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  • G__Deane wrote: View Post
    People will finally start to understand that money is not real when governments must keep printing trillions to support the economy and borrow from fictitious places where you never pay the interest .... does anyone believe the US or Canada will ever pay their debts off....ever?

    Standard of living and competition for resources IS real, though. Money is simply a way of keeping track of who controls those resources. You can control those resources by contracts & agreements (i.e. law) or you can control them by force (i.e. war). Let's hope it doesn't come to the latter.

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    • Solution Proposal until virus nearly eliminated and Canada only (1) Everyone wear a mask (2) test millions / more so in higher risk areas like cities and all healthcare workers in LTC, (3) quarantine the infected (4) maintain physical distance policy (5) back to work / open business. (6) Maintain border controls.
      Last edited by Zak24gege; Sat Apr 4, 2020, 03:26 PM.

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        • Some positive news from here in BC
          The name's Bond, James Bond.

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          • 007 wrote: View Post



            Some positive news from here in BC
            Good job, BC. Rest of Canada, time to step up. Looking at you, Ontario.

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            • This is certainly a long video but I've found it to be one of the most comprehensive and calming that I've seen. Advice from a pulmonary/critical care doctor on the frontlines in one of NYC's biggest hospitals, which is now entirely devoted to Covid. He's mostly getting really specific about how one gets the virus and how one doesn't.

              https://vimeo.com/399733860?outro=1&...Q-3WAG66fbay_I

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              • Asia may have been right about masks and the coronavirus and the rest of the world is coming around

                https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/01/asia/...hnk/index.html

                In other parts of the world, this message may be confusing, coming after weeks of public health authorities, politicians and media figures confidently claiming masks do not help and urging people instead to focus on washing their hands and maintaining social distancing.

                The tone of such claims ranged from condescending to frustrated, with the US Surgeon General Jerome Adams tweeting in late February -- in all caps -- "STOP BUYING MASKS!""They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can't get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk," he added, in a post that has since been retweeted over 43,000 times.


                As the evidence increasingly comes round in favor of masks, we must ask how many infections might have been avoided if in January, instead of saying masks wouldn't help, officials and the media had instead lobbied for factories to ramp up domestic production, provided guidance on how to make masks at home, and asked other countries to donate surplus materials?

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                • GOLDBLUM wrote: View Post
                  This is certainly a long video but I've found it to be one of the most comprehensive and calming that I've seen. Advice from a pulmonary/critical care doctor on the frontlines in one of NYC's biggest hospitals, which is now entirely devoted to Covid. He's mostly getting really specific about how one gets the virus and how one doesn't.

                  https://vimeo.com/399733860?outro=1&...Q-3WAG66fbay_I
                  This was awesome. Thanks for sharing.

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                  • Yes. IMO the event Ontario Public Service message is essentially a scare tactic to get people to follow the distancing 'advice'. Unfortunately some are publicly refusing to comply prompting the message.

                    I earlier posted a prescriptive approach wrt eliminating the virus. I will provide the thinking and rationale here. Overall, compared to most other developed countries, Canada is doing a good job controlling the virus. Compared to our neighbours to the South, we acted earlier and in a more cohesive and serious manner to limit it's spread.

                    Now, rather than continually yelling the sky is falling when it actually hasn't without providing a way forward is leaving Ontario / Canadians in a state of flux or uncertainty which could result in unintended consequences. So far only 3255 or approx. 0.022% of Ont. residents have been infected and of those 67 or 2.1% have died. We hear constantly to let the experts / science determine what we should do. As an Electrical Engineer / MBA with executive roles leading both development and marketing teams, I spent a lengthy career working with many smart scientists who were fantastic at creating new technologies. When it came to molding the scientists technology into actual products that solved customer problems you needed talented engineers and product / marketing people. I find our government's approach to this virus problem and their communication to be very one sided. First of all, let's start with the science and list what we know about this virus ands its effect on us.
                    1. This is a flu-like virus with flu-like symptoms and transmitted in flu-like ways.
                    2. It's highly transmittable - it's R0 is between 2 and 3.
                    3. Spreading of the virus occurs due to close contact with an infected person, exposed to coughing, sneezing, respiratory droplets or aerosols. These aerosols can penetrate the human body (lungs) via inhalation through the nose or mouth.
                    4. Symptoms are cough, fever and shortness of breath
                    5. No clinically approved antiviral drug or vaccine
                    6. The incubation period for COVID-19 is between 1 and 14 days.
                    7. It's duration of symptoms is 10 to 14 days or less.
                    8. It has a higher hospitalization rate than the regular flu.
                    9. It has a higher mortality rate than the regular flu.
                    To stop the spread of the virus our Gov't, / Health Agencies have taken an across Canada nuclear approa


                    ch to the problem by asking all non-essential workers to stay home and in parallel they have shuttered all non-essential business activities.

                    Is there another way? If the goal is stopping the transmission, what is the most effective method of preventing one person from infecting others? Obviously physical separation will do the trick. So will face masks. The wearers do not get 100% immunity, however they will protect others if that person is infected and doesn't know it. South Korea did a ton of testing and found up to 20% of those infected were asymptomatic. In other words some people were sick and didn't know it. This is consistent with finding that it takes 1 to 2 days for symptoms to appear after contact with the virus and 10 to 14 day symptom duration. A mask will protect others and cut down the infection rate.

                    Secondly, in order to eliminate transmission it is important to identify those who are sick and isolate them from the healthy population. That means more testing. At this point we are only testing those who have the symptoms. As mentioned earlier, the South Koreans found that 20% of carriers showed no symptoms at all. The only way to find this 20% is via testing.

                    Lastly, identifying and isolating infected individuals, you also must do contact tracing to find out who may have come into contact with the infected and unknowingly has become infected. These people must be tested and isolated pending the results.

                    Going forward we cannot simply continue to implement increasingly 'inmate' like conditions for a problem that is more or less flu-like. By wearing a mask combined with an aggressive test & isolate program we can achieve the same objective without the social disruption that closing down entire industry sectors, throwing millions out of work. A smart-bomb is what we need, not a nuclear one. South Korea is a good example to follow.

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                    • I also encourage everyone to watch the video that Goldblum posted above. The doctor primarily only works with COVID patients, in one of NY's biggest hospitals.

                      The key is to not touch your face with your hands! You will not get the diseases from droplets entering your mouth (I mean you can, but it's so rare that it's not a worry). The primary way to get it is if you touch a contagious person's body (primarily their hands) or a surface that a contagious person touched, and then touch your face (eyes, mouth, nose).

                      Masks are recommended to practice not touching your face. But that is the only real benefit. However if you are sick, wear a mask to protect your family. And the mask doesn't have to be a medical mask. Can be a handkerchief or bandanna. Everyone who gets it, will eventually feel symptoms but could be 1-2 days after they got it. This will not mutate into something worse.. in fact it will mutate into something much weaker and eventually hit the entire population like the common cold. If you do get it, you will not get it again.

                      If you are in a room with a covid patient for more than 20-30 minutes at a time (so a HCW), then and only then could a mask help you from getting it. Otherwise a mask is only helpful if you want to practice not touching your face with your hands.

                      The number one key is to always wash your hands. Make it a habit to use sanitizer if you are out in public and touch public surfaces (like shopping carts, elevator buttons, etc). You can still enjoy the out doors.. just keep 3-6 feet away from everyone, and make sure your hands are clean.

                      I've been using gloves when I go outside. And I've been pretty crazy about washing my hands already. But I think the world has gone a bit looney over the past month or so.

                      I really hope this video goes viral.

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                      • planetmars wrote: View Post
                        I also encourage everyone to watch the video that Goldblum posted above. The doctor primarily only works with COVID patients, in one of NY's biggest hospitals.

                        The key is to not touch your face with your hands! You will not get the diseases from droplets entering your mouth (I mean you can, but it's so rare that it's not a worry). The primary way to get it is if you touch a contagious person's body (primarily their hands) or a surface that a contagious person touched, and then touch your face (eyes, mouth, nose).

                        Masks are recommended to practice not touching your face. But that is the only real benefit. However if you are sick, wear a mask to protect your family. And the mask doesn't have to be a medical mask. Can be a handkerchief or bandanna. Everyone who gets it, will eventually feel symptoms but could be 1-2 days after they got it. This will not mutate into something worse.. in fact it will mutate into something much weaker and eventually hit the entire population like the common cold. If you do get it, you will not get it again.

                        If you are in a room with a covid patient for more than 20-30 minutes at a time (so a HCW), then and only then could a mask help you from getting it. Otherwise a mask is only helpful if you want to practice not touching your face with your hands.

                        The number one key is to always wash your hands. Make it a habit to use sanitizer if you are out in public and touch public surfaces (like shopping carts, elevator buttons, etc). You can still enjoy the out doors.. just keep 3-6 feet away from everyone, and make sure your hands are clean.

                        I've been using gloves when I go outside. And I've been pretty crazy about washing my hands already. But I think the world has gone a bit looney over the past month or so.

                        I really hope this video goes viral.
                        It is an amazing video. Helped a lot. I wish I could ask him can you get corona from touching any surface a person with corona touches or is it just specific surfaces? Not sure if you know? Also can you get it from food. Like if I were to order out and a person with Corona touches my food and then I ate it would I get it? If anyone knows the answer to these please let me know.
                        I relish negativity and disappointment. It is not healthy. Somebody buy me a pony.

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                        • Also does anyone know if you should be disinfecting everything you buy from the grocery store? I've been doing it the best I can but I'm wondering if I can get it that way as well?
                          I relish negativity and disappointment. It is not healthy. Somebody buy me a pony.

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                          • GLF wrote: View Post

                            It is an amazing video. Helped a lot. I wish I could ask him can you get corona from touching any surface a person with corona touches or is it just specific surfaces? Not sure if you know? Also can you get it from food. Like if I were to order out and a person with Corona touches my food and then I ate it would I get it? If anyone knows the answer to these please let me know.
                            I've read that the length of time that the virus stays 'viable' on a surface is dependent on the surface material - stainless steel and plastics having a viable life of up to 3 days (which would include things like door handles, shopping carts, plastic bags etc).

                            As noted above, the biggest opportunity for transmission comes from when you bring the virus into contact with the mucus membranes on your face (mouth, nose, eyes) - so if you get out of the habit of touching your face, and wash your hands thoroughly after touching shared surfaces, you'll lessen your chance of contraction.

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                            • Ebonhawke wrote: View Post

                              I've read that the length of time that the virus stays 'viable' on a surface is dependent on the surface material - stainless steel and plastics having a viable life of up to 3 days (which would include things like door handles, shopping carts, plastic bags etc).

                              As noted above, the biggest opportunity for transmission comes from when you bring the virus into contact with the mucus membranes on your face (mouth, nose, eyes) - so if you get out of the habit of touching your face, and wash your hands thoroughly after touching shared surfaces, you'll lessen your chance of contraction.
                              Oh okay I see. Thanks for that!
                              I relish negativity and disappointment. It is not healthy. Somebody buy me a pony.

                              Comment


                              • GOLDBLUM wrote: View Post
                                This is certainly a long video but I've found it to be one of the most comprehensive and calming that I've seen. Advice from a pulmonary/critical care doctor on the frontlines in one of NYC's biggest hospitals, which is now entirely devoted to Covid. He's mostly getting really specific about how one gets the virus and how one doesn't.

                                https://vimeo.com/399733860?outro=1&...Q-3WAG66fbay_I
                                Wear a frickin’ mask people and use hand sanitizer. It’s so obvious. The part he left out, that every North American leaves out, is that a mask also protects OTHERS in case YOU are an asymptomatic carrier.... which is basically everybody under the age of 30.

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