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  • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    So we just sign Powell to an extension. You don't think JV will be shopped again to clear cap space? Your leading your love for JV cloud your judgement.

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
    Call me crazy, but management seems to have put a 3 year window on this team, having made an effort to sign Lowry and Ibaka to 3 year deals, and DD currently having 3 years left. With that in mind, doesn't it make sense that they would make the decision to go over the cap at least one of those three years with good showing? If the team plays well, does well in playoffs and all the guys who are getting paid are good, I don't see why someone has to get traded literally just to avoid a tax bill. Excitement and a playoff run definitely make up for the tax expense. Also if they want to cut money and JV is really contributing, I feel like they should trade Miles, although it makes the wingsweak
    Last edited by DogeLover1234; Tue Oct 10th, 2017, 02:24 PM.

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    • KeonClark wrote: View Post
      I believe he will be shopped, and dealt only if the team gets a piece to help improve, not just guaranteed dumped for cap space which you indicate. Pretty big difference there.

      I also believe if OG proves he can shoot and play meaningful minutes than cj miles is the piece to go for payroll purposes, he's basically a stop gap/insurance policy for our current question mark at the 3 spot
      You don't think Masai is looking to do just that? He's invested heavily in this core, but he can't believe for a minute that the Raptors can beat the Cav's. JV is a good player, but I don't think anyone here thinks he's a core member taking into consideration the fit with the rest of the starters. He has value, and is on a good contract which makes him the best option to trade for Masai's final "all in" move. Though he does have a 3 year window to work with.

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      • DogeLover1234 wrote: View Post
        Call me crazy, but management seems to have put a 3 year window on this team, having made an effort to sign Lowry and Ibaka to 3 year deals, and DD currently having 3 years left. With that in mind, doesn't it make sense that they would make the decision to go over the cap at least one of those three years with good showing? If the team plays well, does well in playoffs and all the guys who are getting paid are good, I don't see why someone has to get traded literally just to avoid a tax bill. Excitement and a playoff run definitely make up for the tax expense.
        I only see that happening if we take the Cavs to at least 7 games. We just don't have the talent for that. Cavs are better than last year IMO. I can talk myself to 6 games but, not 7.

        Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
        @Chr1st1anL

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        • LJ2 wrote: View Post
          You don't think Masai is looking to do just that? He's invested heavily in this core, but he can't believe for a minute that the Raptors can beat the Cav's. JV is a good player, but I don't think anyone here thinks he's a core member taking into consideration the fit with the rest of the starters. He has value, and is on a good contract which makes him the best option to trade for Masai's final "all in" move. Though he does have a 3 year window to work with.
          Ahh finally some objectivity. Very much appreciated.

          Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
          @Chr1st1anL

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          • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
            Ahh finally some objectivity. Very much appreciated.

            Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
            "agrees with me = objective

            doesn't = biased"

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            • LJ2 wrote: View Post
              You don't think Masai is looking to do just that? He's invested heavily in this core, but he can't believe for a minute that the Raptors can beat the Cav's. JV is a good player, but I don't think anyone here thinks he's a core member taking into consideration the fit with the rest of the starters. He has value, and is on a good contract which makes him the best option to trade for Masai's final "all in" move. Though he does have a 3 year window to work with.
              I think JV actually fits far better with the core than many suggest around here, and his game is key to the team's success right now.

              I also think that JV's contract (assuming he opts in) being the same length as DeRozan's (assuming DD opts out), Lowry's and Ibaka's is no coincidence, and Masai fully intended to have JV along for the ride if they could afford it. I also think most of the salary cap maneuvering they did and attempted to do this past spring had a lot to do with them expecting Powell to get a godfather RFA offer. Him signing for cheap lets them keep the team together for a reasonable price tag without shedding any more talent.
              twitter.com/dhackett1565

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              • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                I only see that happening if we take the Cavs to at least 7 games. We just don't have the talent for that. Cavs are better than last year IMO. I can talk myself to 6 games but, not 7.

                Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                I really don't understand why that is the threshold. They just signed two aging vets to massive contracts, when Raps pretty obviously are in the second tier of Eastern Conference teams, after getting swept in the second round putting the team right at the tax line but suddenly they have to become a contender to keep a guy who is entering him prime on a decent contract. lets not forget my original premise was that JV plays better than past seasons in a new role based on how he has been hyped up. If he isn't helpful by all means try to trade him.

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                • DanH wrote: View Post
                  I think JV actually fits far better with the core than many suggest around here, and his game is key to the team's success right now.

                  I also think that JV's contract (assuming he opts in) being the same length as DeRozan's (assuming DD opts out), Lowry's and Ibaka's is no coincidence, and Masai fully intended to have JV along for the ride if they could afford it. I also think most of the salary cap maneuvering they did and attempted to do this past spring had a lot to do with them expecting Powell to get a godfather RFA offer. Him signing for cheap lets them keep the team together for a reasonable price tag without shedding any more talent.
                  We have been a 50 win team with JV for the past few years. He's a good player and we are good with him. The point remains we are not within striking distance of the Cav's and JV fits the least with the type of offence the Raptors hope to run, among the starters (Miles has little in the way of value that could improve this team). Unless MU is fine with being a distant second to the Cav's until LBJ is out of the equation then changes have to be made.

                  I don't doubt we have a great shot at being the 2nd seed in the east with JV.

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                  • LJ2 wrote: View Post
                    We have been a 50 win team with JV for the past few years. He's a good player and we are good with him. The point remains we are not within striking distance of the Cav's and JV fits the least with the type of offence the Raptors hope to run, among the starters (Miles has little in the way of value that could improve this team). Unless MU is fine with being a distant second to the Cav's until LBJ is out of the equation then changes have to be made.

                    I don't doubt we have a great shot at being the 2nd seed in the east with JV.
                    There is no move to get above CLE while LBJ is there. Our greatest hope is for an unexpected leap from a young player (like Norm, or... JV), or of course for LBJ to move on.

                    If there is a move to get past him, it's not a question of fit, but of additional star power. In which case, if Ujiri wants to take that chance, you trade whoever you have to to make that happen. But such an opportunity is extremely unlikely to even occur, with the relative dearth of extra assets the Raptors could trade.

                    I restate my opinion: JV fits very well with the style of offence the team wants to run, and his role within it is significantly understated by many.

                    The reality is, Ujiri is already all in. Ibaka was the power move, getting a borderline star PF to go with the core that has had so much success without one. There's likely no additional move to be made, except perhaps a role player rental. The hope now lies in the players we have.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                    • We're set up to avoid the tax this year. Lebron is likely to leave Cleveland after this year. Seems like we have a pretty wide open contention window opening in the near future, no?

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                      • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
                        We're set up to avoid the tax this year. Lebron is likely to leave Cleveland after this year. Seems like we have a pretty wide open contention window opening in the near future, no?
                        That could very well be the case, and if so then great foresight by Ujiri. Just doesn't seem like a very proactive strategy to wait for the chips to fall your way.

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                        • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
                          We're set up to avoid the tax this year. Lebron is likely to leave Cleveland after this year. Seems like we have a pretty wide open contention window opening in the near future, no?
                          **contention for eastern conference champion

                          In 10 years, nobody except the most hardcore of fans remembers the runner up.
                          It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                          • LJ2 wrote: View Post
                            That could very well be the case, and if so then great foresight by Ujiri. Just doesn't seem like a very proactive strategy to wait for the chips to fall your way.
                            Trading for Ibaka like 8 months ago is pretty pro-active, no? I think this team deserves a chance to play together a little before we declare them insufficient, considering the success the team has had with boat anchors at PF the past few years.
                            twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                            • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                              **contention for eastern conference champion

                              In 10 years, nobody except the most hardcore of fans remembers the runner up.
                              Aren't the hardcore like us the ones that really matter?

                              And a lot of casual fans remember Vince almost hitting that monumental shot...that would have advanced them to the ECF.

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                              • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
                                Aren't the hardcore like us the ones that really matter?

                                And a lot of casual fans remember Vince almost hitting that monumental shot...that would have advanced them to the ECF.
                                not really. we're gonna watch the games no matter what.

                                making big $$$ is about keeping the fairweather fans engaged.


                                That being said if the raptors are really knocking on the door, people will be paying attention even if they don't win.

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