Everything Kawhi Leonard

[MixxAOR]

If Kawhi wins us the title he can do whatever he wants to. He can call Toronto a shithole for all I care.

[GOLDBLUM]

Gonna pull a TRex here.

(...or is it Mr.Wright now?)

I KNOW EVERYTHING.

KAWHI TAKES US TO THE FINALS IN 2019. WE LOSE. HE STAYS.

GLORIOUS DAYS ENSUE.

I KNOW EVERYTHING.

Again, to reiterate...

I KNOW EVERYTHING.

[Shaolin Fantastic]

Hell I will take winning the title and spending the next 5 years in the basement of the East if that is what is gonna take.

In second place: I will take reaching the finals and have Kawhi walk away if that is the price to pay.

I know it seems like it now, but I don't think getting to the finals, losing and then watching Kawhi walk would actually feel satisfying at all.

[planetmars]

So this can go multiple ways since Masai is a bit of an enigma. But the probable situations are:

1) Kawhi stays. Masai builds around Kawhi and we continue to be a top tier team in the East and in the league striving to get a ring.

2) Kawhi leaves. Masai goes into a full rebuild. All big contracts end in 2020 except for Powell. So Masai has a clean slate with guys like OG and Siakam to build around/with.

Option 1 would be amazing but unlikely. Even if you were an optimist you would think the chances aren't that great. Kawhi left the Spurs of all teams not the Kings or Knicks.

Option 2 would be intriguing for me. I'll be a Raps fan for life, and I don't care for losing.. but a rebuild under Masai's talents could be very interesting. I still think he's going to push all his chips forward for Giannis in 2021. But even then I could see Masai working his magic in the draft and with young prospects that he collects via trades.


The downside of the Kawhi trade is we lose three pretty nice assets any rebuilding team would want. A lotto pick who looks like a keeper in the league in Poeltl. A draft pick which even in the high 20's is like gold in the current NBA where every GM thinks they are smarter than everyone else. And DeMar who is a young, in his prime, 4 times all-star (2 time all-nba). DeMar has a big contract and has flaws.. but lots of teams hoping and praying for any kind of playoff appearance might take a chance..

For a rebuilding team we could have gotten a pick/prospect for DeMar. Maybe kept Poeltl or flipped for another pick. Or used our own pick to draft a guy like a Kuzma that we lost in the Serge deal a year ago. So these things hurt and make a rebuild tougher to get through.

If Kawhi leaves I will be bummed and probably hurt, but I can live with that pain. The game is about winning at the highest level and NBA history tells us that this is only really possible with a top 5 player. We have one now. So even if we rebuild and lose three nice assets to help us in that rebuild.. I still think it was worth it.

[golden]

Woj tweeted that Kawhi still wants to go to LA. Must've gotten a briefing from his team.

This was always going to be a massively uphill battle. He doesn't want to be in Toronto and wants to be in LA. That's the only reason we were even able to get him, because other teams weren't willing to move assets for a player who was 99.9% certain to leave.

Link? I get Woj's feed and I haven't seen anything like that today, or since he's been traded.

[Hotshot]

I know it seems like it now, but I don't think getting to the finals, losing and then watching Kawhi walk would actually feel satisfying at all.

It wouldn't but that's why Masai took the deal.

It would have been even less satisfying to get beaten by Boston in the East finals, which would have been almost a certainty with Derozan in the lineup (Tatum & Brown would have shut him down and do a better job than J.R Smith).

Now the Odds with Kawhi and the Raps beating Boston are more evenly split. If the goal of the franchise is to move forward than its a risk you need to take. You can't buy your time in this league for too long and time was running out for this franchise. The Celtics & 76'ers are two teams that currently have a better outlook in the next 2 years than the Raptors.

Also if Kawhi does not get us pass Boston than either he wasn't good enough or this team as a whole wasn't either which means big changes will be coming (core gone and a mini-rebuild ensues).

This season will answer many questions.

[MixxAOR]

I know it seems like it now, but I don't think getting to the finals, losing and then watching Kawhi walk would actually feel satisfying at all.

Then we start rebuilding and we'll watch young guys grow.

[LJ2]

So this can go multiple ways since Masai is a bit of an enigma. But the probable situations are:

1) Kawhi stays. Masai builds around Kawhi and we continue to be a top tier team in the East and in the league striving to get a ring.

2) Kawhi leaves. Masai goes into a full rebuild. All big contracts end in 2020 except for Powell. So Masai has a clean slate with guys like OG and Siakam to build around/with.

Option 1 would be amazing but unlikely. Even if you were an optimist you would think the chances aren't that great. Kawhi left the Spurs of all teams not the Kings or Knicks.

Option 2 would be intriguing for me. I'll be a Raps fan for life, and I don't care for losing.. but a rebuild under Masai's talents could be very interesting. I still think he's going to push all his chips forward for Giannis in 2021. But even then I could see Masai working his magic in the draft and with young prospects that he collects via trades.


The downside of the Kawhi trade is we lose three pretty nice assets any rebuilding team would want. A lotto pick who looks like a keeper in the league in Poeltl. A draft pick which even in the high 20's is like gold in the current NBA where every GM thinks they are smarter than everyone else. And DeMar who is a young, in his prime, 4 times all-star (2 time all-nba). DeMar has a big contract and has flaws.. but lots of teams hoping and praying for any kind of playoff appearance might take a chance..

For a rebuilding team we could have gotten a pick/prospect for DeMar. Maybe kept Poeltl or flipped for another pick. Or used our own pick to draft a guy like a Kuzma that we lost in the Serge deal a year ago. So these things hurt and make a rebuild tougher to get through.

If Kawhi leaves I will be bummed and probably hurt, but I can live with that pain. The game is about winning at the highest level and NBA history tells us that this is only really possible with a top 5 player. We have one now. So even if we rebuild and lose three nice assets to help us in that rebuild.. I still think it was worth it.

Don't forget option 3. If shit starts going sideways...like really bad, Ujiri may try to move Kawhi before the trade deadline. Very unlikely considering how hard it is to get a top 5 player, but you never know. If it does happen though I think it would have to be to a team in the East. Masai has a good relationship with the Spurs and would likely respect their wishes to keep Leonard in the East, even if it's just for the season.

[S.R.]

So this can go multiple ways since Masai is a bit of an enigma. But the probable situations are:

1) Kawhi stays. Masai builds around Kawhi and we continue to be a top tier team in the East and in the league striving to get a ring.

2) Kawhi leaves. Masai goes into a full rebuild. All big contracts end in 2020 except for Powell. So Masai has a clean slate with guys like OG and Siakam to build around/with.

Option 1 would be amazing but unlikely. Even if you were an optimist you would think the chances aren't that great. Kawhi left the Spurs of all teams not the Kings or Knicks.

Option 2 would be intriguing for me. I'll be a Raps fan for life, and I don't care for losing.. but a rebuild under Masai's talents could be very interesting. I still think he's going to push all his chips forward for Giannis in 2021. But even then I could see Masai working his magic in the draft and with young prospects that he collects via trades.


The downside of the Kawhi trade is we lose three pretty nice assets any rebuilding team would want. A lotto pick who looks like a keeper in the league in Poeltl. A draft pick which even in the high 20's is like gold in the current NBA where every GM thinks they are smarter than everyone else. And DeMar who is a young, in his prime, 4 times all-star (2 time all-nba). DeMar has a big contract and has flaws.. but lots of teams hoping and praying for any kind of playoff appearance might take a chance..

For a rebuilding team we could have gotten a pick/prospect for DeMar. Maybe kept Poeltl or flipped for another pick. Or used our own pick to draft a guy like a Kuzma that we lost in the Serge deal a year ago. So these things hurt and make a rebuild tougher to get through.

If Kawhi leaves I will be bummed and probably hurt, but I can live with that pain. The game is about winning at the highest level and NBA history tells us that this is only really possible with a top 5 player. We have one now. So even if we rebuild and lose three nice assets to help us in that rebuild.. I still think it was worth it.

What are the odds there's an option 3 where some of the young talent here is too good to really tank (at least in the opinion of management) and the team retools on the fly through trades and FA?

[golden]

I know it seems like it now, but I don't think getting to the finals, losing and then watching Kawhi walk would actually feel satisfying at all.

A lot depends on "how" you lose. If we take the Warriors to 6 or 7 hard-fought games, then Kawhi's gonna think twice about leaving vs. staying to complete unfinished business. If we get swept out hard, then we've got the same problem as any other team in the NBA vs. the Warriors, so it feels like legitimate closure to this era and the perfect time to rebuild and wait it out until GS declines. No need to keep Kawhi around for that, and thankfully DeMar's contract is off the books. Lowry and Ibaka will be shopped hard for whatever you can get.

The reason Derozan and Casey were shipped out of here wasn't just because they lost to Lebron, it was "how" they lost. The fact that the Pacers and the undermanned Celtics put up a much better fight than us, was a deciding factor, I'm sure; especially since we were the consensus favorites for the first time ever. In fact, 3 out of the last 4 playoff years ended in embarassing sweeps, if you count the Wizards debacle.

[LJ2]

A lot depends on "how" you lose. If we take the Warriors to 6 or 7 hard-fought games, then Kawhi's gonna think twice about leaving vs. staying to complete unfinished business. If we get swept out hard, then we've got the same problem as any other team in the NBA vs. the Warriors, so it feels like legitimate closure to this era and the perfect time to rebuild and wait it out until GS declines. No need to keep Kawhi around for that, and thankfully DeMar's contract is off the books. Lowry and Ibaka will be shopped hard for whatever you can get.

The reason Derozan and Casey were shipped out of here wasn't just because they lost to Lebron, it was "how" they lost. The fact that the Pacers and the undermanned Celtics put up a much better fight than us, was a deciding factor, I'm sure; especially since we were the consensus favorites for the first time ever. In fact, 3 out of the last 4 playoff years ended in embarassing sweeps, if you count the Wizards debacle.

Do you really think that winning or losing is a deciding factor for Kawhi? I mean this guy left the Spurs who were always in the mix when healthy.

[KeonClark]

What are the odds there's an option 3 where some of the young talent here is too good to really tank (at least in the opinion of management) and the team retools on the fly through trades and FA?

This is the option nobody here seems to see possible but I've been saying rebuild isnt automatically inevitable for over a year now.

Just like nobody saw any way to get a superstar without tanking. Huh.

Pro sports are so unpredictable. Masai seems like the type to DETEST losing in purpose. I highly doubt the next 5 years hinges solely on Kawhi, and this man has tricks up sleeves you didnt even know he had

[golden]

Do you really think that winning or losing is a deciding factor for Kawhi? I mean this guy left the Spurs who were always in the mix when healthy.

Spurs in the mix for what? After Timmy D retired, it's been 2nd round exits at best. TBH, RC Buford hasn't really done anything good with that team since they drafted Kawhi. If not for Pop being able to make chicken salad out of chicken s***, Buford would be taking more heat for stockpiling these anti-modern NBA players like Aldridge, Gay and Gasol.

But the Kawhi leaving the Spurs has nothing to do with winning and losing. Everything to do with loss of trust on both sides. And maybe Uncle Dennis' hidden (but mis-guided) agenda that Kawhi will makes 100's of millions in endorsements if he goes to L.A. Ain't gonna happen with that personality.

[Hotshot]

Do you really think that winning or losing is a deciding factor for Kawhi? I mean this guy left the Spurs who were always in the mix when healthy.

The biggest factor: A place where he is comfortable at playing and living. Spurs got taken out of the equation because it no longer felt comfortable playing and living there. Obviously the living part isn't going to be better then the comfort of home but maybe we can make the playing part more comfortable & attractive than being Lebron's bitch/media spotlight with The Lakers or a losing organization/media spotlight that will probably miss the playoffs with Clippers.

[KeonClark]

Friendly reminder: amidst all the new angst and anxiety over what will happen a year from now, please remember the Raptors have their first ever superstar guaranteed for this year, and try to actually enjoy the games in front of you!