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  • And then there's this even more sinister China conspiracy theory floating around....

    https://www.facebook.com/officialben...18533718184032

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    • inthepaint wrote: View Post

      Yeah with relatively few exceptions I don't think anyone is "fucking around with a pandemic" or saying is not serious. What I think some people are genuinely trying to do is bring/maintain perspective. Complex health data can be looked at many different ways, and there are often positive trends and negative trends, happening at the same time, especially on something global like this. But the doomsday ones get 10x more attention, because for better or worse, that's how the governments succeed keep people inside. It is what it is. Whether one agrees with or not, questioning it should be allowed in a free society though.

      It should be ok (although frankly lacking on a balanced debate about this) to highlight the unprecedented, self-inflicted economic damage that could reach depression levels when this is all said and done. But right now anyone that brings that up runs the risk of being considered to be "fucking around with a pandemic". Like, I wouldn't be surprised if that article gets taken down later today.
      Yeah there was another article that was written in Medium a couple of weeks ago that had nothing but statistics similar to this one. And lo and behold, it was taken down.

      Unfortunately I cannot have a conversation in public (i.e. my personal FB or Instagram page) about this as the mob would come for my head.

      Regarding the economic damage, I've spoken to a few people in the medical field regarding the economic damage or fallout from this, and they shrug and say "well, we've had market crashes before and recovered, so why would this be any different?"

      Comment


      • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
        All public events in Toronto are banned till June 30. I doubt basketball is coming back.
        for what it's worth: https://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/id...-official-says

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        • Great news!
          Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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          • suspenders wrote: View Post

            Yeah there was another article that was written in Medium a couple of weeks ago that had nothing but statistics similar to this one. And lo and behold, it was taken down.

            Unfortunately I cannot have a conversation in public (i.e. my personal FB or Instagram page) about this as the mob would come for my head.

            Regarding the economic damage, I've spoken to a few people in the medical field regarding the economic damage or fallout from this, and they shrug and say "well, we've had market crashes before and recovered, so why would this be any different?"
            I can see that reaction from some people in the medical field. For the most part they have very stable jobs that are typically insulated from recession, pandemics and wars. Matter of fact they're typically busier doing those times.

            But I also think that depends on who you ask in the field, there's a variety of opinions. Many people that work in the front lines as well as people that work with large epidemiological data understand that socio-economic conditions have a huge impact on health. The effects are indirect and long-term, so they're hard to forecast/quantify, but they're real. If we look at the overall health picture of people during the 1930's depression, or even now in countries in conflict/economic unstable, it ain't pretty.
            2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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            • Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

              Comment


              • There isn't 'moving the goal posts,' there's a series of escalating measures that can be taken depending where you're at on the curve. It's a sequence of responses that's about avoiding the most extreme measures until absolutely necessary, all while trying to make sure to flatten the curve so the health care system can cope. That's it. Joe Rogan may be disappointed but there's no conspiracy.

                These strategies are being provided by our leading health officials and actual scientists. All this isn't being run by a politician or a businessman. Politicians and business hate this, it's costing a shit load of money. These responses really don't serve any purpose other than public health.

                ​​​​It does all raise the really interesting ethical question of the value of human life. It's a fair question and a bit nuts that it's not a hypothetical right now. My life insurance policy tells my wife and kids I'm worth about $500,000. My arm is worth $10k or something and my eyeball $5k, I don't remember. How much are at risk lives worth? Are all measures justified or are any measures too extreme? Does the general welfare of the many ever out value the health of a few?

                ​​​​​I think we're going to be tackling these questions way more openly if this takes 12-24 months and if we see economic impacts as extreme as some are predicting, like 30% unemployment in the US.
                "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

                Comment


                • S.R. wrote: View Post
                  There isn't 'moving the goal posts,' there's a series of escalating measures that can be taken depending where you're at on the curve. It's a sequence of responses that's about avoiding the most extreme measures until absolutely necessary, all while trying to make sure to flatten the curve so the health care system can cope. That's it. Joe Rogan may be disappointed but there's no conspiracy.

                  These strategies are being provided by our leading health officials and actual scientists. All this isn't being run by a politician or a businessman. Politicians and business hate this, it's costing a shit load of money. These responses really don't serve any purpose other than public health.

                  ​​​​It does all raise the really interesting ethical question of the value of human life. It's a fair question and a bit nuts that it's not a hypothetical right now. My life insurance policy tells my wife and kids I'm worth about $500,000. My arm is worth $10k or something and my eyeball $5k, I don't remember. How much are at risk lives worth? Are all measures justified or are any measures too extreme? Does the general welfare of the many ever out value the health of a few?

                  ​​​​​I think we're going to be tackling these questions way more openly if this takes 12-24 months and if we see economic impacts as extreme as some are predicting, like 30% unemployment in the US.
                  This crisis should be a kick in the pants to bring back some manufacturing & supply chains on-shore for critical goods, which should theoretically create more jobs. Yes, it will be higher cost and require subsidies to compete in non crisis times, but it’s a worthy tax for national security. That’s the South Korea model and it works.

                  Comment


                  • Emergency Management and Protection Act in ON
                    $750-$5000 fines and potential jail time for playing on a playground or gathering in a group of over 5. 12 new bylaw officer patrolling as of yesterday and laid 9 offense charges.

                    Brampton enacted a bylaw with fines up to 100K for not keeping 2 metres away from people who are not your family member.

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                    • KeonClark wrote: View Post

                      I'm not saying coronavirus isnt serious. I'm saying a lot of fuckery is being done to play with people's emotions and have you living in fear. "10000 dead in italy" sounds terrifying. "17000 italians dead via flu every winter" is another headline I could make. Also, the average age of Corona death is about 81 and they all have underlying diseases, in fact,

                      how many of the people who are reported as "Covid-19 deaths" in Italy actually had coronavirus listed as their cause of death? Just 12 per cent. What's more, according to the Italian government's own report, half of those who died had three or more other diseases at the time of the death. Nearly 80 per cent had at least two other diseases that they were fighting when they died. Only 1.7 per cent of those who died had no other disease.​​​​​​


                      links are provided. 98% of these people were on deaths door. This is definitely unprecedented. However, not sure if it's the disease that's the unprecedented part.
                      Is the bold blue correct?
                      How many die in Canada from flu every year vs COVID 19 so far? We're up to 101 so far.
                      Also, can you get the "common flu" and COVID at the same time?
                      Last edited by G__Deane; Wed Apr 1, 2020, 09:44 AM.

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                      • golden wrote: View Post

                        And then there's this even more sinister China conspiracy theory floating around....

                        https://www.facebook.com/officialben...18533718184032
                        Speaking of rabbit holes Ben Shapiro is small enough to fit down one.

                        Comment


                        • Comment


                          • inthepaint wrote: View Post

                            I can see that reaction from some people in the medical field. For the most part they have very stable jobs that are typically insulated from recession, pandemics and wars. Matter of fact they're typically busier doing those times.

                            But I also think that depends on who you ask in the field, there's a variety of opinions. Many people that work in the front lines as well as people that work with large epidemiological data understand that socio-economic conditions have a huge impact on health. The effects are indirect and long-term, so they're hard to forecast/quantify, but they're real. If we look at the overall health picture of people during the 1930's depression, or even now in countries in conflict/economic unstable, it ain't pretty.
                            Agreed - not everyone in the medical field feels this way. I know that many understand the socio-economic conditions that could have a huge impact on health.

                            From my personal experience so far, the ones who mainly advocate completely self isolation (i.e a shut down of literally everything except for maybe groceries, and even then I don't think they fully understand how groceries get to their stores), are the ones who are privileged. It's the ones who have very stable jobs. They don't seem to care that there is a large portion of the population that don't have those same luxuries that they do.

                            I'm on the fence on what I actually believe (I am following all of the "rules"), but it's frustrating that it seems that most people I interact with are all parroting the same thing without questioning anything.

                            Comment


                            • S.R. wrote: View Post
                              There isn't 'moving the goal posts,' there's a series of escalating measures that can be taken depending where you're at on the curve. It's a sequence of responses that's about avoiding the most extreme measures until absolutely necessary, all while trying to make sure to flatten the curve so the health care system can cope. That's it. Joe Rogan may be disappointed but there's no conspiracy.

                              These strategies are being provided by our leading health officials and actual scientists. All this isn't being run by a politician or a businessman. Politicians and business hate this, it's costing a shit load of money. These responses really don't serve any purpose other than public health.

                              ​​​​It does all raise the really interesting ethical question of the value of human life. It's a fair question and a bit nuts that it's not a hypothetical right now. My life insurance policy tells my wife and kids I'm worth about $500,000. My arm is worth $10k or something and my eyeball $5k, I don't remember. How much are at risk lives worth? Are all measures justified or are any measures too extreme? Does the general welfare of the many ever out value the health of a few?

                              ​​​​​I think we're going to be tackling these questions way more openly if this takes 12-24 months and if we see economic impacts as extreme as some are predicting, like 30% unemployment in the US.
                              Yeah, the best and brightest minds in the world are working together to tackle this pandemic and haven't been able to predict it's path or come up with a solution. If it seems like there are no answers on how to stop this it's because there aren't any yet. Just trying to preserve human life as much as possible until there is a breakthrough.

                              Comment


                              • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                                Is the bold blue correct?
                                How many die in Canada from flu every year vs COVID 19 so far? We're up to 101 so far.
                                Also, can you get the "common flu" and COVID at the same time?
                                Flu causes about 12,200 hospitalizations and 3,500 deaths in Canada each year. (https://www.ontario.ca/page/flu-facts) But there's a vaccine every year and people still die. We don't have vaccine for COVID.
                                Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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