Everything 2018 Playoffs!

[Shaolin Fantastic]

For every Philly there's teams like Orlando and Sacramento and Minnesota helplessly spinning their wheels in lottery hell for years. Tanking can definitely lead to great results, but it's far from a sure thing (no one way of building a team is close to a sure thing)

And even if you do land generational talent, that's also far from a guarantee that you'll win a title (though I do think the whole "championship or bust" mentality can often be a bit extreme). OKC drafted and had three(!) future MVPs on the same team, but they never won a championship, and it doesn't look like they'll win one anytime soon

The OKC example is such a strawman.

If their owner wasn't a cheap fuck and they just paid Harden, they definitely would've won one by now with that core.

[Rudy Bargnani]

I think Masai is smart enough, good enough at drafting and player development that it would work. Yes it requires luck as well, but so does winning the title the "traditional" way.

Part of me wonders if Masai is so smart and good at drafting that tanking wouldn’t work for the raps.
Let’s say you trade Lowry, Derozan, Ibaka for picks. With OG, Siakam, Delon, Jak, that team is probably better than 5-6 teams every year. The young pieces he’d accumulate each year would make them as successful as the Lakers this year.

[golden]

Everything 2018 Playoffs!

They have cap space for a LeBron or Paul George, the 10th and 26th picks this year, and a recovered/rehabbed Markelle Fultz. Going to be tough if not borderline impossible to deal with them starting next year.

Paul George is the perfect fit for Philly, not Lebron. With Simmons and Embiid, you need shooters and guys who will defend. PG is basically an extremely rich man’s 3 & D who is a plug & play upgrade for Covington. Lebron forces your whole team to adjust to him, and sometimes that doesn’t work.

F*ck the Process

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[Scraptor]

Paul George is the perfect fit for Philly, not Lebron. With Simmons and Embiid, you need shooters and guys who will defend. PG is basically an extremely rich man’s 3 & D who is a plug & play upgrade for Covington. Lebron forces your whole team to adjust to him, and sometimes that doesn’t work.

F*ck the Process

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Agreed. Also you don't want LeBron to curb the development of Simmons/Embiid/Fultz. But who knows wtf BC will do with all these options. He's done a solid job this year with Redick/Ilyasova/Belinelli, but this is a franchise-defining summer for him.

[hotfuzz]

For every Philly there's teams like Orlando and Sacramento and Minnesota helplessly spinning their wheels in lottery hell for years. Tanking can definitely lead to great results, but it's far from a sure thing (no one way of building a team is close to a sure thing)

And even if you do land generational talent, that's also far from a guarantee that you'll win a title (though I do think the whole "championship or bust" mentality can often be a bit extreme). OKC drafted and had three(!) future MVPs on the same team, but they never won a championship, and it doesn't look like they'll win one anytime soon

Those teams didn't even tank properly (in that they will still have a few veterans around helping them win games). Like everything, you have to truly commit to it. Completely bottom out for 3-4 years and collect all the draft picks you can by taking on bad contracts etc.

OKC made the finals and reached WCF multiple times. I'd say their tank was pretty successful. They just fucked it up near the end where Presti didn't sign Harden because of Perkins. That was a colossally dumb move.

[Nilanka]

For every Philly there's teams like Orlando and Sacramento and Minnesota helplessly spinning their wheels in lottery hell for years. Tanking can definitely lead to great results, but it's far from a sure thing (no one way of building a team is close to a sure thing)

And even if you do land generational talent, that's also far from a guarantee that you'll win a title (though I do think the whole "championship or bust" mentality can often be a bit extreme). OKC drafted and had three(!) future MVPs on the same team, but they never won a championship, and it doesn't look like they'll win one anytime soon

I think we can all agree that winning a championship is damn near impossible without a "generational talent". And the simplest way to obtain that generational talent, is through the draft. And the odds of nailing that draft pick increases the higher you draft. That's it....the essence of tanking.

Now factor in the million other variables that affect winning, regardless of which strategy you use to build your roster.

[KeonClark]

Philly advances in 5, and the old tank talk fires back up. How predictable.

[S.R.]

All the anti-tanking people; how do you reconcile your beliefs with Sixers' success?

The Sixers success doesn't change anything.

Blowing up a roster and rebuilding it through the draft can work. It's worked before, it's working with the Sixers, it'll work again. We can dig into all the factors/considerations/contexts to discuss on the topic, none of the discussion is changed.

I don't know if many people here are absolutely anti-tanking? Maybe a couple. The debate is usually around timing, when you do it vs when you don't.

The Sixers for their part were a crappy team that was peaking at around .500 at best for a solid 10+ year period before they got sick of it and decided to tank like hell. They needed to be the worst (or almost worst) team in the league for 4 straight years and whiff on a couple of their lotto picks, before they finally turned a corner. Good for them, they certainly paid their dues.

Don't hand them any awards yet though, you don't know if they're the next dynasty or the next Oden/Roy Blazers yet.

[Demographic Shift]

All the anti-tanking people; how do you reconcile your beliefs with Sixers' success?

A couple ways....

One or two playoff apperances in a decade for the Hinkies.......hell of a price to pay ...

Phoenix is using the same strategy.... and they continue to circle the drain without much progress..........8 years and counting since they even made the playoffs....

[KeonClark]

I'm wondering if shaolin fantastic and his colourful language when I dare criticize the entrepreneur kawhi Leonard would like to explain why he couldn't attend a single playoff game for his team

[A.I]

I'm wondering if shaolin fantastic and his colourful language when I dare criticize the entrepreneur kawhi Leonard would like to explain why he couldn't attend a single playoff game for his team

You know, I was hoping Kawhi would return the game after Pop’s wife passed away. Would have made for a terrific moment. Didn’t happen sadly.


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[Nilanka]

What's been happening with Kawhi? I haven't really been following the situation. Has he been medically cleared to play, but choosing to sit out?

[suspenders]

What's been happening with Kawhi? I haven't really been following the situation. Has he been medically cleared to play, but choosing to sit out?

If he was medically cleared to play, but chose to sit out, can he contractually do that?

[KeonClark]

What's been happening with Kawhi? I haven't really been following the situation. Has he been medically cleared to play, but choosing to sit out?

He was medically cleared but didn't feel right. Got a second opinion that said he wasn't ready. Hangs out in new York with his camp rehabbing. Spurs have tough time reaching him by phone, doesn't attend games

[planetmars]

If he was medically cleared to play, but chose to sit out, can he contractually do that?

Well the story that the public has heard is that the Spurs Medical staff has cleared him to play. But Kwahi and his team got a second opinion and his own doctors don't feel he's ready to play. Kwahi and his team are listening to that second opinion.

This has created some friction among him and the rest of the team. Especially considering people play hurt in the playoffs all the time. Kwahi however is up for a big raise and probably doesn't want to jeopardize his future. So he's looking out for himself first over perhaps his team.