype the young man because the reality is he has not played for a entire year. There has been players in this draft who have improved from the previous season which makes its impossible to judge his progression or lack there of against his peers, kentucky played uconn twice and obviously kanter was not there so you can not know how his help side defense equates vs a guard like kemba. Hoop summit is good for seeing prospects but quite honestly it is a pick up game.

                            If players can not play due to constantly injury that is a problem to say anything otherwise is absurd.
                            Last edited by grindhouse; Wed May 11, 2011, 10:48 PM.

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                            • at the end of the day everyone has their own opinions

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                              • grindhouse wrote: View Post
                                listen I am not saying don't draft the kid period under no circumstances, I am just extremely concerned about 1. drafting a 18 year old 2. drafting someone that hasn't played in a year for *cough* taking money he is not suppose to 3. has whispers about knee issues and 4. "may" end up having conflicts with the core group we are trying to build around.

                                Whether you guys like it or not there has been problems in the locker room when it comes to culture, I didn't put it there so don't get upset at me for bringing it up as a concern BC was the person who came out and said there were/are issues.

                                Also we have had one of the worst cases of bad luck I have seen when it comes to injuries it's getting pretty stupid at this point so forgive me for being critical.

                                forgive me once again, "fundamentally sound (which makes up for a lot)" this is the NBA, not college (which he didn't play in), not high school, or nike hoop summit for someone who is not very athletic at 6'10 in the NBA he better be able to create separation.
                                Maybe we think differently but, to me, the fact that he's only 18, yet has the build he does and is as polished as he is is a big, big plus.

                                The issue with Kanter "taking" money is a complete non-issue, as some basic investigation will discover.

                                His "knee issues" have NEVER seemed to been backed up by any evidence. The best I can seem to figure out is he suffered from some tendonitis one year in high school, which is very little to be concerned about.

                                As for the lockeroom issues, if anyone has a problem with drafting Kanter because he's European, then THEY should be traded because obviously winning is not paramount to them. Winners don't care where you're from, as long as you can help them win.
                                Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
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