January 22: Los Angeles Clippers

[slaw]

Aside from the atrocious shooting by the starters 1-5 Davis, 4-19 Derozan, 0-0 Amir, 1-8 Calderon they played pretty well. If the rest of the starters could have matched JJ's 3-8, Raps would have been in the game.

I'm not sure you watched the same game. They were down by 16 at the end of the first quarter. They had more fouls than points in the first quarter. The only reason this wasn't 130-80 is because LA put it in cruise control for the entire second and fourth quarters. This isn't about confidence or mental space. It's about the fact this roster is terrible. I admire the optimism but it's misplaced.

Have to say, I've sat through some pretty bleak Raptor seasons but I don't ever recall it being so bad. This team is basically unwatchable. Even worse, the guys that are supposed to be building blocks for this team have been awful. It's one thing to lose, it's another thing to lose, realize last season and this season have been absolutely wasted, and that this team is likely 3 years from a chance at the playoffs. That's an awful lot to take as a fan...

[Joey]

Have to say, I've sat through some pretty bleak Raptor seasons but I don't ever recall it being so bad. This team is basically unwatchable. Even worse, the guys that are supposed to be building blocks for this team have been awful. It's one thing to lose, it's another thing to lose, realize last season and this season have been absolutely wasted, and that this team is likely 3 years from a chance at the playoffs. That's an awful lot to take as a fan...

You should at least acknowledge this is a completely different team when we play through Bargnani of Offense.
Demar is not nearly the Offensive player that Bargs is, and when left as the Sole 'Go-to' scorer, he obviously struggles. I'm not sure that speaks to anything other than the fact that he's 22 years old and will be inconsistent at this point in his career. Especially after playing as many games as they have in the last 2 weeks.

I don't think things are NEARLY as doom-and-gloom as you make them out to be.
Yes, last nights game was bad. As were several before that. But put Bargnani in the mix, and I can promise you we are competing at a MUCH higher level in ALL of those games.

[Fully]

I was surprised to see, watching the game on my PVR, that the Raptors offensive sets didn't look bad. They actually played pretty good D as well. Devlin made the point in the 3rd at the 33 minute mark, that the starting 5 had scored 8 points between them.

That isn't from lack of talent. That is a mental space issue. The Clips weren't playing that great a defence. You could see Derozan second guessing his shots. And the Raps were clearly focused on Griffin, allowing Jordan to have his way with them. The team shot 36% which isn't going to win them any games, and that shooting was elevated by Grays 3 for 3, Babosa's 7 for 12 and Klieza's 5 for 10. The starters shot 9 for 40. You can't blame Casey's offensive sets for that. Those numbers are waaaay more about your confidence level than anything else. Somehow these guys have got to get their heads in a better place.

The Raps had more offensive rebounds than the Clips, largely because of all their misses. They were only out rebounded by 4. They had fewer turnovers than the Clips. They were behind in assists, but no wonder.

Aside from the atrocious shooting by the starters 1-5 Davis, 4-19 Derozan, 0-0 Amir, 1-8 Calderon they played pretty well. If the rest of the starters could have matched JJ's 3-8, Raps would have been in the game.

I have to disagree. The game was basically over in the first Q. The score got a little narrower at times but I'd attribute that to the Clippers shifting to half speed rather than anything that the Raptors did well.

DeRozan was terrible. Amir had his worst game as a Rap. Ed Davis continues to regress. Jose stunk. When you're setting a 3-8 performance from James Johnson as a standard of success than we've officially got huge problems.

[Puffer]

I'm not sure you watched the same game. They were down by 16 at the end of the first quarter. They had more fouls than points in the first quarter. ...

I believe that is the point I was making. The starting unit shot far worse than they have in any other game this year. You don't take a teams worse performance and then measure them by it. On the other hand, the second unit didn't do too badly. Barbosa and Kleiza were pretty steady. Grey was a reasonably pleasant surprise.

I called this team to win 15-20 games this year and I still believe they are in that range, so I am hardly overly optimistic. But I don't think that this game is truly characteristic of this teams capabilities either.

[Puffer]

I have to disagree. The game was basically over in the first Q...

I referenced the fact that the starting unit only scored 8 points in the first 2 1/2 quarters. That would pretty much indicate that the game was over in the first quarter. But that doesn't mean the offensive sets (for which Casey has been criticized) weren't efficient. They weren't effective because Calderon was 1-8 and Derozan was 4-19 and Amir was 0-0. None of those players played like that last year and aside from Derozan in some games, none of them, have played like that this year. This game, so far this season at least, was an aberration.

Look, I am in no way saying this team, as constituted, is good. But watching the replay, after reading all of the negative comments in this thread, I was surprised at how many things they did right. They got open looks. They held the Clippers to their average scoring pace. Their second unit did well. And they lost the game. But again, the starters did not play nearly as well as they are capable of.

[slaw]

I believe that is the point I was making. The starting unit shot far worse than they have in any other game this year. You don't take a teams worse performance and then measure them by it. On the other hand, the second unit didn't do too badly. Barbosa and Kleiza were pretty steady. Grey was a reasonably pleasant surprise.

It's not just one game or one quarter. First quarters have been an issue for a couple weeks now. Pointing out the fact that they had fewer turnovers and almost as many rebounds or that the bench played okay, sorry, that's meaningless. The Clippers checked out of this game in the first half. They came back to ensure the blowout within the first 3 minutes of the second half and then just put it in cruise control.

Did the bench play well? I don't know, they weren't as bad as the starters. But "the bench" was Kleiza and Barbosa. Are they the future of this team? They are key pieces in the rebuilding plan? Come on.

[Puffer]

...Did the bench play well? I don't know, they weren't as bad as the starters. But "the bench" was Kleiza and Barbosa. Are they the future of this team? They are key pieces in the rebuilding plan? Come on.

What you quoted was me saying "...the second unit didn't do too badly. Barbosa and Kleiza were pretty steady. Grey was a reasonably pleasant surprise."

That isn't saying they played well or that anybody is a key piece in the rebuilding plan. Boy, I'm taking a lot of bricks here for essentially saying that, after reading the negative comments on the game, I was surprised inj that they played better than I expected when I watched the game.

For the record, the team as constituted, is a bad team. It has lots of bad players. I expect them to win 15 - 20 games. If 15 games looks unattainable, well, they have also had a tough schedule and a couple of significant injuries. Their schedule gets better latter in the season. We'll see what happens.