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  • #31
    tbihis wrote: View Post
    So you think BC coming out saying he wants to pair Bargnani with a 5 is just for show? Im trying to figure out a reason why he would say that, other than telling the public we're sticking with this guy and we are getting him help with what he lacks. Is he trying to sell Bargnani as a PF coz obviously he's not that good of a C and him playing at the PF might be intriguing for the other GMs in the league?

    If they dont get a center, do you think theyd still stick with Bargnani at that spot knowing how mediocre he was playing that spot last season, and risking the chance he might regress due to the fact that he already stated that he wants to be a PF? would this be a case of better than nothing scenario?

    Again, these are legit questions, not being sarcastic.
    Bargnani is going to be mediocre, at best, playing any spot, because no matter where he plays he's going to be a liability half the time he's on the floor. Colangelo knows this. He's a pretty smart guy. And I think you're absolutely right about Colangelo trying to sell him as a PF because everyone saw how he did trying to play center. I mean, how much sense does it make to go out and get a center when you've already got three PFs who all demand fairly high minutes? Now he can say he's not trading him because he's such a poor defender and rebounder, but because he's got a glut of cheaper alternatives at PF.

    If they don't get a center in the draft, then they really need to figure out how to get one, even a temporary one, because I simply don't see Bargnani returning next year. Of course, if Davis bulks up, they could use him and send out an undersized front court. They certainly wouldn't be the first team to do that. In reality, how important is a legit center on a lottery team, anyway?
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    • #32
      tbihis wrote: View Post
      hahaha funny. now youre saying im too sensitive? ok, i promise not to be too sensitive anymore.

      Not sure if youve been watching the Raps games last season, but with Bargnani at the 5 really didnt do much against opposing 5s. And like i said, BC already publicly stated that they will play Bargnani at the 4, and Bargnani also said the 4 is his natural position. I dont think thats too hard to comprehend, dont you?

      huh? not enough playing time? if i recall correctly, davis avg 24mins, bargnani - 35, amir - 25, evans - 26 and dorsey - 12mins. but i guess youre right, coz when they draft kanter, theyll play bargnani, amir and davis 48 mins a game! so there wont be any mins for kanter left! forget who's the PF, SF, C, SG, PG, Security, Janitor, hot mop girl at the ACC, just play our bigs 48mins each game!!!
      1. It's called spin. What's BC going to say? "Yeah, Bargnani sucked at the 5; he just sucks" or "yeah, Bargnani sucked at the 5, because he's really a 4, so everyone have some patience"? Again, and if you've been reading Arsenalist at all, it doesn't matter a lick what anyone says Bargnani's natural position is. He's not going to magically become less of a liability on help defense simply because he's guarding quicker forwards. Read http://raptorsrepublic.com/2011/04/2...anis-position/ if you don't believe me.

      2. And if you add up all those minutes, what do you get? 122 minutes. You do realize that there's only 96 minutes a game for the PF and C combined right? Those numbers are inflated because of all the injuries. If you do the math, you'll notice that if all 4 players are healthy, Davis, Johnson, Bargnani and Kanter would only receive an average of 24 minutes per game. If Bargnani gets his 35, Davis gets his 30, and Johnson gets his 25, how many minutes per game are left for Kanter? Six. Perhaps you should do a bit of critical thinking before thinking you know all.
      Last edited by Quixotic; Sat May 21, 2011, 05:17 PM. Reason: added link

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      • #33
        Quixotic wrote: View Post
        1. It's called spin. What's BC going to say? "Yeah, Bargnani sucked at the 5; he just sucks" or "yeah, Bargnani sucked at the 5, because he's really a 4, so everyone have some patience"? Again, and if you've been reading Arsenalist at all, it doesn't matter a lick what anyone says Bargnani's natural position is. He's not going to magically become less of a liability on help defense simply because he's guarding quicker forwards.

        2. And if you add up all those minutes, what do you get? 122 minutes. You do realize that there's only 96 minutes a game for the PF and C combined right? Those numbers are inflated because of all the injuries. If you do the math, you'll notice that if all 4 players are healthy, Davis, Johnson, Bargnani and Kanter would only receive an average of 24 minutes per game. If Bargnani gets his 35, Davis gets his 30, and Johnson gets his 25, how many minutes per game are left for Kanter? Six. Perhaps you should do a bit of critical thinking before thinking you know all.
        Um, he literally said that. Not sure if youve been watching the telly, reading the newspapers or really paying attention to the Raptors Republic Forums, BC already called out Bargnani. Here - http://www.nba.com/raptors/video/originals/index.html find Colangelo's end of season conference, its a bit long so you have to be patient, might hurt your head a bit trying to comprehend what he's saying but i have faith in you. youll pull through. There's a part there where he says Bargnani sucks at defense and rebounding, he kinda sugar coated it a bit but the genius that you are, youll be able to dissect it out of the video.

        Again, changing arguments. the discussion was about whether Bargnani is going to be moved to the 4 or not, we werent discussing whether he's going to fit as PF or not. Doesnt matter if he's a fit or not, if he says he's a 4, Colangelo and Triano says he's a 4, he will play at the 4. Much like him being molded as a 5, all along he felt in himself that he was a 4, but since Mitchell, Triano and BC played him as a 5, he couldnt do anything, right? And we all said he sucked at the 5, but did that matter? not really, he still played the 5. Stick to the argument, seriously.

        ok, i hope you just realized how stupidly dumb that comment was. Why the heck would you add all the minutes?? They sub for each other genius, thats how coaches give minutes to everybody. Here http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore...gid=2011032025, game against thunder where evans, amir, bargnani and davis played, and were given minutes. And they actually won the game. and thats not just one game, i just pointed that out coz they won it, made me feel better.

        Wow, so every game youll play bargnani 35 mins, davis 30 and amir 25? You dont think sometimes bargnani will only play 30, davis 25 and amir 20? hhhmm, so thats 21 mins left for kanter. Besides, one of the main reasons why bargnani was playing such heavy minutes was because there was no center on the raps rotation. Mind you, the Magic were able to give minutes to a frontcourt rotation of Howard, Lewis, Bass and Gortat. Same with Duncan, Bonner, Blair and McDyess. And um, hhhmmm, correct me if im wrong but dont these two teams i mentioned um, hmmm, winning teams? id prefer having just 3 but what im saying is having 4 will work too.

        Oh i didnt say im a know it all, i just know a little bit, at least that i admit to.
        Last edited by TheGloveinRapsUniform; Sat May 21, 2011, 07:02 PM.

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        • #34
          tbihis wrote: View Post
          Um, he literally said that. Not sure if youve been watching the telly, reading the newspapers or really paying attention to the Raptors Republic Forums, BC already called out Bargnani. Here - http://www.nba.com/raptors/video/originals/index.html find Colangelo's end of season conference, its a bit long so you have to be patient, might hurt your head a bit trying to comprehend what he's saying but i have faith in you. youll pull through. There's a part there where he says Bargnani sucks at defense and rebounding, he kinda sugar coated it a bit but the genius that you are, youll be able to dissect it out of the video.

          Again, changing arguments. the discussion was about whether Bargnani is going to be moved to the 4 or not, we werent discussing whether he's going to fit as PF or not. Doesnt matter if he's a fit or not, if he says he's a 4, Colangelo and Triano says he's a 4, he will play at the 4. Much like him being molded as a 5, all along he felt in himself that he was a 4, but since Mitchell, Triano and BC played him as a 5, he couldnt do anything, right? And we all said he sucked at the 5, but did that matter? not really, he still played the 5. Stick to the argument, seriously.

          ok, i hope you just realized how stupidly dumb that comment was. Why the heck would you add all the minutes?? They sub for each other genius, thats how coaches give minutes to everybody. Here http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore...gid=2011032025, game against thunder where evans, amir, bargnani and davis played, and were given minutes. And they actually won the game. and thats not just one game, i just pointed that out coz they won it, made me feel better.

          Wow, so every game youll play bargnani 35 mins, davis 30 and amir 25? You dont think sometimes bargnani will only play 30, davis 25 and amir 20? hhhmm, so thats 21 mins left for kanter. Besides, one of the main reasons why bargnani was playing such heavy minutes was because there was no center on the raps rotation. Mind you, the Magic were able to give minutes to a frontcourt rotation of Howard, Lewis, Bass and Gortat. Same with Duncan, Bonner, Blair and McDyess. And um, hhhmmm, correct me if im wrong but dont these two teams i mentioned um, hmmm, winning teams? id prefer having just 3 but what im saying is having 4 will work too.

          Oh i didnt say im a know it all, i just know a little bit, at least that i admit to.
          Wow, this is my last response to you on this topic. Thanks for the novella (first two paragraphs) that really didn't respond to anything pertinent. You apparently missed the point that Bargnani has already spent significant time as PF and against opposing teams' PFs. But whatever, doesn't matter to me really.

          As for your "i hope you just realized how stupidly dumb that comment was," I hope you actually put on your thinking hat and realize how "stupidly dumb" that particular assertion is. Go add up the minutes on that boxscore you just linked. You'll notice that Bargnani, Johnson, Davis and Evans played a combined total of 95 minutes and 59 seconds. Thanks for basically agreeing with me, even though the basic math still somehow escapes you.

          I picked those average minutes played per game based on their average time played per game this season. Bargnani averaged almost 35 minutes per game. Johnson averaged almost 26 minutes per game. Davis averaged over 24 minutes per game over the entire season, but was averaging almost 35 in the last month of play (and 32 in all games he started). You can decide to give them all an average of 24 minutes per game, or give two of them an average of 30 and the other two an average of 18 for all I care. (Do you understand the concept of average, btw? Don't tell me this is condescending because from your response to my post, it isn't certain.) However you want to assign minutes to the new big, you're still taking minutes away from someone. Do you really think taking minutes away from Davis and Johnson is helpful to their development?

          Ask a buddy or someone else on here to explain to you how 48 minutes at PF and 48 minutes at C can only be split so many ways. Ask him to explain to you how the Raptors bigs were able to average the minutes they did because several of them didn't play huge chunks of the season. I've realized it's pointless explaining anything to you when you have your head set on disagreeing.

          Anyway, this is a Sessions thread so let's get this back on topic.
          Last edited by Quixotic; Sat May 21, 2011, 08:59 PM. Reason: added bold for emphasis

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