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  • GLF
    replied
    And the other thing is we saw that the all bench unit doesn't work in the playoffs because teams just keep at least 1-2 starters in the game at all times. So I don't even know if its that important to have a good all bench lineup. We just need to use guys better aka Fred and have more transitional lineups where 1-2 starters are in the game at all times aka one or 2 of Pascal, Kawhi or Kyle. Also try to keep Pascal and Serge and JV and OG together as much as possible. But i know Nurse wants everyone to be comfortable playing with everyone so we probably won't see that stay set too much.

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  • GLF
    replied
    I'm with everyone, trading JV for a guy like Tristan doesn't make sense and doesn't make us better. Tristan actually isn't that good of a pnr defender anyway. Maybe slightly better than JV but not enough to make up for all the things JV is better than Tristan at. Also as people said, we purposely (I say purposely because all our big men do it) have JV sagging way back in the pnr because I think anyone who knows anything about basketball knows that the midrange shot is the worst shot in the game. I give that up any day if it means making it easier for JV to protect the paint. If teams have to win by hitting that shot at an elite level the entire game I'll take my chances. Now if its Durant taking those shots it's different but we won't have to worry about that until we get to the finals.

    I think the only way we can improve our bench is to stop letting Fred be the primary ball handler. I don't know how long it's gonna take for Nurse to see that but I'm hoping he at least figures it out by the playoffs or Fred actually improves as the primary ball handler (which I doubt). He's dribbling the air out the ball too much and he is terrible at using our big men in the pnr. Delon is at least better at it, not by much but still better. I think it's Fred's height that is causing this issue more than anything else. He just can't see over the defence which causes him to not make that pass to the rolling big man. Delon can see over the defence much better and if a better finisher when he gets into the paint. He's also more crafty at getting there and doesn't get blocked as easily. Now if Nurse doesn't stop the whole Fred being the primary ball handler thing I don't think much will change to be honest.

    Yes we can take Pascal out earlier to play with the bench (because I do feel it's only fair to him to have him starting. He's playing too well and worked too hard. It would look bad if we have him coming off the bench just because the bench is struggling) and take Kawhi or Kyle out earlier so they can play with the bench as well but if Fred is still dominating the ball with those guys in the game it's not going to make any difference. And we've seen this season that even with one of those 3 guys plays with the bench it's the same old shit because instead of letting Pascal, or Kawhi or Kyle handle the ball more we STILL have Fred dominating the ball for god knows what reason. Smh. Losing Jakob definitely is a reason as well but I still think Fred is the biggest issue. That's just my take on the situation.

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  • inthepaint
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post
    Yeah, I think it's more about finding transition lineups to fill in around our incredible starting lineup, than trying to re-create the magic of the 5-man 'bench mob'. The goal now should be to simply find transition lineups that bleed the least that also gives our starters max minutes together and enough rest for the end of game push.

    One change could be instead of swapping OG for Pascal at PF, we take Kawhi out earlier and sub in OG at SF, so Kawhi can prop up the bench units (FVV & Wright). Another change could putting Serge & JV back together in limited minutes, but only against other bench lineups when Pascal is resting and Serge subs back in at PF.

    At this point, I'm pretty sure that the hockey lineups innovation was Nurse's idea but he needs to let that one go.
    I agree with this. It summarizes well what I think it should be the overall goal of the rotation this year. It also feels like it would be the most effective in the playoffs.

    Just out of curiosity, Does anyone know the average time (minutes) the same lineup stays on the floor together continuously in the NBA? (in other words, how long of a stretch the same fivesome stay together before a sub comes in)?

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  • A.I
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    Yep JV is like a clutch relief pitcher...he's been the single biggest reason for winning at least one game in every playoffs we've had. And if people haven't noticed we're 20-4, so I don't think his defense has been killing our regular season progress too badly.

    Guess we just need something to talk about
    Can’t be a Raptors fanbase without complaining about something.

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  • golden
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    Yep JV is like a clutch relief pitcher...he's been the single biggest reason for winning at least one game in every playoffs we've had. And if people haven't noticed we're 20-4, so I don't think his defense has been killing our regular season progress too badly.

    Guess we just need something to talk about
    First World problems.

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  • KeonClark
    replied
    slaw wrote: View Post
    I'm sorta of the view that you play JV and if teams are successful in attacking him in screen-and-roll you can take him out if it becomes a massive liability. If not, he's basically always a plus on the offensive end.

    Raps have lots of ways to match up in the playoffs and that may mean less JV but trading him outright seems like a massive overreaction, unless the return is simply to good to pass up (and that doesn't mean Tristan Thomson).
    Yep JV is like a clutch relief pitcher...he's been the single biggest reason for winning at least one game in every playoffs we've had. And if people haven't noticed we're 20-4, so I don't think his defense has been killing our regular season progress too badly.

    Guess we just need something to talk about

    Leave a comment:


  • slaw
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    I dont see the need to trade JV hes putting up literally record numbers for under 20 minutes. How many guys out there are naturally 20 pt 12 rebound guys but are always in a good mood even though they're relegated to 8th in minutes?

    Jvs random absolute bursts of scoring have proven huge time and time again in the playoffs. Hes a top 3 scorer on the team who improves in may. Thompson may be slightly better in pick and roll but will still he relegated well behind Ibaka and siakam at crunch time 5 anyways
    I'm sorta of the view that you play JV and if teams are successful in attacking him in screen-and-roll you can take him out if it becomes a massive liability. If not, he's basically always a plus on the offensive end.

    Raps have lots of ways to match up in the playoffs and that may mean less JV but trading him outright seems like a massive overreaction, unless the return is simply to good to pass up (and that doesn't mean Tristan Thomson).

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  • golden
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    Careful, you're gonna summon Christ1an from his hibernation
    I'm guessing that he spends a lot of time over at the Spurs blogs and forums. Especially this one....

    https://www.poundingtherock.com/

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  • KeonClark
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post
    Is Domascas Montyjonas still available?
    Careful, you're gonna summon Christ1an from his hibernation

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  • white men can't jump
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post
    No. You're not swapping out JV for TT for rebounding. It's to guard opposition PnR and generally, in space.
    This is not a good reason. JV gives up midrange jumpers and floaters because of how far back he sags. It is also something that is partly due to how frequently he'd left with no good help trying to defend the p'n'r (ie someone like DeMar getting obliterated on a screen leaving that as the only option left to JV to have a chance to defend either guy at the rim).

    It is not something to worry about. Wall was hitting those shots at a career high level in our series against them with JV on the court...and we easily won all of JV's minutes in that series. If guys have to knock down the worst shot in the game at a super high level consistently to even have a chance at winning, you'll take that. And you can work on having JV closing the gap as the season goes on.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

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  • golden
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    I dont see the need to trade JV hes putting up literally record numbers for under 20 minutes. How many guys out there are naturally 20 pt 12 rebound guys but are always in a good mood even though they're relegated to 8th in minutes?

    Jvs random absolute bursts of scoring have proven huge time and time again in the playoffs. Hes a top 3 scorer on the team who improves in may. Thompson may be slightly better in pick and roll but will still he relegated well behind Ibaka and siakam at crunch time 5 anyways
    Is Domascas Montyjonas still available?

    Leave a comment:


  • KeonClark
    replied
    I dont see the need to trade JV hes putting up literally record numbers for under 20 minutes. How many guys out there are naturally 20 pt 12 rebound guys but are always in a good mood even though they're relegated to 8th in minutes?

    Jvs random absolute bursts of scoring have proven huge time and time again in the playoffs. Hes a top 3 scorer on the team who improves in may. Thompson may be slightly better in pick and roll but will still he relegated well behind Ibaka and siakam at crunch time 5 anyways

    Leave a comment:


  • golden
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post
    Is tristan good at that? Cause he wasnt getting any 4th quarter minutes when the Cavs were good
    TT definitely fell out of favor in the regular season last year, but he came back strong in the playoffs. I've never been a huge fan, but the issue here is the best way to utilize JV if other teams are going to attack him on D when he's with the bench. Some are suggesting promoting him back to the starting lineup and moving Ibaka to the bench. Others are suggesting a trade, but we still need a big body to go against Embiid and Cousins. It's an interesting discussion.

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  • KeonClark
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post
    No. You're not swapping out JV for TT for rebounding. It's to guard opposition PnR and generally, in space.
    Is tristan good at that? Cause he wasnt getting any 4th quarter minutes when the Cavs were good

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  • golden
    replied
    Yuri Gagarin wrote: View Post
    Oh i thought his def rebounding was better too my bad
    No. You're not swapping out JV for TT for rebounding. It's to guard opposition PnR and generally, in space.

    Leave a comment:

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