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2012 Draft Thursday, June 28th: Raptors select Terence Ross

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  • Nilanka wrote: View Post
    DraftExpress tweets:
    I wonder if Evans is for Houston, Orlando or use in a subsequent trade? Perhaps Evans & #18 to Portland for #6? Houston is definitely up to something!

    I agree that it would be hillarious if Houston sold the farm to get Howard, only to see Howard bolt after the season.

    Comment


    • ceez wrote: View Post
      Word is if they don't get Howard they're going after Josh Smith
      Yeah just read that on ESPN. I find that so odd/funny. Josh Smith?? How does that solve any of their problems? It's like if we failed in our pursuit of Lowry/Nash so we traded for Al Jefferson instead. Sure, he's a nice player, but NOT an area of need, and not worth selling the farm for.

      Comment


      • Bouncepass wrote: View Post
        How is Lillard's Freshman year better than Rivers?
        Shooting.

        Lillard TS%, eFG% were better than Riivers in his freshman year, so Lillard had a better shot as a freshman, plus has improved tremendously since them, not all players do. Rivers is worse, and we don't know if he'll get better

        Passing

        Lillard's pace adjusted assists per 40 minutes are way better than Rivers. Not even close. So he passes better. He's improved here too, though not as much as his shooting.

        Ball Handling

        By TO/pos Rivers was is a slightly better handler than Lillard was as a Freshman, but not as good as Lillard in his second year, and certainly not as good as Lillard now. However because Lillard can shoot better and pass better, even as a freshman he was better because this resulted in pretty much the same Points/pos, and much better Ast/to..

        Of course Lillard has improved tremendously since then, and Rivers is nowhere close to him now. Will Rivers improve? Maybe. Maybe not.

        Efficiency

        As a Freshman, Lillard was better at every one of the complete efficiency stats, PER, EFF, EFF/40, and WS/40. Of course, now he is the most efficient player in the NCAA not named Anthony Davis (position adjusted).

        So as a freshman, Lillard was better than Rivers in *every statistical category* -- which is not hard since Rivers is *below average in every statistical category* and since then, Lillard has improved tremendously, very few players *at any level* improve as much, so odds are Rivers wont.

        Rivers is simply not a good enough basketball player to have success in the NBA. The GM that drafts him will probably lose their job.
        Last edited by Quirk; Tue Jun 26, 2012, 11:37 AM.

        Comment


        • themasao wrote: View Post
          Yeah just read that on ESPN. I find that so odd/funny. Josh Smith?? How does that solve any of their problems? It's like if we failed in our pursuit of Lowry/Nash so we traded for Al Jefferson instead. Sure, he's a nice player, but NOT an area of need, and not worth selling the farm for.
          You know who Smith is good friends with? Howard.
          @sweatpantsjer

          Comment


          • ceez wrote: View Post
            You know who Smith is good friends with? Howard.
            Good point. But weren't Jarret Jack and Chris Bosh best buds? Seems to be a winning strategy.

            Comment


            • Quirk wrote: View Post
              Shooting.

              Lillard TS%, eFG% were better than Riivers in his freshman year, so Lillard had a better shot as a freshman, plus has improved tremendously since them, not all players do. Rivers is worse, and we don't know if he'll get better

              Passing

              Lillard's pace adjusted assists per 40 minutes ar(position addjusted) e way better than Rivers. Not even close. So he passes better. He's improved here too, though not as much as hos shooting.

              Ball Handling

              By TO/pos Rivers was is a slightly better handler than Lillard was as a Freshman, but not as good as Lillard in his second year, and certainly not as good as Lillard now. However because Lillard can shoot better and pass better, even as a freshman he was a better because this resulted in pretty much the same Points/pos, and much better Ast/to..

              Of course Lillard has improved tremendously since then, and Rivers is nowhere close to him now. Will Rivers improve? Maybe. Maybe not.

              Efficiency

              As a Freshman, Lillard was better at every one of the complete efficiency stats, PER, EFF, EFF/40, and WS/40. Of course, now he is the most efficient player in the NCAA not named Anthony Davis (position adjusted).

              So as a freshman, Lillard was better than Rivers in *every statistical category* -- which is not hard since Rivers is *below average in every statistical category* and since then, Lillard has improved tremendously, very few players *at any level* improve as much, so odds are Rivers wont.

              Rivers is simply not a good enough basketball player to have success in the NBA. The GM that drafts him will probably lose their job.
              You need to quickly let the scouts and GMs know this, to save them their jobs. How did Rivers and Lillard look when you watched them play in person this past year? How did their private workouts for you go?

              Regarding the stats, it is not a surprise that some of Lillard's stats were better as a freshman - he played on a much weaker team and in a much weaker conference.

              I am not sold on Rivers at all, but I am cautious about Lillard. If you want to go by this past season's stats, then Jeff Taylor > MKG.

              Comment


              • Howard really wanted Smith but of course Orlando had zero trade chips to make it happen. I think Houston's plan is to get a couple guys Howard likes to make themselves a player when he becomes a FA at the end of the season.
                @sweatpantsjer

                Comment


                • David Aldridge now tweeting:

                  Told there is no way that Kings would do purported offer of Lowry/14/16 for Evans and five if it was even actually offered.
                  I love/hate this time of year...

                  Comment


                  • ceez wrote: View Post
                    Howard really wanted Smith but of course Orlando had zero trade chips to make it happen. I think Houston's plan is to get a couple guys Howard likes to make themselves a player when he becomes a FA at the end of the season.
                    That's a fairly reasonable approach I guess. Can you imagine how hard it would be to score in the paint with Howard and Smith on the same team? They'd have to put protective glass around the courtside seats to protect from the plethora of volleyball-spike blocks.

                    Comment


                    • ESPN (insider) article: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?...-key-questions

                      This question is posed: Is Rivers the next Kobe or Bayless?

                      Unfortunately I don't have ESPN Insider access to get Chad Ford's answer... anybody???

                      Comment


                      • calgaryrapsfan wrote: View Post
                        espn (insider) article: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?...-key-questions

                        this question is posed: Is rivers the next kobe or bayless?

                        Unfortunately i don't have espn insider access to get chad ford's answer... Anybody???
                        2. Besides davis, who will have the biggest impact as a rookie?
                        Who is the most nba-ready player for the 2012-13 season? It usually depends more on the team a player lands on than the player himself.

                        I think it could be the toronto raptors' jonas valanciunas. Many nba scouts believe he would have been the no. 2 pick in this year's draft had he not entered the 2011 draft. Valanciunas spent the year in lithuania and will be a rookie this season. The raptors will likely give him lots of playing time early, as they think he has the makings of a star.

                        If you're asking about players from this draft, then three players come to mind.

                        Kansas jayhawks forward thomas robinson has an nba body and nba skills. If he lands on a bad charlotte team, he should come in and put up big numbers right away.

                        I could also see harrison barnes putting up big numbers if he lands in cleveland. He's got a pretty big chip on his shoulder and playing with an elite point guard like kyrie irving could really elevate his game.

                        Syracuse guard dion waiters is another possibility if he lands on the right team. He's got an nba body and can get to the basket at will. He could put up big, tyreke evans-esque numbers as a rookie on a bad team.
                        5. Austin Rivers: The next Kobe Bryant, or the next Jerryd Bayless?
                        I don't think there's a more polarizing player in the draft than Rivers. Fans and scouts tend to either love him or hate him. I know several teams have him ranked in the top 10 on their Big Boards. I know several others that have him in the second round. How's that for a draft range?

                        Rivers does model his offensive game after Bryant -- for better and for worse. He's a super-aggressive scorer. He's got a killer crossover, has mastered the fade away J and wants the ball in his hands at the end of close games. He loves himself some hero ball.

                        Again, for good and for bad, Rivers also has modeled his off-the-court behaviors to emulate Bryant. He works hard. He's tough. He's super confident. However, he's also got a wrap as a selfish player who bristles at teammates and doesn't know how to share.

                        Factor in Rivers' pedestrian shooting numbers, poor free-throw shooting and poor assist-to-turnover ratio, and suddenly he looks very un-Kobe-like.

                        But the real concern for Rivers is that he physically doesn't hold a candle to Bryant. He's not as big, not as long and not as explosive as Bryant was. Take away Bryant's size, length and explosiveness and Kobe isn't Kobe. That's why, in some respects, Rivers looks a lot like Raptors combo guard Bayless.

                        Whichever team takes Rivers will be taking a risk. It is one that could pay off big time, or one that could blow up in a team's face.
                        ta da
                        Last edited by ceez; Tue Jun 26, 2012, 12:08 PM. Reason: crap i forgot the one you actually wanted
                        @sweatpantsjer

                        Comment


                        • Rivers:

                          TS% 0.54
                          eFG% 0.50
                          PER 16.8
                          EFF/40 13.4

                          Lillard:
                          TS% 0.57
                          eFG% 0.52
                          PER 17.0
                          EFF/40 16.1

                          Big Sky Conference teams:
                          Montana
                          Weber State
                          Portland State
                          Eastern Washington
                          Montana State
                          Idaho State
                          Sacramento State
                          Northern Colorado
                          Northern Arizona

                          Top Five Scorers:
                          Damien Lillard (24.5)
                          Charles Odum (19.1)
                          Cliff Colimon (16.5)
                          Will Cherry (15.8)
                          Kenny McGowen (14.7)

                          Comment


                          • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                            David Aldridge now tweeting:



                            I love/hate this time of year...
                            Same. Gotta love DA bringing everyone back down to earth though. I don't know why Evans was even mentioned in the deal. You could probably get Lowry and like the 16 pick for Evans alone. Adding a top 5 for one extra pick in the late teens seems pretttty unrealistic.

                            Comment


                            • CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
                              ESPN (insider) article: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?...-key-questions

                              This question is posed: Is Rivers the next Kobe or Bayless?

                              Unfortunately I don't have ESPN Insider access to get Chad Ford's answer... anybody???
                              Well its not much of an answer, but here's what he says:

                              5. Austin Rivers: The next Kobe Bryant, or the next Jerryd Bayless?
                              I don't think there's a more polarizing player in the draft than Rivers. Fans and scouts tend to either love him or hate him. I know several teams have him ranked in the top 10 on their Big Boards. I know several others that have him in the second round. How's that for a draft range?

                              Rivers does model his offensive game after Bryant -- for better and for worse. He's a super-aggressive scorer. He's got a killer crossover, has mastered the fade away J and wants the ball in his hands at the end of close games. He loves himself some hero ball.

                              Again, for good and for bad, Rivers also has modeled his off-the-court behaviors to emulate Bryant. He works hard. He's tough. He's super confident. However, he's also got a wrap as a selfish player who bristles at teammates and doesn't know how to share.

                              Factor in Rivers' pedestrian shooting numbers, poor free-throw shooting and poor assist-to-turnover ratio, and suddenly he looks very un-Kobe-like.

                              But the real concern for Rivers is that he physically doesn't hold a candle to Bryant. He's not as big, not as long and not as explosive as Bryant was. Take away Bryant's size, length and explosiveness and Kobe isn't Kobe. That's why, in some respects, Rivers looks a lot like Raptors combo guard Bayless.

                              Whichever team takes Rivers will be taking a risk. It is one that could pay off big time, or one that could blow up in a team's face.

                              Comment


                              • themasao wrote: View Post
                                Same. Gotta love DA bringing everyone back down to earth though. I don't know why Evans was even mentioned in the deal. You could probably get Lowry and like the 16 pick for Evans alone. Adding a top 5 for one extra pick in the late teens seems pretttty unrealistic.
                                Agreed. Unless a team feels that Lowry is a significant upgrade over Evans, why would they giveup a #5 pick for 2 picks in the mid-teens?

                                Comment

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