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  • #16
    Correctly or not, I have been of the opinion that Bargnani, because of cultural or his own personality or even the Euro system that he was in so long, was reticent about doing anything that smelled of usurping or upstaging all those senior to him on the team. This at the minimum would have included Bosh and Calderon. Team play and behaviour is of great importance in Euro sports and I think this has contributed to his play sometimes. btw, I also think he has been a lazy bitch sometimes.

    Now, with the v. real possibility of Bosh leaving, it will be real check time to determine if these "excuses" held any truth. So I look forward to having Bargs just play with passion and ballhog if necessary on both offense and defense. There shall be nothing else to hide behind. Of his talents there is no doubt. Just play...and dont roam except on set plays. A month (maybe 2 weeks) in I think we'll all know if he is ready to show if he has the "it" or at least some of the "it" to build upon.

    I also hope the coaching staff can define his role clearly (to play inside mostly) and hold him to it. If all this doesnt work BC has to bite the bullet ...again ...and relatively quickly so the team's growth not lose momentum.
    Last edited by Bendit; Sat Jun 26th, 2010, 06:44 PM.

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    • #17
      jeff_hostetler wrote: View Post
      To me, much of the Raps future with the core as it is depends on chemistry to create that value-added, or 2+2=5 kinda deal. If Derozan, Weems, Johnson and Bargnani can not only get comfortable playing with each other, but really enjoy it, then there are a lot of complimentary skills that this core posses that can really add up to make the team play a lot better on the court than they look like on paper. Essentially, the reverse of what we've been hearing the last few years about how "on paper, this is a 50 win team."

      Add Davis to the mix and we get a frontcourt axis that can grow to be dominant in the not too distant future. How this all goes down for success in the Bargnani-era is a getting a scoring 3 and a defensive and distributive point who can knock down the open J and who really understands the game of basketball. Spreading it around, playing as a team, and being built collectively around individual strengths and weaknesses is how the "Bargnani-era" should look. In this scenario there are no true #1 options, but 3-4 players who can go off a rack up the points in a given game, the rest understanding the flow of the game and playing their role, all with an eye for defense.
      So true. The best teams all have players that play beyond their value "on paper": Fisher with the Lakers, or Rondo and Perkins with the Celtics. It's not realistic under the salary cap rules to go out and get an All-NBA player at each and every position.

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      • #18
        LBF wrote: View Post
        it seems right to hand him the "franchise" tag, out of well obviousness as who else could we give it to? not saying he is the bosh type franchise player, but maybe he'll turn out to be.
        No, it doesn't seem right to hand him the "franchise" tag just because there's nobody else at the moment. If he wants it, he has to earn it. You don't make someone your "franchise" player just because he might grow into it. This is no different from when we felt Damon Stoudamire was our franchise player; when we traded him away, we didn't select the next best player to take over the mantle. Instead, we left a void there until Carter showed he could be the man.

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        • #19
          Third or fourth option offensively + a major defensive liability + a large liability on the backboards
          nbaroundtable

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          • #20
            LBF wrote: View Post
            i have3 the same thoughts as you but also remember there will always be one guy who outshines all others and so to speak "leads" the team like with detroit they had a lot of good players, but, chauncey billups was their leader, as seen when he was traded.

            you could also look at that washington team, butler, jamison, arenas. even thought they never one anything they had 3 real good players on their team but arenas outshined them all and was the leader.

            the same thing i believe can be done with toronto maybe with bargnani outshining all others. the reason we couldn't do it with bosh is because he would get jealous. with bargnani i doubt he cares thus i think getting rid of bosh will help us to take that step forward.
            No doubt the Raptors will need a leader and anyone who has seen Bargnani play over the past couple years should realize he aint it. In terms of body language to his personality he's a follower, not a leader. And there's nothing wrong with that. Somebody else just needs to eventually step up and fill that role whether he be on the team now or later. DeRozan led USC well into the tourney in his one season in the NCAA. If he translates his skills and abilities to the NBA on a high level he can lead the Raptors. I am sure of this. The production just needs to be there first. Unless the Raptors land a strong, dominate individual in the off-season, you're looking at a headless lotto team for at least one season. If they land this person you're probably still looking at a lotto team this season.
            Last edited by Apollo; Sat Jun 26th, 2010, 09:25 PM.

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            • #21
              I'm undecided on this issue.
























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              • #22
                LBF wrote: View Post
                i don't understand why you are still sticking up for Rupaul!? you are completely missing the point and arguing just for the sake of arguing.

                Now before your panties crawl any further up your ass let me explain. All i'm saying is if everything left in the artcle plays out bargnani is the player who has been with the raps the longest.

                it seems right to hand him the "franchise" tag, out of well obviousness as who else could we give it to? not saying he is the bosh type franchise player, but maybe he'll turn out to be.

                it'll be like okc where all those guys play their asses off but it's centred around one guy that earns his way and sticks out. in that case it's kevin durant who it will be for the raptors remains to be seen but it looks like it'll be bargnani before anybody else.

                I don't know how to explain it really. but, i'm not arguing with you. i hope this helps.
                All I am saying is that Bargnani is a 3rd option at best on offence (until he at least as the ability to create his own shot). I am not looking to argue with I just read your post and replied to it, I see your point that there is no one else to take that mantle from Bargs but still him being our "franchise player" is a pretty depressing thing

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                • #23
                  Dave wrote: View Post
                  Third or fourth option offensively + a major defensive liability + a large liability on the backboards
                  I agree completely with you Dave, Bargnani being a starter is at times for this team a negative.

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                  • #24
                    Apollo wrote: View Post
                    Unless the Raptors land a strong, dominate individual in the off-season, you're looking at a headless lotto team for at least one season. If they land this person you're probably still looking at a lotto team this season.
                    Couldn't agree more.

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                    • #25
                      1st option, 2nd option, 3rd option....blah blah... Every player is an option in the right game plan. Basketball is a team sport. If you have enough talent (TOR had tons of them) and a good coach, you can beat any team in this league.

                      Link: TOR-CLE Feb 26th TOR-without Bosh

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                      • #26
                        Vellassco wrote: View Post
                        1st option, 2nd option, 3rd option....blah blah... Every player is an option in the right game plan. Basketball is a team sport. If you have enough talent (TOR had tons of them) and a good coach, you can beat any team in this league.

                        Link: TOR-CLE Feb 26th TOR-without Bosh
                        Yea but we don't have that much talent next year without Bosh and on the defence side we already were the worst team in the league. Triano better start perfecting the Xs and Os because we have nobody on this team next year who could create their offense.

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                        • #27
                          What's Andrea Bargnani been up to ?

                          Hey RR peeps,
                          Now that Bosh is out and we officially usher in the Andrea Bargnani era, anyone out there heard of what our new franchise player have been up to ? what he's doing to get himself prepared for being the number 1 option next season? perhaps hitting the weight room or developing a post game back in Italy?

                          *we all know the young gunz are working out and getting ready for the 10/11 season, I just thought its weird we haven't heard anything from Barg, so if anyone have some info that would be awesome.

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                          • #28
                            Do not call him that. We don't have a franchise player and we haven't started any era yet except post-Bosh.

                            But yeah, he should be working on a second post move and hopefully they have someone drilling into his head the merits of weakside defense.
                            Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                            • #29
                              last from what i heard he was back in italy, but regardless hes got a lot of improvement to do in a short amount of time if hes now gonna be their go-to guy for us (anyone wet themself when they say that???)

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                              • #30
                                We havent had a franchise player since vince carter.

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