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Trade Jose at the height of his value

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  • vino
    replied
    ebrian wrote: View Post
    Kyle Lowry: 375 games played; 154 starts (41.1%)
    Jose Calderon: 507 games played; 305 starts (60.2%)
    The matter of fact that Calderon has started more games than Lowry has nothing to do with talent or ability to take it to the next level. In this regard Lowry can still develop into an elite pg. He's never going to be CP3 or Rondo (and yeah, Rondo is an elite pg now; I remember only last year ppl here threw him under the bridge). He just does not have the passing/court vision (and not going to learn that); however, he can become a poor's man Westbrook. He isn't far now.

    The stat you have brought up is irrelevant. I was referring to the overall skill level of Calderon, and not just with the Raps. Fact is, he wouldn't start on the majority of the teams and he wouln't have started so many games on a good team. I think it's clear. If anything, this stat points to the fact that the Raps have never had a solid point guard since Damon.

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  • Junior
    replied
    I think the debate as to whether Calderon or Lowry should be traded is sort of futile. Whether their departure from this team would be beneficial or not entirely depends on what this team gets in return, whereas the departure of Bargnani from this team would be beneficial in basically in any manifestation. This is because the presence of Calderon and Lowry on this roster is overall positive, whereas the presence of Bargnani on this roster is overall negative.

    But I would be open to the idea of trading Calderon or Lowry because they are not directly tied in with what seems to be the future of this team, ie. DeMar, Val, ED and Ross.

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  • ebrian
    replied
    vino wrote: View Post
    Funny to read all these sentimental comments about Jose's leadership, being a pro and other soft-feelings drama. Cut this bull; do what's best for this team and trade him (if there is a good player/high pick coming back). Quite honestly I do not care in which uniform he retires and where his kids go to school. He's a back up point guard in this league.
    Kyle Lowry: 375 games played; 154 starts (41.1%)
    Jose Calderon: 507 games played; 305 starts (60.2%)

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  • vino
    replied
    Funny to read all these sentimental comments about Jose's leadership, being a pro and other soft-feelings drama. Cut this bull; do what's best for this team and trade him (if there is a good player/high pick coming back). Quite honestly I do not care in which uniform he retires and where his kids go to school. He's a back up point guard in this league. We need Lowry to come back and play the way he can. Yes, sometimes selfish ball. Amir, Ed and Val will fight and get their own. That's their current game.

    Unfortunately, I do not think we'll get a fist rounder for Calderon like the author of this thread is suggesting. He's playing well lately, but I do not think any GM will put a 1st rounder on a table. They might be willing to take back Barg with him as a package... but not for a 1st round pick.

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  • planetmars
    replied
    Craiger wrote: View Post
    Bargnani played in the Houston game. It was the next game against Memphis that Bargnani missed.

    I don't think anyone can come to a conclusion about how well Lowry does or doesn't fit in one game, let alone against one of the best teams in the league.
    Crap you're right... I was staring at the boxscore too, but for some reason I assumed it was the Houston game.

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  • planetmars
    replied
    knowledgep wrote: View Post
    oh we should trade him then, blow it up. That ONE game this season tells the whole story...
    LOL! I know was just a one game sample that could mean nothing. I would love for Lowry to play like I think he can play without Bargnani shooting bricks. I just don't want to see Kyle and Jose playing together at the same time.

    Houston last year had a very mediocre team but they were playing .500 ball. Lowry is not a liability. I suspect he was playing injured, although it was against the team that traded him so I was hoping for better effort. 8 boards is pretty awesome though.

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  • Craiger
    replied
    Bargnani played in the Houston game. It was the next game against Memphis that Bargnani missed.

    I don't think anyone can come to a conclusion about how well Lowry does or doesn't fit in one game, let alone against one of the best teams in the league.

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  • octothorp
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post
    He did get a chance, against Houston this year. He had 7pts, 5asts, 8rbs but shot 3/10 and was a -17. I'm not sure if he was playing injured or not though, but he did get a chance to show his stuff without Bargnani in the lineup, and they lost by 16.
    You probably mean the Memphis game (night after the Houston game... Bargnani got 31 minutes against the Rockets). Either way, one game is far too early to write off the idea of a Lowry-led team without Bargs, especially when that game was on the road, on the second night of a back-to-back, against one of the best teams in the league.

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  • tucas
    replied
    Eric Akshinthala wrote: View Post
    Since Raps. don't have a 1st round pick next year, they should definitely try to acquire one. I don't think trading Jose will help them acquire one though. Trading Lowry will. That's what I think they should do. Get creative and package a big contract along with him for a 2013 1st rounder and a useful piece/s. The PG situation can be addressed in the off-season.
    Lowry can't even be traded this season because we acquired him this season. It sucks because he could bring in real value.

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  • Raptorboy
    replied
    knowledgep wrote: View Post
    Jose vs Lowry is still pending I would say. I'd like to see the team play with Lowry at point minus Bargs.
    I hope Lowry can make us come out of our seats when he gets back. Not sure if the early season injury put out his fire or what but hes not the same guy who was ready to take the reins and will the team to victory.

    Jose has been doing a very good job of getting everyone involved. He might not be the most athletic PG but hes a world class decision maker. Our young bigs are getting excellent experience playing with Jose. Demar is starting to click with him as well. The winning is a bonus of sorts. Player development should be our #1 concern. Jose is an excellent facilitator and perfect candidate to help our young players improve.
    Last edited by Raptorboy; Thu Dec 20, 2012, 01:46 PM. Reason: sounds better

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post
    He did get a chance, against Houston this year. He had 7pts, 5asts, 8rbs but shot 3/10 and was a -17. I'm not sure if he was playing injured or not though, but he did get a chance to show his stuff without Bargnani in the lineup, and they lost by 16.
    Was he healthy? I don't think he has been near 100% since the first 3 games of the season. Came back too soon, overextended himself trying to carry the team, and in doing so made himself look selfish and lacking confidence in teammates.

    Definitely excited to see him come back and work with the youth on this team.

    Leave a comment:


  • knowledgep
    replied
    psrs1 wrote: View Post
    It is time to make a move....
    i don't like any of those deals above, although i think it's time to trade Calderon, he's an expiring veteran presence playing very well. He's an asset we need to move. 1 step back, 2 steps forward...

    Leave a comment:


  • knowledgep
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post
    He did get a chance, against Houston this year. He had 7pts, 5asts, 8rbs but shot 3/10 and was a -17. I'm not sure if he was playing injured or not though, but he did get a chance to show his stuff without Bargnani in the lineup, and they lost by 16.
    How many times have they lost by double digits with Calderon starting?

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  • knowledgep
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post
    He did get a chance, against Houston this year. He had 7pts, 5asts, 8rbs but shot 3/10 and was a -17. I'm not sure if he was playing injured or not though, but he did get a chance to show his stuff without Bargnani in the lineup, and they lost by 16.
    oh we should trade him then, blow it up. That ONE game this season tells the whole story...

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  • psrs1
    replied
    raptors98 wrote: View Post
    Even with our nice 4 game streak, the raps aren't going to do anything this season. If we trade Calderon now, we could get some valuable assets, and maybe still sign him at the end of the season.
    Some reasonable deals I like:

    Package Jose and Bargnani for Kings first rounder (2013 or 2014), Aaron Brooks and Thompson.
    Calderon to Memphis for Wrotten, and Speights
    Calderon to Dallas for 2013 first rounder(might be lotto) and jae crowder

    I especially like the last deal - especially cause it could definitely happen.
    Your potential deals?
    It is time to make a move....

    Leave a comment:

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