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OFFICIAL: James Johnson sent to Kings for 2nd Rounder

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  • Craiger wrote: View Post
    I've come to quickly realize that a guy who has spent 4 straight years in the lottery, has 43% win rate, is actually a very good GM, highly skilled and doesn't make mistakes (atleast never at the time)
    What credibility does BC have left?

    he can't even stand up there and buy time any more. He has held press conferences SELLing us on Fred Jones, TJ ford, Kapono, Hedo, Alabi, Johnson (he's so chiseled now).

    All because he keeps trying to fix his fucking Bargs blunder 7 years later and the guy has ensured we have the weakest from court in the league save 20 games.
    Last edited by charlz; Mon Jul 16, 2012, 07:39 PM.
    "I may be wrong ... but I doubt it"

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    • Exactly. Doug Smith said JJ would have inconsistent practices, and seemed disinterested most of the time. Not to mention that he was suspended for 2 games for butting heads with Casey. His stats are inflated because he got minutes he shouldnt have gotten in the first place. And he is far too much of a gambler on defence. The Raps need the Cap Space and JJ would have been behind Fields, and LK at the 3.

      thead wrote: View Post
      Ryan Wolstat ‏@WolstatSun

      Johnson move all about locker room culture not talent. Didn't mesh with Casey Has talent but doesn't know how to use it properly yet as well
      @RavNation

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      • The concept that Bryan Colangelo has turned good assets into bad ones is based on a fundamentally flawed understanding of how assets work in the NBA. All assets in the NBA depreciate over the long term. Therefore if you follow any asset for long enough, it becomes worthless.

        Think about it this way. When Tim Duncan retires, what will the Spurs have left from their number one pick? Nothing. That asset is used up. It won them 4 championships, though, so that's not bad.

        When a draft pick becomes an unrestricted free agent, it is pretty much as if that asset vanished. You can re-sign the draft pick, but you're using up cap space the same way anyone else would be if they signed that pick. So it is hardly surprising that not much value is left from the Bosh drft pick: his contract expired. There is nothing Colangelo could do to stop at from happening. At the time he did the reasonable thing: he tried to build a team around Chris that could win some games

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        • charlz wrote: View Post
          What credibility does BC have left?

          he can't even stand up there and buy time any more. He has held press conferences SELLing us on Fred Jones, TJ ford, Kapono, Hedo, Alabi, Johnson (he's so chiseled now).

          All because he keeps trying to fix his fucking Bargs blunder 7 years later and the guy has ensured we have the weakest from court in the league save 20 games.
          How is he fixing Bargs Blunder. Bargs last season averaged 19.5 points a game, and this year he is going back to his natural position, 4. He was jerked by the organization forced to play 5, a position that doesnt suit him.
          @RavNation

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          • In fact one year they had him playing 3 with Bosh at 4 and JO at 5. He has gone from 5 to 3 back to 5. Not good for a players development when he cant figure out what position he has to play.
            @RavNation

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            • Sacramento picked up Aaron Brooks. They are loaded at 1/2. Surely we could have found a backup PG or a combo-guard there?

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              • JJ was one of the last players I would have wanted traded in the team. I liked his game a lot, even though he had lots to improve on. To me his flaws were more on personality/attitude (like trying to play above himself on offense and gambling too much on D) than skill. I had hoped that in time he will understand his role and accept it, and that whatever went on between him and coach would be fixed. I guess not. Then again he could have wanted out himself after what happened last season, you never know. Nevertheless it sucks to see him go, and for nothing significant in return. I wanted him as our back up SF, provided we found a good starting 3. Him backing up Kleiza/Fields/DD/Ross wouldn't cut it.

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                • malefax wrote: View Post
                  The concept that Bryan Colangelo has turned good assets into bad ones is based on a fundamentally flawed understanding of how assets work in the NBA. All assets in the NBA depreciate over the long term. Therefore if you follow any asset for long enough, it becomes worthless.

                  Think about it this way. When Tim Duncan retires, what will the Spurs have left from their number one pick? Nothing. That asset is used up. It won them 4 championships, though, so that's not bad.

                  When a draft pick becomes an unrestricted free agent, it is pretty much as if that asset vanished. You can re-sign the draft pick, but you're using up cap space the same way anyone else would be if they signed that pick. So it is hardly surprising that not much value is left from the Bosh drft pick: his contract expired. There is nothing Colangelo could do to stop at from happening. At the time he did the reasonable thing: he tried to build a team around Chris that could win some games
                  All assets depreciate over the long run, sure. But how long is the long run? Every year? After 10 years? We've seen many players appreciate in value over time. Tony Parker went from a late first round draft pick to a perennial all-star. Thats value appreciation.

                  You point to Bosh. But I'll point out Colangelo having the opportunity to derive value from him by trading him earlier. He choose not to (in fact he offered a max contract to a guy he later said couldn't be built around!!). He didn't lose value in Bosh due to asset depreciation, he lost value in Bosh because he sold Bosh at his lowest possible value.

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                  • We could have had Bynum for Bosh.


                    -- Charles Barkley

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                    • As was mentioned on another thread, the Bosh trade was not so bad, they got miami's pick, which didn't really turn out, but then again I wouldn't want Norris Cole. They also got back their own pick - JV - which is a pretty good trade for a guy that had already left!

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                      • torch19 wrote: View Post
                        We could have had Bynum for Bosh.
                        Nobody knows what we could have gotten for Bosh, it's all just speculation and often speculation based on what you think of Colangelo. But suppose we would have gotten Bynum (you know, the pet-player of Jim Buss who was rumoured not even to want to trade him for Howard) we would have enjoyed an injury prone player (untill this year) with a high probability of having some nice trade-drama this year with Bynum in the last year of his contract.

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                        • OnTheRightTrack wrote: View Post
                          As was mentioned on another thread, the Bosh trade was not so bad, they got miami's pick, which didn't really turn out, but then again I wouldn't want Norris Cole. They also got back their own pick - JV - which is a pretty good trade for a guy that had already left!
                          not accurate.

                          They got Miami's pick, which they traded for James Johnsons to Chicago, who was then traded for a 2nd round pick.

                          The Raps didn't get JV from their pick being returned. It was lottery protected, so what they have gotten back so far is 2 2nd round picks (which they would have lost to Miami due to the lottery protection).

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                          • YYZ wrote: View Post
                            In fact one year they had him playing 3 with Bosh at 4 and JO at 5. He has gone from 5 to 3 back to 5. Not good for a players development when he cant figure out what position he has to play.
                            Is this the latest one we're going to go with. I just want to know in case someone asks, we should all have our story straight.

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                            • All about making Casey happy

                              I am extremely unhappy with this trade, I think JJ was very talented. But I can see the value in making sure that our locker room is filled with guys that are happy to be playing their roles, and that their is no major differences in opinion between Casey and the players. Players need to know that if they are not going along with the program they are expendable, its essential for maintaining order especially for a young team. In that sense, for the purpose of creating a better atmosphere for our team to flourish this trade understandable.

                              Landry fields is a younger player with better shooting, and perimeter defense, a higher basketball IQ which is what our team needs more. I do believe that it is better to have players that are defined as starters who will be getting at least 30-36 min. a game rather than having 2 people share that position with 24 min. a game each. We had a logjam at SF and now it is dealt with.

                              Best of luck to you JJ.
                              "Defense wins championships."

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                              • Craiger wrote: View Post
                                All assets depreciate over the long run, sure. But how long is the long run? Every year? After 10 years? We've seen many players appreciate in value over time. Tony Parker went from a late first round draft pick to a perennial all-star. Thats value appreciation.

                                You point to Bosh. But I'll point out Colangelo having the opportunity to derive value from him by trading him earlier. He choose not to (in fact he offered a max contract to a guy he later said couldn't be built around!!). He didn't lose value in Bosh due to asset depreciation, he lost value in Bosh because he sold Bosh at his lowest possible value.
                                In hindsight, sure, he could have traded bosh at some point for more than 2 draft picks. But he chose to instead use Bosh: have him play on the team. And that decision didn't turn out great. But I have no problem with making a decision that turns out badly if the choice was sensible at the time. Trading an all-star away in his prime is not usually a good move, unless you get a package like Utah or Denver got. I doubt anything remotely like that was ever on the table for Bosh.

                                Your point about some assets appreciating over time is a perfectly good one. Not too many of Colangelo's pickups seem to have appreciated much: Amir Johnson is maybe the biggest exception. But it is disappointing that Bayless and Johnson didn't turn out to be much. Disappointing, but not super surprising: Colangelo got them for peanuts, and there was never much chance of them being huge contributors.

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