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  • Letter N wrote: View Post
    I've been reading constantly that we should get JV the ball inside more but I disagree. And don't take this as an anti-JV post, because he plays great ball, but I just don't see where people get this idea that we can dump it to him down low and watch him wreck shop like he's Shaq.

    He's not very good at actual post moves, he doesn't receive the ball well on passes in the low post with his back to the basket, he doesn't demand a double team and in the rare times he does he's not the Marc Gasol type passer who finds the open man in those situations.

    JV's strengths are in the pick and roll and positioning to get points on scramble plays or offensive boards.

    His shooting percentage and efficiency is so high because that's how he gets his points, you start feeding him the ball and his shooting percentage will drop and his turnovers will drastically rise.

    Love the kid but in the post he's got 2 moves and a jump shot using only his arms that he's scared to take in the playoffs. The way he's being used now is how he's supposed to be used.
    Totally agree. Jonas is nowhere near polished enough offensively to be able to consistently run ISO post ups for....unless he's got a clear mismatch.

    His hands, his defensive reads, and his repertoire of moves all need work before he comes that type of post player.

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    • Letter N wrote: View Post
      I've been reading constantly that we should get JV the ball inside more but I disagree. And don't take this as an anti-JV post, because he plays great ball, but I just don't see where people get this idea that we can dump it to him down low and watch him wreck shop like he's Shaq.

      He's not very good at actual post moves, he doesn't receive the ball well on passes in the low post with his back to the basket, he doesn't demand a double team and in the rare times he does he's not the Marc Gasol type passer who finds the open man in those situations.

      JV's strengths are in the pick and roll and positioning to get points on scramble plays or offensive boards.

      His shooting percentage and efficiency is so high because that's how he gets his points, you start feeding him the ball and his shooting percentage will drop and his turnovers will drastically rise.

      Love the kid but in the post he's got 2 moves and a jump shot using only his arms that he's scared to take in the playoffs. The way he's being used now is how he's supposed to be used.
      I vehemently disagree.

      Yes he's at his best when he's in the PnR, or grabbing offensive boards but I would be willing to bet that his "2 moves and a jump shot using only his arms that he's scared to take" would still be a far more effective scoring option than what we consider our elite scorers.

      His two moves are very strong moves. He's improved his footwork and it doesn't matter who's guarding him at this point he almost always gets a good look off.

      He has great hands and catches passes he has no business catching. Our guards are horrific post feeders. They hardly throw decent lobs most of the time.

      Not sure where he isn't a passer comes from, almost every opportunity he's given to make a play he does. He makes passes to cutting guards a whole lot tougher than it is to feed him while completely open under the basket.

      I just don't agree with anything in this post

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      • Letter N wrote: View Post
        I've been reading constantly that we should get JV the ball inside more but I disagree. And don't take this as an anti-JV post, because he plays great ball, but I just don't see where people get this idea that we can dump it to him down low and watch him wreck shop like he's Shaq.

        He's not very good at actual post moves, he doesn't receive the ball well on passes in the low post with his back to the basket, he doesn't demand a double team and in the rare times he does he's not the Marc Gasol type passer who finds the open man in those situations.

        JV's strengths are in the pick and roll and positioning to get points on scramble plays or offensive boards.

        His shooting percentage and efficiency is so high because that's how he gets his points, you start feeding him the ball and his shooting percentage will drop and his turnovers will drastically rise.

        Love the kid but in the post he's got 2 moves and a jump shot using only his arms that he's scared to take in the playoffs. The way he's being used now is how he's supposed to be used.
        Oh noes, he's not shaquille o'neal or marc gasol! better not ever pass it to him in the post.

        by the way, "doesn't receive the ball well" is way more an indictment of our guards than our bigs.

        I agree, he is most effective as the roll man and as an offensive rebounder. The more we can get him the ball on the move when he's cutting through the paint, the better.

        but he is becoming very effective as a post player as well. He's a better option at this point than Lowry or Demar taking a dumbass iso jumpshit.

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        • KHD wrote: View Post
          but he is becoming very effective as a post player as well. He's a better option at this point than Lowry or Demar taking a dumbass iso jumpshit.
          This, I agree with.

          Comment


          • Shaq was not good in the post because of his plethora of post moves. It was back yu down and dunk/baby hook, or baseline spin where he got away with a hook like 35% of the time.

            Being physically difficult to stop and having a good touch is most of what scoring in the post is about. Not everyone can be Hakeem.

            Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

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            • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
              Shaq was not good in the post because of his plethora of post moves. It was back yu down and dunk/baby hook, or baseline spin where he got away with a hook like 35% of the time.

              Being physically difficult to stop and having a good touch is most of what scoring in the post is about. Not everyone can be Hakeem.

              Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
              Shaq, at least in his prime, had the rare combination of superhuman strength, and sprinter-like explosiveness. Jonas is considerably slower.

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              • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                Shaq, at least in his prime, had the rare combination of superhuman strength, and sprinter-like explosiveness. Jonas is considerably slower.
                Yes Shaq was a true freak. Maybe the freakiest combination of physical tools we'll ever see. Point stands about the moves though.

                And slower is the wrong word. The first word you used, explosiveness, is more apt.

                Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

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                • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                  Shaq, at least in his prime, had the rare combination of superhuman strength, and sprinter-like explosiveness. Jonas is considerably slower.
                  Honestly; Shaq really doesn't get enough credit for how monstrous he was.
                  "My biggest concern as a coach is to not confuse winning with progress." - Steve Kerr
                  "If it's unacceptable in defeat, it's unacceptable in victory." - Jeff Van Gundy

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                  • KHD wrote: View Post
                    Oh noes, he's not shaquille o'neal or marc gasol! better not ever pass it to him in the post.

                    by the way, "doesn't receive the ball well" is way more an indictment of our guards than our bigs.

                    I agree, he is most effective as the roll man and as an offensive rebounder. The more we can get him the ball on the move when he's cutting through the paint, the better.

                    but he is becoming very effective as a post player as well. He's a better option at this point than Lowry or Demar taking a dumbass iso jumpshit.
                    This. When you have an advantage, you ride it until the other team adjusts. But that's not what the Raptors do. They routinely default to the worst version of themselves whenever they feel pressured or threatened. That they got away playing this way against the Pacers has only emboldened those who find nothing wrong with this approach. I generally loathe Stephen A. Smith, but even he pointed out on First Take today how questionable it was that the Raptors went away from Valanciunas attacking Whiteside given Hassan's well-documented history of getting frustrated when he has to play post defense as opposed to being a terrifying help defender that swats everything. We have an advantage there, but threw it away late. I wonder what Raptor film sessions must be like. I really do.

                    Comment


                    • Sinbad wrote: View Post
                      This. When you have an advantage, you ride it until the other team adjusts. But that's not what the Raptors do. They routinely default to the worst version of themselves whenever they feel pressured or threatened. That they got away playing this way against the Pacers has only emboldened those who find nothing wrong with this approach. I generally loathe Stephen A. Smith, but even he pointed out on First Take today how questionable it was that the Raptors went away from Valanciunas attacking Whiteside given Hassan's well-documented history of getting frustrated when he has to play post defense as opposed to being a terrifying help defender that swats everything. We have an advantage there, but threw it away late. I wonder what Raptor film sessions must be like. I really do.
                      Similar to this, as I was watching last nights garbage fire I kept thinking to myself "what does CoJo think of Casey after being under Pop?"

                      JV is our best player right now. We need to treat him like it.
                      Heir, Prince of Cambridge

                      If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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                      • #Give jv the rock


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                        • Axel wrote: View Post
                          Similar to this, as I was watching last nights garbage fire I kept thinking to myself "what does CoJo think of Casey after being under Pop?"

                          JV is our best player right now. We need to treat him like it.
                          What indeed. Its sad how often Cojo will be ready for the swing pass that would surely be made if he was still a Spur, only to get waved off so someone can go one on one. Half the crap that Lowry and DeRozan do would never fly under Popovich.

                          I do question whether Casey would ever relent and start funneling offense through JV, or at least involving him more given how effective he can be. Then again, after he let DeRozan chuck up 32 shots in a closeout game that would have resulted in his firing had the Raptors lost only to gloat and call out everyone who questioned him and the team in his post game presser, I strongly doubt it. #RideOrDie

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                          • Sinbad wrote: View Post
                            This. When you have an advantage, you ride it until the other team adjusts. But that's not what the Raptors do. They routinely default to the worst version of themselves whenever they feel pressured or threatened. That they got away playing this way against the Pacers has only emboldened those who find nothing wrong with this approach. I generally loathe Stephen A. Smith, but even he pointed out on First Take today how questionable it was that the Raptors went away from Valanciunas attacking Whiteside given Hassan's well-documented history of getting frustrated when he has to play post defense as opposed to being a terrifying help defender that swats everything. We have an advantage there, but threw it away late. I wonder what Raptor film sessions must be like. I really do.
                            You know it's facepalm-worthy when even Stephen A smith is talking about it.
                            "Stay steamy"

                            - Kobe

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                            • hotfuzz wrote: View Post
                              You know it's facepalm-worthy when even Stephen A smith is talking about it.
                              Rautins said the same thing......I was wondering how Whiteside Jv matchup would go and Jv did well but Whitesides presence did affect the drives of others...Jv had some nice defensive plays that he would not have made a year ago as well as passes

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                              • rightsideup wrote: View Post
                                Rautins said the same thing......I was wondering how Whiteside Jv matchup would go and Jv did well but Whitesides presence did affect the drives of others...Jv had some nice defensive plays that he would not have made a year ago as well as passes
                                The ironic thing is that involving JV more, especially on P&R, would make Whiteside think twice about leaving JV to challenge dribble-penetration.

                                The problem with pounding the rock while your head is in the sand, is that you don't stop to realize that it would be so easy to find a better, easier way to continue pounding the rock.

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