#FireCasey

[Jrice9]

Its weird to me that there is so much complaining about Casey's offense which has ranked #9, #4 the last two years.

If anything the complaint should be about the defense (along with the usual JV/JJ rotation questions and end of game play calling) but then you would actually have to address the fact that the Raptors defensive personal isnt exactly great.


Is Casey the best coach in basketball? Definately, not. But has he gotten pretty good results for a team with this talent level? Yes.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

JV has played 1133 minutes this season. No other player has 700+ minutes with an AST% lower than Jonas 2.6.

A big part of the problem is coaching.

JV gets the ball very infrequently (especially earlier in the season) and, when he does, it's usually a clear-out post-up with the other 4 players standing around the perimeter watching him. He will occasionally pass the ball out of the post, but he rarely has an opportunity to turn the pass into an assist (I remember back-to-back games where he found Ross for a 3pt shot to register assists out of the post).

He would do well with the use of back-door cuts, or using a screen to get a guy open on the 3pt line on the side he starts his post-up from (that gets cleared out), but DC doesn't seem to be creative enough to utilize such plays. Instead, it's just JV's turn to run an ISO.

[mcHAPPY]

Its weird to me that there is so much complaining about Casey's offense which has ranked #9, #4 the last two years.

If anything the complaint should be about the defense (along with the usual JV/JJ rotation questions and end of game play calling) but then you would actually have to address the fact that the Raptors defensive personal isnt exactly great.


Is Casey the best coach in basketball? Definately, not. But has he gotten pretty good results for a team with this talent level? Yes.

This is a good example of the eye test.

The offense is predictable and easy to stop.

It is not made for playoff basketball when refs will swallow whistles.

The defense is larger issue - no question. Casey has been found out.

[raptors999]

Its weird to me that there is so much complaining about Casey's offense which has ranked #9, #4 the last two years.

If anything the complaint should be about the defense (along with the usual JV/JJ rotation questions and end of game play calling) but then you would actually have to address the fact that the Raptors defensive personal isnt exactly great.


Is Casey the best coach in basketball? Definately, not. But has he gotten pretty good results for a team with this talent level? Yes.

Casey was hired for defence. Raptors could get better coaches if they wanted to score more.

[OldSkoolCool]

Never understood why a coach being likable influences whether they should be coaching. If Casey wants to continue coaching he needs to let Nurse run the offense and let Bayno run the defense with another assistant handling sub's and time outs. Essentially coaching. He can handle the media.

Thank you!

It's like "I really like my doctor, but he keeps giving me viagra instead of penicillin"

Coaching should be judged by his ability to coach, not be friends with the team...(shouldn't have to say to a point, but interwebz)

Lowry has an AST% of 35.3 this year. That's the highest AST% of his career.

JV has played 1133 minutes this season. No other player has 700+ minutes with an AST% lower than Jonas 2.6.

Then look at the remainder of our guards

Lou, half his career average
DD, down 6% from last year
Vasquez, second lowest of his career

Lowry may have the highest, but someone has to pass the ball to the three chuckers above^

Nice cherry picked stat tho.

[white men can't jump]

Lowry has an AST% of 35.3 this year. That's the highest AST% of his career.

JV has played 1133 minutes this season. No other player has 700+ minutes with an AST% lower than Jonas 2.6.

Lowry is the only one with any kind of decent uptick in AST%.

Lou is down to near a career low. Basically cut his AST% in half.

Vasquez is down a few % points compared to last year (where he was slightly higher in Sacto)...but is far below what he put up in NOP.

DeMar's has dropped back down a bit after the solid season he had last year in that respect.

Ross is down a tiny bit. Amir is pretty much the same. Pat is up a tiny bit. Jonas' has gone down for the second year in a row. Even JJ has seen a near 7% drop in his AST%.

[OldSkoolCool]

Lowry is the only one with any kind of decent uptick in AST%.

Lou is down to near a career low. Basically cut his AST% in half.

Vasquez is down a few % points compared to last year (where he was slightly higher in Sacto)...but is far below what he put up in NOP.

DeMar's has dropped back down a bit after the solid season he had last year in that respect.

Ross is down a tiny bit. Amir is pretty much the same. Pat is up a tiny bit. Jonas' has gone down for the second year in a row. Even JJ has seen a near 7% drop in his AST%.

JV's is more due to his role in the offense.

Can't blame the dude for not passing when he never has the ball

[raptors999]

Lowry is the only one with any kind of decent uptick in AST%.

Lou is down to near a career low. Basically cut his AST% in half.

Vasquez is down a few % points compared to last year (where he was slightly higher in Sacto)...but is far below what he put up in NOP.

DeMar's has dropped back down a bit after the solid season he had last year in that respect.

Ross is down a tiny bit. Amir is pretty much the same. Pat is up a tiny bit. Jonas' has gone down for the second year in a row. Even JJ has seen a near 7% drop in his AST%.

Team doesn't pick and roll and it doesn't use the corner three. Assists will be bad because there is no reason to pass. This offence is retro 90s

[Jrice9]

Casey was hired for defence. Raptors could get better coaches if they wanted to score more.

Agreed but the question is, is his defense bad or it a problem with the players.

Keep in mind, that he's had good results defensively with this team and others in past years despite questionable talent.

However, with a banged up Amir, Demar (who has been good this year defensively and knows Casey's quick rotating system) being hurt alot and Ross's infuriating inconsistency and the addition of Lou Will vs Salmons (not stud either), it has made the situation impossible for him.

How many above average defensive talents do the Raptors have?

Amir and thats pretty much it (JJ has a good argument when he's disclipined and his minutes' usage is difficult to understand). Fields I guess also but he can't play due to other limitations and minutes issues.

How many below average defenders?

Greivis and Lou are pretty terrible, tired Lowry has not been good (But I do think it will improve with Demar back), Ross on his bad nights, JV (he's still not there yet), DeMar is probably about average now but obviously is nothing special on that end. Patterson can be hit or miss defensively.

Like which coach including Thibs is creating an elite defense here?

If Casey gets them into the top 12 (Which I think he can assuming health) that would be darn impressive

[raptors999]

Agreed but the question is, is his defense bad or it a problem with the players.

Keep in mind, that he's had good results defensively with this team and others in past years despite questionable talent.

However, with a banged up Amir, Demar (who has been good this year defensively and knows Casey's quick rotating system) being hurt alot and Ross's infuriating inconsistency and the addition of Lou Will vs Salmons (not stud either), it has made the situation impossible for him.

How many above average defensive talents do the Raptors have?

Amir and thats pretty much it (JJ has a good argument when he's disclipined and his minutes' usage is difficult to understand). Fields I guess also but he can't play due to other limitations and minutes issues.

How many below average defenders?

Greivis and Lou are pretty terrible, tired Lowry has not been good (But I do think it will improve with Demar back), Ross on his bad nights, JV (he's still not there yet), DeMar is probably about average now but obviously is nothing special on that end. Patterson can be hit or miss defensively.

Like which coach including Thibs is creating an elite defense here?

If Casey gets them into the top 12 (Which I think he can assuming health) that would be darn impressive

Regardless of players a lot of teams have managed to contain DJ Augustin to under 30 and don't routinely give up 30 pt quarters and greater than 50% shooting. Knicks are maybe the slowest team ever and they don't let guards torch them for 40

[Jrice9]

Regardless of players a lot of teams have managed to contain DJ Augustin to under 30 and don't routinely give up 30 pt quarters and greater than 50% shooting. Knicks are maybe the slowest team ever and they don't let guards torch them for 40

Why is it Casey's fault that neither of his guards can defend DJ Augustin?

Like what is he supposed to do there?

Also, the Raptors aren't the only playoff team with a spotty defense so far. Phoenix and Cleveland are the other obvious examples and Miami too.

Also, you have to consider the validity weighing 1 season of Casey's defense vs his career work and looking at the players he's had this season.

Also on a factual basis, the Raptors have yet to give up a 40+ game this season.

In fact, Augustin was a season high at 35 (which is tied for 51st in the league)

The Knicks had 4 games that had more points against for one player than Augustin (And another tie).

Portland also let 3 guards/forwards torch them for 40+ so its not like allowing guys to go off is only a Raptors thing (They had Gay, Harden and Curry all score 40+).


http://espn.go.com/nba/gameleaders/_/sort/points

[raptors999]

Why is it Casey's fault that neither of his guards can defend DJ Augustin?

Like what is he supposed to do there?

Also, the Raptors aren't the only playoff team with a spotty defense so far. Phoenix and Cleveland are the other obvious examples and Miami too.

Also, you have to consider the validity weighing 1 season of Casey's defense vs his career work and looking at the players he's had this season.

Also on a factual basis, the Raptors have yet to give up a 40+ game this season.

In fact, Augustin was a season high at 35 (which is tied for 51st in the league)

The Knicks had 4 games that had more points against for one player than Augustin (And another tie).

Portland also let 3 guards/forwards torch them for 40+ so its not like allowing guys to go off is only a Raptors thing (They had Gay, Harden and Curry all score 40+).


http://espn.go.com/nba/gameleaders/_/sort/points

None of the Suns or Miami are playoff teams. Miami is sub .500 and Suns will lose the spot to OKC. Cleveland shored up. GV vs DJ is Casey's fault just like TH vs Monroe.

[Jrice9]

None of the Suns or Miami are playoff teams. Miami is sub .500 and Suns will lose the spot to OKC. Cleveland shored up. GV vs DJ is Casey's fault just like TH vs Monroe.

Let's try to address these in order.

1, Both Phoenix and Miami are in the playoffs in the moment in the 8th in the West and 7th in the East respectively. Phoenix would be a top 6 East team without a doubt based on both record, talent and overall performance. So to call them a non-playoff team is wrong. They won 48 games last year and the West is even better this season (rise of New Orleans) and internal improvement of several teams. Writing them off is a mistake. And if Phoenix isn't a playoff team despite a playoff quality record, how is Miami not a playoff team because they will make the playoffs albeit with a 500 ish record. One of these teams is a "a playoff team"

2, Cleveland's defense in their last stretch isn't really better than the Raptors.

3, Who should be covering DJ? Lowry and Vasquez both were the primary guys. This makes sense, they are the two point guards.

4, And if Vasquez can't be trusted to guard a backup level point guard, he can't be trusted to guard anyone successfully?


5, TH vs Monroe was a relatively short stretch and Monroe was eating up everyone. Like at some point your players have to be play well defensively or not. Its not like he's starting Hansborough on Lebron or anything. These are reasonable matchup choices but the Raptors players (most of whom are league veterans) are not doing their jobs.

If your critique is that Vasquez shouldn't play as much because of defensive issues and James Johnson should play more, I agree with that criticism.

But its not like he's playing with a loaded deck of defensive players right now. Hopefully, we get some improvement from Ross (just cuz he should be better) and Lowry (who is pretty spent because of the Demarless role he played on offense) will stop loafing on perimeter defense.

[raptors999]

Let's try to address these in order.

1, Both Phoenix and Miami are in the playoffs in the moment in the 8th in the West and 7th in the East respectively. Phoenix would be a top 6 East team without a doubt based on both record, talent and overall performance. So to call them a non-playoff team is wrong. They won 48 games last year and the West is even better this season (rise of New Orleans) and internal improvement of several teams. Writing them off is a mistake. And if Phoenix isn't a playoff team despite a playoff quality record, how is Miami not a playoff team because they will make the playoffs albeit with a 500 ish record. One of these teams is a "a playoff team"

2, Cleveland's defense in their last stretch isn't really better than the Raptors.

3, Who should be covering DJ? Lowry and Vasquez both were the primary guys. This makes sense, they are the two point guards.

4, And if Vasquez can't be trusted to guard a backup level point guard, he can't be trusted to guard anyone successfully?


5, TH vs Monroe was a relatively short stretch and Monroe was eating up everyone. Like at some point your players have to be play well defensively or not. Its not like he's starting Hansborough on Lebron or anything. These are reasonable matchup choices but the Raptors players (most of whom are league veterans) are not doing their jobs.

If your critique is that Vasquez shouldn't play as much because of defensive issues and James Johnson should play more, I agree with that criticism.

But its not like he's playing with a loaded deck of defensive players right now. Hopefully, we get some improvement from Ross (just cuz he should be better) and Lowry (who is pretty spent because of the Demarless role he played on offense) will stop loafing on perimeter defense.

At the moment? BKN is a playoff team and they are dumping everyone. Raptors were a playoff team under Triano for awhile.
Being top 6 in the East conference doesn't help a team in the West. Sixer's would dominant the NCAA. Means nothing.

[raptors999]

Let's try to address these in order.

1, Both Phoenix and Miami are in the playoffs in the moment in the 8th in the West and 7th in the East respectively. Phoenix would be a top 6 East team without a doubt based on both record, talent and overall performance. So to call them a non-playoff team is wrong. They won 48 games last year and the West is even better this season (rise of New Orleans) and internal improvement of several teams. Writing them off is a mistake. And if Phoenix isn't a playoff team despite a playoff quality record, how is Miami not a playoff team because they will make the playoffs albeit with a 500 ish record. One of these teams is a "a playoff team"

2, Cleveland's defense in their last stretch isn't really better than the Raptors.

3, Who should be covering DJ? Lowry and Vasquez both were the primary guys. This makes sense, they are the two point guards.

4, And if Vasquez can't be trusted to guard a backup level point guard, he can't be trusted to guard anyone successfully?


5, TH vs Monroe was a relatively short stretch and Monroe was eating up everyone. Like at some point your players have to be play well defensively or not. Its not like he's starting Hansborough on Lebron or anything. These are reasonable matchup choices but the Raptors players (most of whom are league veterans) are not doing their jobs.

If your critique is that Vasquez shouldn't play as much because of defensive issues and James Johnson should play more, I agree with that criticism.

But its not like he's playing with a loaded deck of defensive players right now. Hopefully, we get some improvement from Ross (just cuz he should be better) and Lowry (who is pretty spent because of the Demarless role he played on offense) will stop loafing on perimeter defense.

5. GV can't. This his DJ on defense. Playing defense means avoiding things that can't work.