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DanH wrote: View PostI don't buy it. Are we to assume that the assistants would make the same calls as Casey? Heck, Nurse has been trying to get this season's offensive system in place since he was hired, and has been ignored until now.
The logical point for Nurse to emerge would have been right after the Wizards sweep, but the Raps actually doubled down on even less passing the following season. We need a Doctor, not a Nurse.
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golden wrote: View PostBut a big part of leadership is being able to sell your vision and get people to buy into your plan. It's a bit of a red flag to me that Nurse wasn't able to influence Casey, Kyle or DeMar to his vision.... after 5 long years. Even when Nurse's system was implemented, it was Masai who had to step in a mandate it... out of frustration.
The logical point for Nurse to emerge would have been right after the Wizards sweep, but the Raps actually doubled down on even less passing the following season. We need a Doctor, not a Nurse.
If we learned anything about Casey, it's that he was incredibly stubborn and inflexible with his vision of how he wanted the team to play on both ends.
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white men can't jump wrote: View PostYeah, but the point is Nurse wasn't in a position of leadership. So "selling his vision" is a moot point if the main leader (Casey) has no intention of buying in and instead mandates him to figure out a way to run an offence Casey wants (ie. empty the clip).
If we learned anything about Casey, it's that he was incredibly stubborn and inflexible with his vision of how he wanted the team to play on both ends.
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golden wrote: View PostI'm talking about internally, within the team. Selling your vision can happen at any level. That's just how people rise up through the ranks, in any profession. Thibs is a good example: his vision of defense was being fully implemented by Doc Rivers championship Celtics. His voice was strong enough, even as an assistant, to the point where he was actually more visible than Doc on the sidelines during Celtics defensive possessions. Contrast that to Nick Nurse: he was sitting on a good plan for the modern NBA 5 years ago, but just couldn't sell his secret sauce to Casey, DeMar or Lowry. He had unlimited access to those guys.
I don't know that Doc listening to his assistants and Casey not doing so should be laid at the feet of the assistants.
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golden wrote: View PostI'm talking about internally, within the team. Selling your vision can happen at any level. That's just how people rise up through the ranks, in any profession. Thibs is a good example: his vision of defense was being fully implemented by Doc Rivers championship Celtics. His voice was strong enough, even as an assistant, to the point where he was actually more visible than Doc on the sidelines during Celtics defensive possessions. Contrast that to Nick Nurse: he was sitting on a good plan for the modern NBA 5 years ago, but just couldn't sell his secret sauce to Casey, DeMar or Lowry. He had unlimited access to those guys."Stop eating your sushi."
"I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
"I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
- Jack Armstrong
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golden wrote: View PostI'm talking about internally, within the team. Selling your vision can happen at any level. That's just how people rise up through the ranks, in any profession. Thibs is a good example: his vision of defense was being fully implemented by Doc Rivers championship Celtics. His voice was strong enough, even as an assistant, to the point where he was actually more visible than Doc on the sidelines during Celtics defensive possessions. Contrast that to Nick Nurse: he was sitting on a good plan for the modern NBA 5 years ago, but just couldn't sell his secret sauce to Casey, DeMar or Lowry. He had unlimited access to those guys.
Why would Lowry or Demar want anything to change? Why would Casey? Again, Casey was stubborn, and DeMar and Lowry benefited the most from our previous style of play. Nurse can't go straight to those guys as he'd be undermining Casey as well, which would actually show poor character on Nurse's part.
The question of leadership qualities should again be focused on Casey, as Nurse was brought in for his offensive savvy and was a resource Casey basically ignored until Masai all but threatened his job last offseason. A leader recognizes when to "follow" by listening to his top advisers.
The failures of someone to "lead" from a position with virtually no real authority isn't an indictment of how they'd do if given that authorit. Again, as an assistant Nurse could only impact game plans as much as Casey allowed him to...so your example is probably more reflective of Doc being better at acknowledging others' input than Casey ever was.
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KeonClark wrote: View PostThis is all conjecture
Kinda funny seeing everybody stating with matter of factness who gets credit for what amongst the coaching staff"Stop eating your sushi."
"I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
"I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
- Jack Armstrong
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white men can't jump wrote: View PostYeah I still don't buy that.
Why would Lowry or Demar want anything to change? Why would Casey? Again, Casey was stubborn, and DeMar and Lowry benefited the most from our previous style of play. Nurse can't go straight to those guys as he'd be undermining Casey as well, which would actually show poor character on Nurse's part.
The question of leadership qualities should again be focused on Casey, as Nurse was brought in for his offensive savvy and was a resource Casey basically ignored until Masai all but threatened his job last offseason. A leader recognizes when to "follow" by listening to his top advisers.
The failures of someone to "lead" from a position with virtually no real authority isn't an indictment of how they'd do if given that authorit. Again, as an assistant Nurse could only impact game plans as much as Casey allowed him to...so your example is probably more reflective of Doc being better at acknowledging others' input than Casey ever was.
Sent from my HTC One using TapatalkThat is a normal collar. Move on, find a new slant.
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JimiCliff wrote: View PostBitching about what we see on the court is one thing. I think regular fans can have meaningful opinions on that. With regards to this, we have no idea.
Those that want nurse to coach will come up with diatribes that old stubborn Casey ignored his genius.
Those that don't want nurse will go off about it being all his system and ideas that didn't work9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum
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KeonClark wrote: View PostExactly. Just bias opinion.
Those that want nurse to coach will come up with diatribes that old stubborn Casey ignored his genius.
Those that don't want nurse will go off about it being all his system and ideas that didn't work
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I don't mind if they hire Nurse. By all accounts he will be a good to very good coach.
I just think that Casey got fired because of the Cleveland series, and the fact that the Raptors had no answers despite everything they tried, that falls on the whole staff. If you don't believe the Cleveland series was a failure of coaching, then I don't see why you fire Casey other than to scapegoat him. If you do believe that coaching heavily contributed, then hiring his lead assistant who was a principal part of the staff you believe failed doesn't strike me as the move you make.That is a normal collar. Move on, find a new slant.
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