Game #45 Raptors (32-12) @ Wizards (18-25) Sunday January 13th, 2019. SN1.6:00pm(London,England)7:00pm(Douala,Cameroon)8 :00pm(Vilnius, Lithuania) 2:30pm(St Johns) 2:00pm(Halifax) 1:00pm(Toronto) 12:00pm(Winnipeg) 11:00am(Calgary) 10:00am(Vancouver)

[The Great One]

This dude really is ahead of Kawhi in the MVP race? yeah what he's doing offensively is pretty impressive. But let's not forget that Kawhi is averaging 27ppg this year and is a lockdown defender unlike Harden who plays D like he doesn't give a shit.

James Harden scored 38 points on Sunday, but he was 1-17 from three, tying Damon Stoudamire’s NBA record for most missed three-pointers in a game.

�� https://t.co/4yTeCK8xUS pic.twitter.com/FtjlslhlFV

— StatMuse (@statmuse) January 14, 2019

[MixxAOR]

This dude really is ahead of Kawhi in the MVP race? yeah what he's doing offensively is pretty impressive. But let's not forget that Kawhi is averaging 27ppg this year and is a lockdown defender unlike Harden who plays D like he doesn't give a shit.

James Harden scored 38 points on Sunday, but he was 1-17 from three, tying Damon Stoudamire’s NBA record for most missed three-pointers in a game.

�� https://t.co/4yTeCK8xUS pic.twitter.com/FtjlslhlFV

— StatMuse (@statmuse) January 14, 2019

yeah but Kawhi plays for Toronto

[Yuri Gagarin]

Og’s value is slowly dropping and Beals is climbing steadily I think the chances have become nil unless siakam is involved and f that. Missed the boat.

[Yuri Gagarin]

Too bad we didnt get bellinelli in that deal hes tearing it up from deep. Feels like he was on raptors 20 years ago

[KeonClark]

This dude really is ahead of Kawhi in the MVP race? yeah what he's doing offensively is pretty impressive. But let's not forget that Kawhi is averaging 27ppg this year and is a lockdown defender unlike Harden who plays D like he doesn't give a shit.

James Harden scored 38 points on Sunday, but he was 1-17 from three, tying Damon Stoudamire’s NBA record for most missed three-pointers in a game.

�� https://t.co/4yTeCK8xUS pic.twitter.com/FtjlslhlFV

— StatMuse (@statmuse) January 14, 2019

Lol how do you score 38 AND tie a missed shots record

[Mitchell Duong]

Lol how do you score 38 AND tie a missed shots record

You get the amount of whistles that Kawhi could only dream of.

[JimiCliff]

This dude really is ahead of Kawhi in the MVP race? yeah what he's doing offensively is pretty impressive. But let's not forget that Kawhi is averaging 27ppg this year and is a lockdown defender unlike Harden who plays D like he doesn't give a shit.

James Harden scored 38 points on Sunday, but he was 1-17 from three, tying Damon Stoudamire’s NBA record for most missed three-pointers in a game.

�� https://t.co/4yTeCK8xUS pic.twitter.com/FtjlslhlFV

— StatMuse (@statmuse) January 14, 2019

The real story here is: how in god's name did Stoudamire manage to miss sixteen threes in a game in HIS ERA? That, my friends, is a man with no conscience!

[G__Deane]

Lol how do you score 38 AND tie a missed shots record

NEVER turn down a shot lol

[TheWaterboy]

I don't think we go after Beal, despite lacking scoring punch far more often than we would like, for a number of reasons.

Let's be clear on a few things, remembering that if Beal comes here, he will be a starter.

Firstly: if we keep Kyle, Beal is likely playing at shooting guard. This means one of three configurations: Green goes to the Wizards, Siakim goes to the Wizards, or one of Ibaka/Val goes to the Wizards.

If Green goes to the Wizards, we have a starting lineup of Lowry/Beal/Kawhi/Siakim/Ibaka. This is a lineup which should score in bunches, yes, but Beal on defense is a significant downgrade from the sharp, super-consistent and (most importantly) tone-setting defence we have been getting from Green all year. I feel like Green out, Beal in will not just affect individual defence, but also team defence as well, by moving the team into noticeably more of a I'm-gonna-get-mine mode than where they are now.

Green is also one of our few vets on the team and a locker room leader, and would also likely require more talent from the reserves to be going back. The downsides outweigh the benefits in my opinion, even on a win-now basis.

If Siakim goes to the Wizards, we have a starting lineup of Lowry/Beal/Green/Kawhi/Ibaka. We lose size and rebounding overall, which will affect us significantly in certain playoff matchups. (Also, our scoring in transition would be less deadly.) Then, of course, we are probably kicking ourselves in a couple years (assuming Pascal hasn't reached his ceiling yet).

But I also think that the offensive uptick if Pascal is the starter who goes back in a Beal trade is not guaranteed to materialize overall. In my opinion, Siakim has the best offensive chemistry with Kawhi on the team. I think our sets get more stagnant with Beal replacing Siakim even if they're not drawn up that way. And of course we lose wingspan, which is probably going to adversely affect our defense. Again, the downsides outweigh the benefits in my opinion, even on a win-now basis.

Lastly, if Ibaka goes to the Wizards, we have a starting lineup of Lowry/Beal/Green/Kawhi/Siakam or Lowry/Beal/Green/Kawhi/Val. If Ibaka is gone, we are left without a true defensive stopper at center (and less defensive chemistry and identity as well, I think.) We will lack size/bulk and can potentially be bullied by physical teams in the playoffs as a result. We might be relying on Monroe for heavy frontcourt minutes even when Val gets back. And I think Siakim will be much less effective scoring-wise at the 5 if the other team doesn't decide to go small when he's there. (Kawhi plus Siakim and one of Valunciunas or Ibaka has a much more effective inside-out game than Kawhi and just one of them do; I think we defintiely want to keep Kawhi at SF.)

So what other trades are possible? I don't think Washington go for a trade for Beal without one of our starters included, and we are not sending them Kawhi. Maybe there's a Beal for Lowry plus pieces swap in there, but I'm not sure we can find it. We are probably better off going for someone like Lin than for Beal, I think.

Despite all of the above, I do believe that a trade for Beal would make our team more talented; there just isn't a particularly good roster fit in most of these proposed . Talent is important but it isn't everything. Look at all of the talent that the Celtics have... but which even a talented coach like Stevens hasn't figured out how to make work together yet.

[golden]

Colour me confused as to the thinking of some of the trade proposals.

The Raptors have been working on integrating two new players to the team (Kawhi and Green) into the starting rotation. They've moved another starter to a new position (Serge) and moved a member of last year's bench into the starting lineup (Siakam). They've played most of the year missing players for extended periods of time, with more games missed this year than the entirety of last season.

All those changes mean we still haven't seen what the team is capable of, and yet some want to 'blow things up' for Beal

*IF* Kawhi leaves in the off-season, you're left with a core of Lowry, JV, and Beal ... that... seems familiar

Trading FVV, Norm, OG & Miles = blowing it up(?) is a lot more confusing to me. Those guys are all wildly inconsistent (Miles is completely out of the rotation). Beal is an all-star. More importantly, he's clutch, which we lack. Satoransky is an underrated, multi-position role player. We lack playmaking & shot-creation from the backcourt, which is critical in the playoffs.

Beal ticks a lot of boxes, he's still young and under a reasonable contract compared to his production. The only question is the asking price. I'm not willing to give up Siakam because that just creates another void that is even more difficult to fill. After FVV and Norm got paid, they've become replacement level players at those salaries and Masai is a savant at finding cheap talent to fill secondary roles.

[Quirk]

Trading FVV, Norm, OG & Miles = blowing it up(?) is a lot more confusing to me.

Totally. I'm not even a big Beal fan, but if you can get Beal for any or all of those guys, you do it, offer Green and Wright too if that's what it takes, though we would miss them, especially Green in the starting lineup. Heck, if they want Serge in a Beal trade, bye by Ibaka.

Beal is a strange player though, clutch and gifted offensive player, below average defensive player, not great production stats, good impact stats especially on the offensive end. Kahwi could definitely play harder on the defensive end if Beal was in the starting lineup, so should be a net positive.

I just don't see us having anything Washing wants tho, and no way that KL, KL, or JV are on the table. But I was 100% sure that the Spures would not want DeRozan in any Leanard trade, so here's hoping the Wizards are love with FVV and Ibaka or something.

[LJ2]

Mixx would trade Siakam for Beal. OG &FVV ++ could get it done. I’m okay with that, if we take back Sato. Who knows, really, since we’re not in those talks.

Wait, I thought Beal was an empty stats guy? In all seriousness we just can't afford to lose Siakam and JV for this playoff drive. I'd really hate to give up on OG this early, but if the goal is to win a championship this year then that is a price management will have to be willing to pay.

[G__Deane]

Fans shouldn't get too worked up about trade ideas for Beal. I highly doubt we have the best fit for the Wiz even if they decide to jettison him. As fans, we tend to just throw up our worst or most bench style players and throw in some trade chip or other spare parts and call it a day.

Bottom line is the Raps are not trading Siakam (or Green imo) and OG, Miles, Norm and JV/Serge doesn't get it done.

[Demographic Shift]

Trading FVV, Norm, OG & Miles = blowing it up(?) is a lot more confusing to me. Those guys are all wildly inconsistent (Miles is completely out of the rotation). Beal is an all-star. More importantly, he's clutch, which we lack. Satoransky is an underrated, multi-position role player. We lack playmaking & shot-creation from the backcourt, which is critical in the playoffs.

Beal ticks a lot of boxes, he's still young and under a reasonable contract compared to his production. The only question is the asking price. I'm not willing to give up Siakam because that just creates another void that is even more difficult to fill. After FVV and Norm got paid, they've become replacement level players at those salaries and Masai is a savant at finding cheap talent to fill secondary roles.

Trading FVV, Norm, OG & Miles for Beal.... Raps do this 100 times out of 100...

The Whiz ?
Lets try a re engineer that from a Raptors perspective if was Leonard rather than Beal on the block .

To the Lakers.. Kawhi Leonard

To the Raptors
Rajon Rondo.. a backup PG who maps to FVV.. perhaps more skill balances that he is much older than FVV
Josh Hart...a SG with some upside who maps to Norm
Kentavious Caldwell Pope ... a SF/SG who is looking for his next deal just like the guy he maps to CJ Miles.
Kuzma has shown more than OG has in his second year....

Do the Lakers do this... in a New York minute...
Do the Raptors do this ? Prolly the same response the Whiz have on that proposed Beal exchange.

[golden]

Wait, I thought Beal was an empty stats guy? In all seriousness we just can't afford to lose Siakam and JV for this playoff drive. I'd really hate to give up on OG this early, but if the goal is to win a championship this year then that is a price management will have to be willing to pay.

You gotta read posts more carefully. "... not an empty stats guy", but not for Siakam + JV/Ibaka, or whatever dumb trade idea is out there.