Everything 2018 NBA draft

[Demographic Shift]

Ask the Italian soccer fans who throw bananas at the black players in their league (even ones who are Italian like Balotelli) about that.

What about the Jays fans who hold Edwin and Jose and Alomar and Moseby and Bell and Delgado as their best players.
The Golf crowd who still line up behind Tiger Woods even after his personal life went to shit
Football fans like Tom Brady.... they deify Jim Brown....
Mo Salah is pretty popular in the Premier League.

On the ice.. the floor.. the field .....talent matters more than colour, religion ... just win baby.
Is their racism in sports... sure... just not to the degree you'd like to fan the flames for.

[Apollo]

Projected range taken: 40-50

If Kyle is gone this would be a good pick to purchase for some instant production out of a prospect.

[DanH]

https://mobile.twitter.com/wojespn/s...tsdaily.com%2F


Lakers just bought a pick MU is starting to piss me off

Lakers traded for that pick. They sent cash, yes, but also the Bulls' 2019 2nd which may well be higher than 39th next year.

[Apollo]

This is the main reason for the skepticism. The level of play is higher in the Euroleague but the athletic ability of the players isn't. Scouts are worried that Doncic's domination in Europe might not translate against NBA defenses that are loaded with elite athletes .

I think Doncic is going to be a better NBA fantasy player than than most but not a winner. Not unless he's 3rd option... Maybe 2nd option. He's not gonna be the franchise.

[LJ2]

Not really. While college players generally don't have the strength or experience of Euro league players, they do have the athleticism advantage and its comparable to the NBA. Not all but enough of them where they can run film on prospects against strong athletes in college ball and extrapolate out. It's tough to do that with Doncic because he's not facing many NBA level athletes. Those he has faced however he didn't favor well against this season.

This is my thinking as well, but equally as important...in Euro League players are full time atheltes. In NCAA they have other obligations like school. You have to think a collegiate student will improve that much more from college to the pros when they are playing, eating and breathing basketball full time whereas the Euro League player is somewhat already doing that.

[Shaolin Fantastic]

What about the Jays fans who hold Edwin and Jose and Alomar and Moseby and Bell and Delgado as their best players.
The Golf crowd who still line up behind Tiger Woods even after his personal life went to shit
Football fans like Tom Brady.... they deify Jim Brown....
Mo Salah is pretty popular in the Premier League.

On the ice.. the floor.. the field .....talent matters more than colour, religion ... just win baby.
Is their racism in sports... sure... just not to the degree you'd like to fan the flames for.

Racism is still pervasive in sports (especially hockey and soccer) just like it is in the rest of society.

[golden]

Not really. While college players generally don't have the strength or experience of Euro league players, they do have the athleticism advantage and its comparable to the NBA. Not all but enough of them where they can run film on prospects against strong athletes in college ball and extrapolate out. It's tough to do that with Doncic because he's not facing many NBA level athletes. Those he has faced however he didn't favor well against this season.

Good points. And NBA players are getting even more freakishly athletic as each year passes. I didn't know that Doncic struggled against NBA level athletes in EuroLeague. You have some references for that?

[Apollo]

Good points. And NBA players are getting even more freakishly athletic as each year passes. I didn't know that Doncic struggled against NBA level athletes in EuroLeague. You have some references for that?

I read it numerous times now with various examples but here's one:

Doncic’s lack of initial burst and quickness is the other worry in the eyes of scouts. He struggles to create separation off the dribble, and he might not be as successful against defenses who can switch screens and put a longer athletic defender on him, as opposed to more conservative schemes which create driving and passing lanes for the ball handler. Pressuring Doncic with an elite athlete is exactly how Panathinaikos attacked him in the quarterfinals of the EuroLeague playoffs. They won Game 1 of the best-of-five series by throwing multiple bodies at Doncic, beating him up as much as possible, and using Thanasis Antetokounmpo, the older brother of Giannis who had a brief stint in the NBA, to hound him for 94 feet. Doncic never got comfortable, and he finished with 10 points and one assist on 2-of-5 shooting

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2018/5...gue-final-four

[Demographic Shift]

Racism is still pervasive in sports (especially hockey and soccer) just like it is in the rest of society.

This is going nowhere productive...

[Apollo]

This is going nowhere productive...

I agree, let's not derail a great thread with that conversation. Its off topic #1.

[Demographic Shift]

This is the main reason for the skepticism. The level of play is higher in the Euroleague but the athletic ability of the players isn't. Scouts are worried that Doncic's domination in Europe might not translate against NBA defenses that are loaded with elite athletes .

The NHL used to consider almost unilaterally that Euros were skilled but they were soft and could not stand up to the tough going of the NHL. It took a while (almost 15 years) before that train of thought wound up in the dumpster. Ovie is the toughest SOB to lace them up in the league right now.

So too will the idea that the Euros aren't athletically skilled enough subside... Capella, Gobert, Nitliannaka (sic) are the vanguard that is breaking that line of thinking down.

[Apollo]

The NHL used to consider almost unilaterally that Euros were skilled but they were soft and could not stand up to the tough going of the NHL. It took a while (almost 15 years) before that train of thought wound up in the dumpster. Ovie is the toughest SOB to lace them up in the league right now.

So too will the idea that the Euros aren't athletically skilled enough subside... Capella, Gobert, Nitliannaka (sic) are the vanguard that is breaking that line of thinking down.

The knock on Doncic isn't as weak as a mandatory phoned in stereotype or label. Its based on real games. Real games where he struggles when faced with elite athletes. You won't find a single person saying Doncic is from Europe so he's not a strong athlete. Most teams in the lotto are trying to save their jobs, they're not armchair quarterbacks with no skin in the game.

[Other Scott]

Not really. While college players generally don't have the strength or experience of Euro league players, they do have the athleticism advantage and its comparable to the NBA. Not all but enough of them where they can run film on prospects against strong athletes in college ball and extrapolate out. It's tough to do that with Doncic because he's not facing many NBA level athletes. Those he has faced however he didn't favor well against this season.

I just don't think that's true, do you really think the average player on the University of South Carolina is as athletic as the average player on Maccabi Tel Aviv? And even if you do think so, why is playing against athletic defenders a more valuable measure than playing against strong experienced defenders? It's easier to beat an athletic defender making mistakes than a smart defender.

[golden]

I agree, let's not derail a great thread with that conversation. Its off topic #1.

The conversation really isn't off-topic, it's just a very uncomfortable one. We are talking about the potential #1 pick of the draft and unfortunately bias and stereotypes, real or imagined, are at play here. I learned something (from you!) which I wouldn't otherwise have known about Doncic, so it was a useful discussion to have, IMO.

[S.R.]

Not really. While college players generally don't have the strength or experience of Euro league players, they do have the athleticism advantage and its comparable to the NBA. Not all but enough of them where they can run film on prospects against strong athletes in college ball and extrapolate out. It's tough to do that with Doncic because he's not facing many NBA level athletes. Those he has faced however he didn't favor well against this season.

Yeah drafting guys is only partially about the resume to date but is more weighted towards projected development, a huge piece of which is body + athleticism. How good is the 19 year old going to be 5-10 years from now?

Nobody can predict the future tho, hence all the whiffs and busts.