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NBA Dynasty S7 Thread (temp) - Mack North is the Champion(temp)

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  • Feels like a good time to once again bring up my revolutionary and much reviled idea to tie our FAAB (draft only) money directly to how much cap space we have, and also to tie how long a player gets signed for to how much you bid on them.

    So, for example, if I enter free agency with only 1 year of cap space, I can only bid $1 for the 1 player I want. And then the player is signed to 1 year of cap hit because I bid $1 on him, assuming I get him.

    If someone else has, say, 7 years of cap space, and 3 empty slots, they could bid up to $5 for a single player (leaving $1 for the other two spots) to try to win a bidding war for free agents. But if they use those $5 to outbid everyone for a desired player, they have to sign him for 5 years.

    Would also shorten the draft, avoiding those annoying bids where we go $1 at a time up to $164 or some such. You are still stuck with whoever bids first winning the player, but we already have that problem, and we can equate that timing thing to the luck of the draw of where the player would prefer to play.

    It would mean a system where teams with cap space actually have more money to offer free agents, like in real life. While teams already full up in cap would be left trying to use their minimum salary or mid-level contracts to fill in their roster around the edges or sign undrafted free agents. And outbidding everyone else would actually have meaningful long term consequences for the winning GM.

    It mostly would eliminate or at least much reduce the situations where the best players are going in a single click, as it would be far more rare to have multiple teams with the exact same cap room than to have multiple teams with the same number of open slots (1, notably).

    Then we could ideally use the same system for in-season bids (so teams with no cap space would have to get lucky on waiver bids, with $0 to bid, rather than having some wild amount of FAAB money to play with), but that could be phased in later.

    Bring on the flames.
    twitter.com/dhackett1565

    Comment


    • I'm all for giving the teams with multiple empty spots a better nom position. This is not meant to be argumentative I just need help clarifying! Given that we are doing an auction -- how would moving a guy with empty spots to first nomination actually benefit them? If I had 7 empty slots and I nominated a guy I wanted first nom for $1... and lets say Joey had 3 slots and he would surely still bet more than the $1 if that guy was on his board ?? first or last nom, i think doesn't make a difference if the guy you nominate is a guy someone else had targeted and then it comes down to who has more money correct?

      imo it might not be worth customizing the draft order BUT im also cool with the going for the popular vote here.. i just wanted to make sure I understood the benefit to the empty slot teams nominating first. does it actually help them get their guys?
      Last edited by koncept; Tue Sep 3rd, 2019, 03:47 PM.
      in masai we trust

      water covers 98% of the earth, Mitchell Robinson covers the other 2%

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      • koncept wrote: View Post
        my only thing with that Apollo is I'm all for rewarding losing teams with better lottery ratings but affecting a draft order in which most teams only want one person by virtue of who won more games seems a bit unfair to winning teams. Shouldn't we all have a chance at getting our guy? that feels like it would reward the 5th and 6th place teams over the finalists..... non lottery is non lottery in the NBA and those teams all have equal opportunity in free agency
        This is where the $1 nomination limit comes in handy. The nomination puts the guy on the board to be fought for. It doesn't matter who nominated him.

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        • thats interesting. if thats the case, i dont mind that. we wouldn't be punished on losing a chance at a guy that was planned for with one slot and $200 for just because someone finished higher than someone else.
          in masai we trust

          water covers 98% of the earth, Mitchell Robinson covers the other 2%

          Comment


          • I love your idea Dan! Teams with less cap space (years) should in theory get the best player if they are willing to spend all that cap on that player. You want Nance Jr really bad.. pony up a 5, 6 or 7 year contract for him and he's yours!

            This is a pretty radical though. I could see a lot of people saying no to this.. but I'm new and love it.

            One downside is that we'd have to do some cap math during free agency to ensure the team who won the player can actually afford him. That part might slow the draft down a bit.

            Comment


            • koncept wrote: View Post
              I'm all for giving the teams with multiple empty spots a better nom position. This is not meant to be argumentative I just need help clarifying! Given that we are doing an auction -- how would moving a guy with empty spots to first nomination actually benefit them? If I had 7 empty slots and I nominated a guy I wanted first nom for $1... and lets say Joey had 3 slots and he would surely still bet more than the $1 if that guy was on his board ?? first or last nom, i think doesn't make a difference if the guy you nominate is a guy someone else had targeted and then it comes down to who has more money correct?

              imo it might not be worth customizing the draft order BUT im also cool with the going for the popular vote here.. i just wanted to make sure I understood the benefit to the empty slot teams nominating first. does it actually help them get their guys?
              If the big spenders are last to nominate it adds more risk to their auction because now they're potentially placed in a situation where #2 or #3 on their draft board is nominated before it's showtime for them. Then they must decide whether to roll the dice on getting their #1 and risk losing out on the other guys or fold and go get their #2 or #3, which might be the safer bet.

              Comment


              • planetmars wrote: View Post
                I love your idea Dan! Teams with less cap space (years) should in theory get the best player if they are willing to spend all that cap on that player. You want Nance Jr really bad.. pony up a 5, 6 or 7 year contract for him and he's yours!

                This is a pretty radical though. I could see a lot of people saying no to this.. but I'm new and love it.

                One downside is that we'd have to do some cap math during free agency to ensure the team who won the player can actually afford him. That part might slow the draft down a bit.
                Those are some drastic changes. My vote would be no. It's interesting but no for me.

                Comment


                • koncept wrote: View Post
                  I'm all for giving the teams with multiple empty spots a better nom position. This is not meant to be argumentative I just need help clarifying! Given that we are doing an auction -- how would moving a guy with empty spots to first nomination actually benefit them? If I had 7 empty slots and I nominated a guy I wanted first nom for $1... and lets say Joey had 3 slots and he would surely still bet more than the $1 if that guy was on his board ?? first or last nom, i think doesn't make a difference if the guy you nominate is a guy someone else had targeted and then it comes down to who has more money correct?

                  imo it might not be worth customizing the draft order BUT im also cool with the going for the popular vote here.. i just wanted to make sure I understood the benefit to the empty slot teams nominating first. does it actually help them get their guys?
                  in my brain, your first of 7 bids are for people you don't mind losing on, or getting for a dollar. if someone else buys your worst guy for 2 dollars, you still have 7 open slots, will nominate next, and one of your competitors used some of his money

                  Comment


                  • planetmars wrote: View Post
                    I love your idea Dan! Teams with less cap space (years) should in theory get the best player if they are willing to spend all that cap on that player. You want Nance Jr really bad.. pony up a 5, 6 or 7 year contract for him and he's yours!

                    This is a pretty radical though. I could see a lot of people saying no to this.. but I'm new and love it.

                    One downside is that we'd have to do some cap math during free agency to ensure the team who won the player can actually afford him. That part might slow the draft down a bit.
                    Essentially it's just more work for the mods (which is a meaningful consideration that should be weighted heavily when thinking about this idea). You just assign everyone their cap room as their FAAB amount for the auction, and Yahoo will take care of the rest - Yahoo already insists you keep 1$ for each of your spots, you are just changing from a $200 total limit across the board to a different (much smaller) number for each person.

                    It's definitely radical, but if ever there was a league to make a leap like that this is the one. We've already (and I'm being generous saying we, I joined late) molded the most competitive and realistic fantasy league I've ever seen here. Just trying to push the systems involved (free agency auction, salary cap, roster spots, waiver system) both towards a single cohesive system and closer to a reflection of the league we are imitating.

                    But just like last year when I proposed it, I take no offence if people (like the esteemed Apollo) think it is too big a change. I only really brought it up again because we were bemoaning some issues with the current system and exploring ways to change it.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

                    Comment


                    • Geez, waaaay too much too read while I'm at work ... Goddamn ... Lol

                      I'll stick to addressing this one though for now:
                      koncept wrote: View Post
                      interesting idea with most roster spots bidding first... my only question is how do we randomize the other teams that all have 1 spot? surely if you customize to place miek and realizer in first order, you couldn't randomize the other half of 1 empty spot teams could you?
                      I believe I can take the Random order given by Yahoo and then just reorganize per our agreement.
                      So it would still be randomized, but then I would tweak that order to accomodate the change we've made. I'm inclined to not change anything at all for this year, just because nothing happens that fast around here, but ya ... we can see what tools are available to me come Draft time, and then I can report to the league what's possible.

                      I'm all for the extra discussion, and love the suggestions, but remember the old saying "Change is BAD" ... or something like that anyway... we've got a great thing here, so I'm not looking to make drastic changes to something that already functions pretty damn well (or makes more work for me ...). If it's a small tweak, like how we determine Nom order, which has never been addressed, that makes sense to me.
                      Last edited by Joey; Tue Sep 3rd, 2019, 04:39 PM.

                      Comment


                      • That is what has made this league so great is all of the collective changes We’ve made to improve. To think we started with an auto draft with submitted pre draft rankings for rookies !

                        I believe that we’ve come up with reasonable solutions for issues that arise as we go.. and although there may be areas for tweaking on the FAAB I don’t think I’d personally be in favour of the cap space FAAB method. But that’s just me.
                        in masai we trust

                        water covers 98% of the earth, Mitchell Robinson covers the other 2%

                        Comment


                        • What does everyone else think about Apollo’s idea of nominations starting at 1$ instead of $200
                          in masai we trust

                          water covers 98% of the earth, Mitchell Robinson covers the other 2%

                          Comment


                          • There have been some positive changes for sure but they've been minor tweaks. Just a reminder of where it all started:
                            Apollo wrote: View Post

                            Draft date/time: Sun Oct 7 2:00pm EST
                            Commissioner: joey_hesketh
                            Assistant Commissioner: Soft Euro

                            RaptorsRepublic.com Group Page
                            League Page - Hosted by Yahoo Sports

                            CBA (Collective Baller Agreement):
                            • Standard Yahoo league scoring
                            • 15 man roster (PG, SG, G, SF, PF, F, C, C, Util, Util, BN, BN, BN, BN, BN)
                            • Year 1 draft will be a live auction featuring both veterans and rookies
                            • Year 2 draft and there after will be a live standard draft featuring only rookies.
                            • Draft order to be determined later.
                            • Draft picks can be traded,
                            • Salary cap will be based on years and the cap will be 40 years. After the draft is complete you will assign years to your players. The total of all players combined on your roster cannot be greater than 40 at this point in the off-season.
                            • After this point free agency begins. Teams may sign players to multi-season contracts if they have the cap space. If they do not have cap space than can sign players to one year deals; such a player cannot be extended in the off-season.
                            • Free agency will use a money system. Each team is given equal FA dollars which they can use to place secret bids on FA's who are currently on waivers. When a player is signed the team must immediately post on the league page or the league thread if it is a multi-season signing. If no mention is made within a one week window of the signing then the signing is deemed a one year deal regardless of cap space.
                            • Released players' contracts will continue count against a team's cap.
                              • Exception: Each team has a one time amnesty clause available for use. This will allow you to cut one player in the off-season without any salary cap implications.
                            • At the end of the year you are allowed to two sign players on your roster to an extension for as many years as you want provided you remain under cap. This decision must be made prior to the draft.
                              • Exception: You will be allowed to additionally re-sign or extend one player on your roster who you drafted as a rookie. [Effective 2013 draft]
                            ​​​​https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/f...asty-league-s1

                            ​​​​​Going through that thread is worth a look. You can see what the discussions were about back then when this thing was formed. A lot of thought went into it by all those founding members. I think the result is pretty special. Major thanks to Joey and Axel and everyone else for steering this thing to the level of success it's had. The enthusiasm in the league says it all. It's not wise to deviate far from a very proven system. It's more complex than meets the eye to a new team but not too complex that it's a barrier to start and (I hope) not too complex that it ever becomes a chore to those who have to caretaker it.

                            Comment


                            • Actually that wasn't even the first thread. There was a prior thread before that one:
                              ​​​​​​https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/f...ue-disccussion

                              Again, worth a look. It's pretty interesting looking back now. lol
                              Last edited by Apollo; Tue Sep 3rd, 2019, 06:31 PM.

                              Comment


                              • Nice read.. I was on this board when you started this league.. to bad I didn't sign up way back then. Too chicken shit probably lol.

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