Does MLSE deserve any blame?

[charlz]

there are rumblings that BC wanted to Amnesty Calderon but OWNERSHIP were not willing to "write-off" 10 mill + take on additional salary of Ramon Sessions 5MILL/yr for 2/yrs (or CJ watson).

MLSE would not give BC additional money for coach after SMITCH was fired so we got stuck with Jay Triano.

MLSE was not willing to eat JO's 2009-2010 contract worth $23,016,000 so it cost a first round pick to grease him out of town... Depleting the franchise.

February 13, 2009: Traded by the Toronto Raptors with Jamario Moon and a 2010 2nd round draft pick & conditional 1st round draft pick to the Miami Heat for Marcus Banks, Shawn Marion and cash.

hmmmm sound familiar?
to avoid paying the final year of Jalen Rose contract (15 Mill) they burned another first round draft pick just to side step paying that cash

February 3, 2006: Toronto Raptors Trade Jalen Rose with 2006 1st round draft pick

MLSE is near sighted. They need to be profitable every year. Fucking idiots don't have any vision and loose out on the real money of playoffs and better attendance. They destroy every team they touch. Their fucking bean counters run all their franchises.

[FONT=Arial Black]ROGERS BELL MLSE THE WORST OWNERSHIP GROUP IN THE WORLD[/FONT]
bluejays
Raptors
Leafs
TFC

[KHD]

Rogers and Bell just took over. Prior to that, yes, the teachers fund was notorious for prioritizing profit to the point of handicapping teams and / or accepting the pathetic status quo (Leafs).

[mcHAPPY]

Those were all under previous ownership - Ontario Teachers Pension Plan.

I don't think you can grade current ownership since August, 2012 based on previous ownership prior to August, 2012.

[KHD]

Those were all under previous ownership - Ontario Teachers Pension Plan.

I don't think you can grade current ownership since August, 2012 based on previous ownership prior to August, 2012.

In fact, the new ownership group has already shown a willingness to spend, with the Jays (i'm no baseball expert, but thats what the news stories say).

I think that with the Teachers fund they wanted to be as low risk as possible, whereas with Bell and Rogers, they know that if they build a winner their TV revenue will increase and more than cover the cost. This is more risky though, as you have to spend on players up front.

Basically, despite the fact that i despise Bell for having me on the hook for practically every connection to the world outside my home, I think they're more likely to pay up for good teams.

[Fully]

there are rumblings that BC wanted to Amnesty Calderon but OWNERSHIP were not willing to "write-off" 10 mill + take on additional salary of Ramon Sessions 5MILL/yr for 2/yrs (or CJ watson).

MLSE would not give BC additional money for coach after SMITCH was fired so we got stuck with Jay Triano.

MLSE was not willing to eat JO's 2009-2010 contract worth $23,016,000 so it cost a first round pick to grease him out of town... Depleting the franchise.



hmmmm sound familiar?
to avoid paying the final year of Jalen Rose contract (15 Mill) they burned another first round draft pick just to side step paying that cash



MLSE is near sighted. They need to be profitable every year. Fucking idiots don't have any vision and loose out on the real money of playoffs and better attendance. They destroy every team they touch. Their fucking bean counters run all their franchises.

[FONT=Arial Black]ROGERS BELL MLSE THE WORST OWNERSHIP GROUP IN THE WORLD[/FONT]
bluejays
Raptors
Leafs
TFC

Like others have already stated, those moves came under the previous regime and can't be blamed on MLSE.
And to be honest, I'm not sure how true some of those statements are anyway.

There may have been "rumblings" about ownership not wanting to eat Calderon's deal but that doesn't necessarily make it the reality. And besides, not amnestying him has turned out to be a sound decision given Lowry's injury problems this season. We've needed Calderon. Plugging Sessions/Watson into his role this year would not have changed anything, and the kicker is that our cap situation would be even worse if either of those signings were allowed to happen.

I don't remember the JO deal to Miami being a teacher's union issue with paying the salary, and even if there were more 'rumblings', they're purely speculation. The Raptors and Colangelo considered themselves "contenders" in the East during that period, as laughable as that may be in hindsight, and when things went so poorly with O'Neal I think BC felt inclined to shake things up again in an attempt to salvage the season.

[Craiger]

there are rumblings that BC wanted to Amnesty Calderon but OWNERSHIP were not willing to "write-off" 10 mill + take on additional salary of Ramon Sessions 5MILL/yr for 2/yrs (or CJ watson).

MLSE would not give BC additional money for coach after SMITCH was fired so we got stuck with Jay Triano.

MLSE was not willing to eat JO's 2009-2010 contract worth $23,016,000 so it cost a first round pick to grease him out of town... Depleting the franchise.



hmmmm sound familiar?
to avoid paying the final year of Jalen Rose contract (15 Mill) they burned another first round draft pick just to side step paying that cash



MLSE is near sighted. They need to be profitable every year. Fucking idiots don't have any vision and loose out on the real money of playoffs and better attendance. They destroy every team they touch. Their fucking bean counters run all their franchises.

[FONT=Arial Black]ROGERS BELL MLSE THE WORST OWNERSHIP GROUP IN THE WORLD[/FONT]
bluejays
Raptors
Leafs
TFC

As others have pointed out, those were previous owners.

Thats said, is there any evidence that MLSE/OTPP didn't want those things? From all accounts BC had alot of autonomy in the decision making process, something previous GMs didn't have (atleast to the same extent).

Now I imagine BC had a budget he had to work in, so they may have prevented him from going above that budget which then would have given BC one less route to take to get to the destination he wanted.

PS Amnestying an expiring contract would have been a waste anyways. Add that Jose is at they very least a useful player that offered insurance incase of injury, seems like a foolish move on many levels. Really handy having it now for Bargnani if needed anyways.

[Craiger]

Wanted to add, that doesn't absolve MLSE from blame. They after all are the owners and MLSE, as an entity, hired and reupped Colangelo.

Here's hoping new ownership wants to take the team in a different direction

[hateslosing]

Why would you amnesty Calderon? He has a year left and is a significantly better player than, say, Bargnani. The guy is one of the top offensive pg's in the league and BC wanted to amnesty him during his contract year when all we have in an unproven, oft injured Lowry and a bunch of D leaguers? I'm really starting to get aboard the firee BC train, that's just stupid. Also, Ramon Sessions is not good.

[DoNDaDDa]

id say yes but its not from lack of spending as some say...its having baboons running the teams that there responsible for & for letting these baboons have too much slack on there ropes...we got BC who is constantly tinkering with NO real success..then we got Burkie who talks a big game but cant do anything to give his team hope!

MLSE has forked out big time dollars to shit players many times because of these 2 Blabbering fools..soo u cant say we dont spend or havent spent because we have...

[BasketballCrush]

MLSE was not willing to eat JO's 2009-2010 contract worth $23,016,000 so it cost a first round pick to grease him out of town... Depleting the franchise.

I understand this decision, a pick in that range usually gets sold for 5-6 mil, so swollowing 23 million is way too much.



MLSE has spent well on this team. Not NY well, but better than most. Can't really fault them for wanting a GM to work within their budget, and their budget is still better than most clubs.


(Teachers were running it to make a return, new magnment can profit more by the teams success)

[charlz]

...whereas with Bell and Rogers, they know that if they build a winner their TV revenue will increase and more than cover the cost. This is more risky though, as you have to spend on players up front.

Basically, despite the fact that i despise Bell for having me on the hook for practically every connection to the world outside my home, I think they're more likely to pay up for good teams....

the conventional wisdom would say so more games deep playoff runs = huge revenue...when will we see it?

[Eric Akshinthala]

If Bryan Colangelo is in a position where he could give an honest answer and was asked which of the two teams he's worked for has been financially supportive, I have not doubt in my mind that his answer would be Raptors by miles. I disagree with a couple of the points mentioned at the start of this thread but MLSE is no different from any good Organisation. Once in a while interference from ownership is normal. As capable a GM as BC is, the present state of affairs is completely his doing and responsibility.

[hateslosing]

I understand this decision, a pick in that range usually gets sold for 5-6 mil, so swollowing 23 million is way too much.



MLSE has spent well on this team. Not NY well, but better than most. Can't really fault them for wanting a GM to work within their budget, and their budget is still better than most clubs.


(Teachers were running it to make a return, new magnment can profit more by the teams success)

Ah, 2009-2010 makes more sense. I thought they meant he did that this year.

[mountio]

MLSE management is not the problem at all. I cant think of one situation where we lost out on a good player (whether signing our own guy or FA) due to unwillingness to spend. They signed off on a BRUTAL LF contract for the right to OVERPAY steve nash. Again, help me with how this is the owners fault?

WE SPEND LOTS OF MONEY. We just do it in a stupid way! Blame BC, blame DC (hes a clueless coach), blame the players .. but you cant put this on MLSE (whether under teachers or rogers/bell)

[pesterm1]

there are rumblings that BC wanted to Amnesty Calderon but OWNERSHIP were not willing to "write-off" 10 mill + take on additional salary of Ramon Sessions 5MILL/yr for 2/yrs (or CJ watson).

MLSE would not give BC additional money for coach after SMITCH was fired so we got stuck with Jay Triano.

MLSE was not willing to eat JO's 2009-2010 contract worth $23,016,000 so it cost a first round pick to grease him out of town... Depleting the franchise.



hmmmm sound familiar?
to avoid paying the final year of Jalen Rose contract (15 Mill) they burned another first round draft pick just to side step paying that cash



MLSE is near sighted. They need to be profitable every year. Fucking idiots don't have any vision and loose out on the real money of playoffs and better attendance. They destroy every team they touch. Their fucking bean counters run all their franchises.

[FONT=Arial Black]ROGERS BELL MLSE THE WORST OWNERSHIP GROUP IN THE WORLD[/FONT]
bluejays
Raptors
Leafs
TFC

I also remember reading that it was MLSE that REALLYYYYY wanted us to get Nash (obv. to sell tickets).
And BC tried to make it happen now we are stuck with Fields.