Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Rondo on the block

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    JV would be an untouchable at this point i think... but our 2012 1st might not be for a deal like this... we could still get another pick by moving an asset like barbosa or klieza... or we could even trade Demar in a package for a player & pick there all kinds of options...to have a PG like Rondo would be worth it...
    Agree that JV would be untouchable. I also agree that the 2012 first as available for the right guy. Now, as I wrote earlier, if you get Rondo it's would only be part one of a major course correction. Other changes would be needed and you can't look at a Rondo deal in isolation.

    Still, unlike Apollo, I don't dismiss a Rondo deal out of hand because, first, we don't know what it would take to get him at the deadline (this isn't the 2011 offseason) and, two, character guys are fine but great players are better. Rondo would add anywhere from 7-10 wins on a very team-friendly deal. You can't pass that up cause you don't like the cut of his jib.

    Obviously, we're all speculating as to what the price might be, but I have real difficulty believing that Colangelo isn't interested in an elite PG, especially given Colangelo's track record in dealing for PGs.

    Comment


    • #47
      DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
      soo u think the celtics players & coach wouldnt know who are key pieces to there team????
      Knowing you like Kendrick Perkins and think he's a good player is very basic. Knowing how to fit him into the budget going forward under a CBA yet to be determined is extremely complicated. We're not talking basic algebra here, we're talking Calculus.

      DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
      also its not just that theres trade rumurs... its that ainge isnt being honest with his team...& if your GM was too blind to see that Perkins is more valuable to the team than Jeff Green, then wasnt being honest about trying to trade players when he obviously is,, u wouldnt be upset??? Ainge destroyed that team...Rondo just needs a change at this point...
      What the heck does that have to do with Doc? Rondo isn't undermining Ainge, he's undermining Doc Rivers.

      DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
      JV would be an untouchable at this point i think... but our 2012 1st might not be for a deal like this... we could still get another pick by moving an asset like barbosa or klieza... or we could even trade Demar in a package for a player & pick there all kinds of options...to have a PG like Rondo would be worth it...
      Rondo isn't a superstar but the Raptors pick might be in a position to draft a superstar. You don't deal that 2012 pick under any circumstances in March. That's crazy.

      DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
      if Rondo had the offence that Paul has he get a similar package maybe. the fact is though as good as rondo is paul is better Im sure the rest of the league sees that though..

      a team will have to give up a fair amount but not as much as the Paul deal
      Fair enough but the Raptors would have to give up most of its important core building blocks to get Rondo either way. Then do you think he's going to be happy playing on a crap team? Happy moving from the Celtics to one of the least respected teams in the league?

      CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
      My understanding was that they wanted CP3 for Rondo, but New Orleans laughed at that deal and went with the Lakers' offer and then the Clippers' offer, rather than settle for a package built around Rondo.
      I didn't read the bit about the Hornets laughing. All I read was the Celtics were interested and Rondo for CP3 was the core of the trade they proposed. Obviously the Hornets didn't like it, they didn't pull the trigger. That's not the point, the point is you can clearly see the Celtics expectations in trading Rondo. They're high expectations.

      CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
      Boston may aim for the moon, but so far teams haven't given in. I also don't think Ainge's comments are likely to drive up Rondo's trade value, but rather hurt it.
      Well I strongly feel that people are low balling Rondo's trade value in here. That's great talk guys but it's not real. If life was that easy for the Raptors we'd be watching a contender right now.


      CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
      That was sort of the point of my post, that I would do a deal for what I think is fair value. I never said that Boston would definitely go for it or that other teams wouldn't give Boston a better offer. If I was BC, I just wouldn't give up anything more than the offers I posted to get a player that is good but overrated, in addition to apprently being high maintenance.
      It's not just about doing a fair value deal. It's about doing a fair value deal that works. You need to consider Rondo's expectations in all of this. If he's trouble for the Celtics right now in a strong locker room how does he respond in Toronto on a team full of sheep?... On a team full of loser sheep? The Raptors aren't ready to take on a situation like this even if they get Rondo at fair value. That's the point.

      Comment


      • #48
        Apollo wrote: View Post
        Knowing you like Kendrick Perkins and think he's a good player is very basic. Knowing how to fit him into the budget going forward under a CBA yet to be determined is extremely complicated. We're not talking basic algebra here, we're talking Calculus.



        What the heck does that have to do with Doc? Rondo isn't undermining Ainge, he's undermining Doc Rivers.



        Rondo isn't a superstar but the Raptors pick might be in a position to draft a superstar. You don't deal that 2012 pick under any circumstances in March. That's crazy.



        Fair enough but the Raptors would have to give up most of its important core building blocks to get Rondo either way. Then do you think he's going to be happy playing on a crap team? Happy moving from the Celtics to one of the least respected teams in the league?
        perkins was the glue on that team...its not just cause i think hes a good player... he anchored there defence, was a vocal leader on the floor & was a great team mate...all the core players were shocked & disapointed that he was traded...also theve never been able to replace him.. & weres Jeff Green now????

        as for the rondo/doc thing.. i think that whole situation is bread out of frustration on both there parts...that team is a bit of a mess right now..

        also while i agree there may be a superstar in the draft for us, im not sold that it has to be our pick....id be ok with doing the rondo trade then aquiring another 1st in the range of 10-15 if possible

        Comment


        • #49
          Obviously we'd have interest in a 3-time all-star PG who is young ... and with his defensive strength, maybe Casey is just the man to reel him in.

          The real question is what do we send for him? They would likely have no interest in Jose, and more interest in prospects and picks ... such as Demar, Ed, our upcoming pick.

          Personally I would part with Demar and Ed if it got us Rondo, and we could keep our pick to go after a SG like Beal.

          Rondo
          Beal
          JJ
          Bargnani
          Valanciunas

          Bench unit of Jose, Kleiza, Barbosa, Amir, etc. pretty tight.
          The only way to bag a classy lady is to give her two tickets to the gun show... and see if she likes the goods.

          Comment


          • #50
            Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
            Obviously we'd have interest in a 3-time all-star PG who is young ... and with his defensive strength, maybe Casey is just the man to reel him in.

            The real question is what do we send for him? They would likely have no interest in Jose, and more interest in prospects and picks ... such as Demar, Ed, our upcoming pick.

            Personally I would part with Demar and Ed if it got us Rondo, and we could keep our pick to go after a SG like Beal.

            Rondo
            Beal
            JJ
            Bargnani
            Valanciunas

            Bench unit of Jose, Kleiza, Barbosa, Amir, etc. pretty tight.
            works for me!

            Comment


            • #51
              Skimming thru a couple of Celtic blogs the fans there seem to be ambivalent about moving RR. I get the impression more are in favour of moving him...dont consider him someone to build around...he doesnt shoot very well making the rest of the team play 4 to 5...he doesnt go to the rim as much anymore (lol..we used to complain about Jose)...he has a current wrist problem and it might be chronic....and of course the petulance. Golden State didnt want to do a Curry for Rondo even though Curry has been having recurring issues with his ankle.

              Seems like lots of due diligence required for Mr. Rajon.

              Comment


              • #52
                DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
                as for the rondo/doc thing.. i think that whole situation is bread out of frustration on both there parts...that team is a bit of a mess right now..
                That's your speculation, that's not what the reports are saying. The reports are saying that Rondo is clashing with Doc and he is essentially undermining Doc. For them to want to trade him, the guy they once envisioned as the future of the team, it's got to be pretty damn bad. Rondo needs to land in a strong dressing room. Westbrook for Rondo makes sense. I think you'll see something like that if he's moved.

                DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
                also while i agree there may be a superstar in the draft for us, im not sold that it has to be our pick....id be ok with doing the rondo trade then aquiring another 1st in the range of 10-15 if possible
                Ah, and so now you've upped Rondo's price tag even more for the Raptors because they need to go out and trade away more talent to get another pick.

                Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
                3-time all-star PG who is young ... and with his defensive strength
                FOR
                Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
                Demar and Ed
                Really? That's the best offer the Celtics could get in a 30 team league?

                Comment


                • #53
                  Apollo wrote: View Post
                  That's your speculation, that's not what the reports are saying. The reports are saying that Rondo is clashing with Doc and he is essentially undermining Doc. For them to want to trade him, the guy they once envisioned as the future of the team, it's got to be pretty damn bad. Rondo needs to land in a strong dressing room. Westbrook for Rondo makes sense. I think you'll see something like that if he's moved


                  Ah, and so now you've upped Rondo's price tag even more for the Raptors because they need to go out and trade away more talent to get another pick.


                  FOR


                  Really?
                  i wouldnt say it was speculation on my part.. more like observation... ainge has already said hed trade anyone on the team, he wants to rip it down and try to land a young big 3.. cant blame him i guess.. there guys re getting old but i dont like that hes being soo public about it.. its one think for stuff to get leaked but he came out & said it him self.. it doesnt breed confidence going forward for anyone does it to have your whole team thinkin there gettin traded... just look at the leafs LOL..

                  in rondos case hes been telling him there not trading him for the whole season yet hes being shopped all over for a while now... thats not right i think....
                  Last edited by DoNDaDDa; Thu Mar 1, 2012, 01:20 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Doc isn't the GM so I don't follow.

                    And everyone who is saying "trade for Rondo" is ignoring my questions about it working.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Apollo wrote: View Post
                      Doc isn't the GM so I don't follow.
                      i get what your saying but docs the coach.. of course hes going to get pissed when his team is playing crap.. hes a firey type guy
                      he lets his players have it... but if his players are pissed to & feel like there not wanted then there going to tune him out & its going to cause rifts.. as u see now with rondo.... dont be suprised to see it happen with KG next

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Apollo wrote: View Post
                        Really? That's the best offer the Celtics could get in a 30 team league?
                        If you read my post ... I would trade Demar and Ed for Rondo ... show me where I said it was the best offer in the league. Certainly not a bad starting point, grabbing two potential starters for the next decade - especially if you were planning to use KG and Allen to bring in more assets and picks.
                        The only way to bag a classy lady is to give her two tickets to the gun show... and see if she likes the goods.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Apollo wrote: View Post
                          And everyone who is saying "trade for Rondo" is ignoring my questions about it working.
                          i think it would work but not with Demar in the back court with him... thats why i said trade demar.. wed need a SG who can shoot from mid/long range

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Stahmenah_Vybz wrote: View Post
                            Well considering the fact that the reason they want to get rid of his is because of his personality be high maintenance on such a star studded team? What kind of poison will he bring to this team being an all star?

                            No thanks!
                            The only reason we might be able to get such a talent on a good contract is because he is a poison - so that's a good thing. Better to deal with a poison star than no star at all. His attitude seems to be why he is able to stick daggers in opposing teams in late game situations - don't know if you can separate the two! The problem is his late game play will lead us to more wins. I think BC can do a deal that won't cost us too much; He is good at that stuff. Love Davis, he has crazy fast hops and a lot of raw potential; although, he seems to be behind in his development - probably why he fell into our laps at the draft?

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
                              If you read my post ... I would trade Demar and Ed for Rondo ... show me where I said it was the best offer in the league. Certainly not a bad starting point, grabbing two potential starters for the next decade - especially if you were planning to use KG and Allen to bring in more assets and picks.
                              I didn't say you said it was the best offer in the league. I asked the question do you think it's the best offer they would get in the league. I asked the question because the offer looks like it would be missing the most valuable piece going outbound to get the deal done.

                              DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
                              i think it would work but not with Demar in the back court with him... thats why i said trade demar.. wed need a SG who can shoot from mid/long range
                              I'm not asking about X's and O's, I'm asking about in the locker room, on the practice court, during timeouts, etc. He's not happy in Boston on one of the best teams in the league. One of the best coaches in the league and one of the strongest locker rooms in the league can't keep him in line. In Toronto he would expected to be the leader. You want that leading the Raptors? This gets back to my question I asked earlier, how would Rondo work on a roster full of loser sheep? Loser, meaning the team stinks. Sheep, meaning no strong leader presences.

                              Rondo won't want any part of Toronto for the same reason Star free agents don't seriously consider Toronto.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Apollo wrote: View Post
                                Doc isn't the GM so I don't follow.

                                And everyone who is saying "trade for Rondo" is ignoring my questions about it working.
                                I don't think anyone is ignoring your question. You just don't like the answers. Rondo doesn't work as the roster is currently constituted but, in fairness, the roster right now is dung heap. You'd need to grab a shooter at the SF spot (which they need anyway) and a better shooter at the SG, which, well, many of us think they need anyway. The plus is that you wouldn't be completely wasting Bargnani's prime, which is going to happen otherwise when you line him up with a 19 year old centre who is 6 years from his prime and a 19-year old swing man who is 4-5 years from his.

                                Hey, I'm all for an organic rebuild. I've been screaming for one since 2006. But, if BC wants to "hit the ground running" next year, and won't trade Bargs, I'd rather he try and do it with an elite player like Rondo rather than his usual "let's paper over two or three positional holes with band-aids" and relegate the team to battling for 8th place for the next 5 years (i.e. see last 5 years).

                                Also, why are we afraid to try? This organization has had one good team in 10 years. It is nowhere close to competing. The roster is awful. How can things be worse than they are right now? Rondo gives you 7-10 wins. If Bargs has finally got it, that's another 10 wins. You add a quality centre like JV and a quality SF or SG and it's not inconceivable that you could have a 45-48 win team. Is it risky? Hell yeah. Is it any riskier than the alternatives? Not so sure.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X