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Amnesty Calderon -> MAX out Deron Williams?

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  • CalgaryRapsFan
    replied
    tbihis wrote: View Post
    Exactly what i was going to say.

    I think Deron is a good player, but i dont like his attitude. Any player who thinks he has a "say" in team management moves is a potential problem. If you dont like the way the team is being run, then ask for a trade. Thats my opinion. He clashed with Sloan and now just because NJ didnt get Dwight he's not exercising his option. Potential problem player.
    Agreed. DWill likes to think he's on the same level as Kobe, LeBron, Wade, Paul, etc... but he's not. I've always thought DWill was the epitome of a volume scorer who puts personal stats ahead of team results. He wants it to be all about him, on and off the court. I've never liked him. He'll never choose Toronto, so this whole discussion is moot regardless.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheGloveinRapsUniform
    replied
    Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    We don't know anything for sure about what happened in Utah, as I said earlier. If you hate him on the basis of that, you must hate a lot of people.

    Some of the possibilities I heard were about Williams ignoring a play-call by Sloan and Sloan wanting to discipline him for that. I think I would become quite insubordinate if I never was allowed to decide things on my own but always had to do what someone else tells, meaning they don't trust me to make my own decisions.

    As I've also said earlier, if this was the reason, management not backing Sloan when he wanted to discipline him, there was probably a lot more going on, considering they surely were aware of their own plans to trade Williams, making it a very weird move not to back Sloan, knowing their was a big chance Williams would not be there in a week. Probably they weren't too concerned about keeping Sloan.

    Furthermore, it won't be the first time a player has a problem with a coach, and it's not an enormous one, not listening to the coach on a particular possession. Normally they will resolve this problem together and get on with it (SvG still has job in Orlando). That's not driving a coach away, that's just a conflict. It's that in this case, if the above is true, management didn't back the coach which they will usually do if they want their coach to have any succes and keep coaching longterm.

    Maybe it's a "I don't like how he handled that" situation, but a "I hate him!", that's way over the top.

    Add: oh man: I said 'their' when I meant 'there'. I hate myself.
    True. But, i maybe wrong, but only Williams was reported on being the only "insubordinate". None of the other 10 players in the rotation came out and commented on Sloan's play-calling. If your PG makes his own decisions while the other 10 players follow the coach, thats a potential problem.

    I do think they wanted to get rid of Sloan as well, thats why they didnt back him up. But the issue was more on Deron not following Sloan, which i think was more of a knack to Deron rather than Sloan. Coaches NEED to be followed, thats why theyre put in that situation. Its up to the management to get rid of the coach if he's not a fit anymore for the team, not the players. If Deron was able to behave that way against a highly respected coach like Sloan, i dare not imagine how he will treat a semi-rookie coach like Casey.

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  • TheGloveinRapsUniform
    replied
    Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    my dad
    hahahahahahahahaha comeback of the year!

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  • TheGloveinRapsUniform
    replied
    ceez wrote: View Post
    Williams is a lazy headcase anyways, pass.
    Exactly what i was going to say.

    I think Deron is a good player, but i dont like his attitude. Any player who thinks he has a "say" in team management moves is a potential problem. If you dont like the way the team is being run, then ask for a trade. Thats my opinion. He clashed with Sloan and now just because NJ didnt get Dwight he's not exercising his option. Potential problem player.

    Leave a comment:


  • charlz
    replied
    MangoKid wrote: View Post
    The problem with amnestying Calderon is that the guy is an asset. A guy that takes care of the ball and finds guys in spots for easy baskets? Plus he's an expiring. The solution to all of that might be to use him acquire depth we would need for seasons going forward.
    I think Calderon has been offered numerous times in numerous deals. Even since MJ killed the chandler trade. No one wants him. Maybe as an expiring contract they will.

    I will personally not take the ratpors serously as a playoff contender until they don't have him defending the point of attack.

    Leave a comment:


  • Miekenstien
    replied
    Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    I've learned in these situations not improvise beyond my capabilities, but just leave it to the professionals ans refer people to a good psychologist.
    haha

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  • Soft Euro
    replied
    Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    i hate 4 people

    deron williams
    steve dubinsky
    michael kerr
    dave anderson

    please explain to me why i shouldn't hate the other 3. they arent basketball players. just people. one of them i have only met on one occasion but he seemed like a jerk.

    i know you are really close with deron williams to defend my perceived ideals of his personality and why i personally hate him. can you please help me with these other 3?

    thanks
    I've learned in these situations not improvise beyond my capabilities, but just leave it to the professionals ans refer people to a good psychologist.

    Leave a comment:


  • Miekenstien
    replied
    Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    We don't know anything for sure about what happened in Utah, as I said earlier. If you hate him on the basis of that, you must hate a lot of people.

    Some of the possibilities I heard were about Williams ignoring a play-call by Sloan and Sloan wanting to discipline him for that. I think I would become quite insubordinate if I never was allowed to decide things on my own but always had to do what someone else tells, meaning they don't trust me to make my own decisions.

    As I've also said earlier, if this was the reason, management not backing Sloan when he wanted to discipline him, there was probably a lot more going on, considering they surely were aware of their own plans to trade Williams, making it a very weird move not to back Sloan, knowing their was a big chance Williams would not be there in a week. Probably they weren't too concerned about keeping Sloan.

    Furthermore, it won't be the first time a player has a problem with a coach, and it's not an enormous one, not listening to the coach on a particular possession. Normally they will resolve this problem together and get on with it (SvG still has job in Orlando). That's not driving a coach away, that's just a conflict. It's that in this case, if the above is true, management didn't back the coach which they will usually do if they want their coach to have any succes and keep coaching longterm.

    Maybe it's a "I don't like how he handled that" situation, but a "I hate him!", that's way over the top.

    Add: oh man: I said 'their' when I meant 'there'. I hate myself.
    i hate 4 people

    deron williams
    steve dubinsky
    michael kerr
    dave anderson

    please explain to me why i shouldn't hate the other 3. they arent basketball players. just people. one of them i have only met on one occasion but he seemed like a jerk.

    i know you are really close with deron williams to defend my perceived ideals of his personality and why i personally hate him. can you please help me with these other 3?

    thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • Nilanka
    replied
    Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    We don't know anything for sure about what happened in Utah, as I said earlier. If you hate him on the basis of that, you must hate a lot of people.

    Some of the possibilities I heard were about Williams ignoring a play-call by Sloan and Sloan wanting to discipline him for that. I think I would become quite insubordinate if I never was allowed to decide things on my own but always had to do what someone else tells, meaning they don't trust me to make my own decisions.

    As I've also said earlier, if this was the reason, management not backing Sloan when he wanted to discipline him, there was probably a lot more going on, considering they surely were aware of their own plans to trade Williams, making it a very weird move not to back Sloan, knowing their was a big chance Williams would not be there in a week. Probably they weren't too concerned about keeping Sloan.

    Furthermore, it won't be the first time a player has a problem with a coach, and it's not an enormous one, not listening to the coach on a particular possession. Normally they will resolve this problem together and get on with it (SvG still has job in Orlando). That's not driving a coach away, that's just a conflict. It's that in this case, if the above is true, management didn't back the coach which they will usually do if they want their coach to have any succes and keep coaching longterm.

    Maybe it's a "I don't like how he handled that" situation, but a "I hate him!", that's way over the top.
    I agree with this reasoning. Sloan, although one of the greatest coaches of all time, is still human and capable of making mistakes when it comes to dealing with players.

    Leave a comment:


  • Soft Euro
    replied
    Miekenstien wrote: View Post
    my hate for him has nothing to do with his playstyle. i hate him as a human. guy forced jerry sloan out of basketball. if deron were on the raptors i would cheer for the other 14 players.
    We don't know anything for sure about what happened in Utah, as I said earlier. If you hate him on the basis of that, you must hate a lot of people.

    Some of the possibilities I heard were about Williams ignoring a play-call by Sloan and Sloan wanting to discipline him for that. I think I would become quite insubordinate if I never was allowed to decide things on my own but always had to do what someone else tells, meaning they don't trust me to make my own decisions.

    As I've also said earlier, if this was the reason, management not backing Sloan when he wanted to discipline him, there was probably a lot more going on, considering they surely were aware of their own plans to trade Williams, making it a very weird move not to back Sloan, knowing their was a big chance Williams would not be there in a week. Probably they weren't too concerned about keeping Sloan.

    Furthermore, it won't be the first time a player has a problem with a coach, and it's not an enormous one, not listening to the coach on a particular possession. Normally they will resolve this problem together and get on with it (SvG still has job in Orlando). That's not driving a coach away, that's just a conflict. It's that in this case, if the above is true, management didn't back the coach which they will usually do if they want their coach to have any succes and keep coaching longterm.

    Maybe it's a "I don't like how he handled that" situation, but a "I hate him!", that's way over the top.

    Add: oh man: I said 'their' when I meant 'there'. I hate myself.
    Last edited by Soft Euro; Mon Mar 26, 2012, 01:48 PM.

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  • MangoKid
    replied
    Williams wants to play in a big market. And in the States. Therefore, he won't be playing in Toronto next season. End of story.

    Leave a comment:


  • Miekenstien
    replied
    Soft Euro wrote: View Post
    Not really; I just wanted to say that all the 'hate'-talk is overdoing it. Too much use of those kind of terms on here lately. If there is some dislike about a player often words like 'scrub' 'btch' 'hate' etc. are used. That's just plain stupid. Now, with Miekenstein I can understand that he has some issues because his dad apparently slept with his girlfriend.
    my hate for him has nothing to do with his playstyle. i hate him as a human. guy forced jerry sloan out of basketball. if deron were on the raptors i would cheer for the other 14 players.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bendit
    replied
    Williams could also join Howard in Orlando. Isnt that what they both wanted? They could retool the Magic to be a pretty good team. I'd also like to see the Heat and Magic battles for the next few years....but not particularly good for the Raps (another powerhouse in the east.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fully
    replied
    There's no way Williams opts for Toronto when he has a chance to go home to Dallas, get the same amount of money (max deal), and play for a team that is already established as a contender.

    Leave a comment:


  • Soft Euro
    replied
    NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    lol soft euro. You know that joke would really make you look stupid if the guy didn't have a girlfriend
    Not really; I just wanted to say that all the 'hate'-talk is overdoing it. Too much use of those kind of terms on here lately. If there is some dislike about a player often words like 'scrub' 'btch' 'hate' etc. are used. That's just plain stupid. Now, with Miekenstein I can understand that he has some issues because his dad apparently slept with his girlfriend.

    Leave a comment:

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