Yet another RAPS-76ers-Bobcats Deal...

[Jurassic Raptor]

Blingbling, i'm worried about you. Sniffing glue blasts? What are you, 12? Now, where to start. I'm not saying Iggy is god-like (i'm not religious either), he could put up 20, 6 and 5 for us though and that makes him better than anyone on your team. So he may not be GREAT on a normal team, he'd be great on the Raptors. I never referred to Parker so i'm not sure the point of that. Very few teams have great 4th quarter closers, period. The Nets were looking at trading their first round pick, so do lots of teams despite scouting and evaluating them. Why? Because in the NBA a proven commodity is often more value than a prospect that may, or may not pan out.

As for "we" running through my posts. No, surprisingly i'm not a part owner, I don't play for the team or coach them. I'm a fan, presumably like you are. I'd say most sports fans refer to their favorite team in "we" and "us" terms. I'm surprised you never noticed. Then again, if you are 12 then that would make sense.

Trife...Hawes clearly wasn't the reason I thought this trade would help. I'd love a legit banger to play D and rebound for us, but in this deal he was all we could really get. As for the Sixers, I think Jose still has a lot of value and they get a lot of cap relieve from losing Williams too. Is Iggy overpaid, yup. But are most guys in the NBA? Also yup.

[mr_blingbling]

Reply to Mango

I understand that you probably love the Raps as much as I do, but it's MLSE's team.

P.S. I will be easier in the future

get at me

[mr_blingbling]

Reply to Jurassic

my apologies for glue remark, got carried away, but I just think that your trade does not improve the Raps at all.
-Igoudala helped the sixers get all of 27 wins last year, but maybe he could help the Raptors get a low seed for the playoffs.
-point of Parker was just an example of overpayed guys who can't earn their money.
-your right few teams have great fourth quarter closers, but the teams that do are the ones who are going deep and competing for championships in the playoffs every year. point is you got to get one or develop one if you want to be dominant in the league.
-yeah the Nets were trying to trade their pick, but it was to get Carmelo man, a fourth quarter closer!, not Igoudala c'mon it's not the same.
-yes I'm a fan to and no I'm not 12, I'm a young man who loves the Raps, I watch them on tv, I go to the games, I buy the merchandise and am proud they play in the city that I'm born and raised in but at the same time for some reason I realize that it's not my team, I'm just a fan, I'm sorry to all the people I probably offend when i say that and this but it's true, we are just fans,(no ownership entitlement for being a fan), i just think it's kind of naive to try and include myself with the team when I don't contribute to it.
last thing
-most sports fans refer to their favorite team in "we" and "us" terms? how can you make a statement like that, how do you know this, that's millions upon millions of people in who knows how many cities your talking about, do you have like a survey statistical result proving this or are you just blurting something out to look like a know-it-all. have you seriously heard the majority of fans in north america talk about their favorite teams with we and us terms? the world doesn't end after the Toronto borders dude!
-Kleiza backing up Bargnani? for real man?

get at me

[MangoKid]

What year was he an all star ?
He isnt an all star....im not saying he couldnt help this team but for what he makes its not worth it....unless they willing to take trash like Jose in return...

He's a BORDERLINE all-star, and you're kidding yourself if you don't think he is. For the package the OP posted, it would be foolish not to jump on it. For those that say that he'd be taking away from the development of Weems, fuck that. We only HOPE that Weems turns out to be anywhere close to the player Iguodala is. He can play 2 or 3, and in a pinch when you decide to go small, he's tough and athletic enough to play the 4. I'd take that deal in a nano-second.

[JoePanini]

He's a BORDERLINE all-star, and you're kidding yourself if you don't think he is. For the package the OP posted, it would be foolish not to jump on it. For those that say that he'd be taking away from the development of Weems, fuck that. We only HOPE that Weems turns out to be anywhere close to the player Iguodala is. He can play 2 or 3, and in a pinch when you decide to go small, he's tough and athletic enough to play the 4. I'd take that deal in a nano-second.

Yeah, you might do it, but I'm just happy you are not our GM. We get three, score first players. Iggy, is a good player, he is fast, athletic, and is very versatile, but has averaged 16 6 5 in 38 minutes in his career. Last year he scored 17 points a game, in 39 minutes. For a "star" player and go-to-guy those aren't great numbers. Bargnani averaged 17 points in 4 minutes less, and Bargs wasn't even our first option. Also, Iggy would stunt the growth for all our players at both 2 and 3 spot. Coincidentally, the 2 and the 3 are where our young and promising play (Weems, DeRozan, Wright, Kleiza). Those four players would get significantly less minutes. Also, this trade sends Calderon and his contract far from TO, but we get another shoot-first PG? Having two borderline PG isn't good for a team, I'd rather have Calderon than two SGs who are disguised as PGs.
I've also grown fond of Evans, Johnson, Davis and Dorsey. This trade sends three of them away, and sends one to the bench (which won't happen, no way Bargs moving to the 4 to let Hawes start). Oh, Hawes is crap. I'd take Evans over him, I'd take Dorsey over him, I'd take Davis over him.

So other than getting Iggy (who is extremely overrated, but still extremely talented and still young), why would we even consider this trade? I don't think you see what we lose in this trade, and what we actually get.

[MangoKid]

Yeah, you might do it, but I'm just happy you are not our GM. We get three, score first players. Iggy, is a good player, he is fast, athletic, and is very versatile, but has averaged 16 6 5 in 38 minutes in his career. Last year he scored 17 points a game, in 39 minutes. For a "star" player and go-to-guy those aren't great numbers. Bargnani averaged 17 points in 4 minutes less, and Bargs wasn't even our first option. Also, Iggy would stunt the growth for all our players at both 2 and 3 spot. Coincidentally, the 2 and the 3 are where our young and promising play (Weems, DeRozan, Wright, Kleiza). Those four players would get significantly less minutes. Also, this trade sends Calderon and his contract far from TO, but we get another shoot-first PG? Having two borderline PG isn't good for a team, I'd rather have Calderon than two SGs who are disguised as PGs.
I've also grown fond of Evans, Johnson, Davis and Dorsey. This trade sends three of them away, and sends one to the bench (which won't happen, no way Bargs moving to the 4 to let Hawes start). Oh, Hawes is crap. I'd take Evans over him, I'd take Dorsey over him, I'd take Davis over him.

So other than getting Iggy (who is extremely overrated, but still extremely talented and still young), why would we even consider this trade? I don't think you see what we lose in this trade, and what we actually get.

Dude, I'm glad YOU'RE not the GM of our team. You're crazy not to accept a deal like that. So, you wouldn't trade Calderon, Evans, Dorsey and Davis for Igoudala? Evans is a FA, Dorsey is essentially bench fodder, Calderon is declining slowly and Davis is unproven.
We's instantaneouly have our swingman to pair with DeRozan, save money in the process and would still have our TPE in tact. The fact that he's a swingman that can average 17 6 and 6 is pretty damn good. I believe that trade is a no-brainer if it ever presented itself. Hell, we were rejoicing at the fact at acquiring Chandler and Diaw for Evans and Calderon, so I don't understand the negativity at throwing in Davis and Dorsey for a guy who is an excellent basketball player. And did you really say stunt the growth of guys like Weems, Kleiza, Wright? Kleiza is a stretch 4, shoudn't be the starting 3, Weems compared to Iguodala (really?) - Weems WISHES he could be someone like Igoudala and Julian Wright is exactly what he is - a backup forward. Some Raptor fans need to stop overvaluing our players.
Iguodala isn't "THE GUY" for a team, but he'd be another asset for our team. He'd make this team better than the 4 players being jettison would.
In addition, we'd get Hawes, who is a legit 7 footer and you can move Bargnani back to the 4. Augustin as a backup 1 would be dynamite. I mean, this deal would NEVER happen, the Sixers would never entertain the thought of this deal, but if it were presented, I'd suspect that Colangelo would jump all over it.

[JoePanini]

Dude, I'm glad YOU'RE not the GM of our team. You're crazy not to accept a deal like that. So, you wouldn't trade Calderon, Evans, Dorsey and Davis for Igoudala? Evans is a FA, Dorsey is essentially bench fodder, Calderon is declining slowly and Davis is unproven.
We's instantaneouly have our swingman to pair with DeRozan, save money in the process and would still have our TPE in tact. The fact that he's a swingman that can average 17 6 and 6 is pretty damn good. I believe that trade is a no-brainer if it ever presented itself. Hell, we were rejoicing at the fact at acquiring Chandler and Diaw for Evans and Calderon, so I don't understand the negativity at throwing in Davis and Dorsey for a guy who is an excellent basketball player. And did you really say stunt the growth of guys like Weems, Kleiza, Wright? Kleiza is a stretch 4, shoudn't be the starting 3, Weems compared to Iguodala (really?) - Weems WISHES he could be someone like Igoudala and Julian Wright is exactly what he is - a backup forward. Some Raptor fans need to stop overvaluing our players.
Iguodala isn't "THE GUY" for a team, but he'd be another asset for our team. He'd make this team better than the 4 players being jettison would.
In addition, we'd get Hawes, who is a legit 7 footer and you can move Bargnani back to the 4. Augustin as a backup 1 would be dynamite. I mean, this deal would NEVER happen, the Sixers would never entertain the thought of this deal, but if it were presented, I'd suspect that Colangelo would jump all over it.

You don't consider team needs? We clearly don't need a swing-man, and we don't need one who demands the ball. Why kill the chemistry we have, and we have a group of guys now, who seem to like TO, Iggy would probably leave after his 3 year contract expires. The only plus side of this trade is giving up Jose, because Reggie gives us energy and rebounding, and he's an expiring contract. Dorsey might be a bench warmer, but he'll be playing Amir's role last year, which is very important. Davis is unproven, and we should give him time. I love him, followed him in college and I was extremely happy we drafted him. Our team has chemistry, and chemistry is all it will have.
The reason the Chandler trade was so great is because it got us a CENTER. We desperately need a guy like Chandler, and Hawes might be a center, his stats seem decent but he is crap. And moving Bargs "back" to the 4? Bargnani is a center, he plays best at the center spot, he causes mismatches when he plays at the center spot. Him being a natural 4 is just a myth.
And I didn't even mention Weems being like Iguodala or ever being as good as him, you just made that out of nowhere.

Look at our line-up after this trade.

Jack
Augustin
Weems
Barbosa
DeRozan
Iguodala
Wright
Kleiza
Johnson
Hawes
Bargnani

I'm not sure if that's the entire roster, but if it is, we would only have 11 players. And note that we would have 6 players who can play SG. 5 who can play SF. And we would have a huge hole at the PF spot. With Johnson usually in foul trouble, and Kleiza a stretch 4 (he's 6'8") if we put Kleiza and Bargs on together we will have some serious size and rebounding issues.

[Jurassic Raptor]

Blingbling, your reply made sense man, don't get me wrong, I don't think this is the BEST trade for us, it was just what I came up with in a spare 15 minutes. Oh, and for the record the whole "we" and "us" thing use to really piss me off, I completely agreed with you. Then I found myself doing it! WTF?? I don't know why, but I should probably stop or aim for a water boy job. That said, i've travelled a lot and yeah, lots of people referring to their team as "we". It's stupid and passionate at the same time I think.

When I posted this trade I clearly didn't think it through fully and I also didn't think Iggy would generate so much reaction.

Mango...I love your thoughts on this! But, Joe and Bling make good points. I'd love Iggy because he is simply a great all around basketball player. He would be a good second or third fiddle on a championship team but for us he's a star. That said, Iggy has his limitations, we do have a lot of swingmen if this goes through and losing Davis would sting a bit.

Can someone just find a way for us to get Melo and CP3?? Then we are going places!

[Trife76]

He's a BORDERLINE all-star, and you're kidding yourself if you don't think he is. For the package the OP posted, it would be foolish not to jump on it. For those that say that he'd be taking away from the development of Weems, fuck that. We only HOPE that Weems turns out to be anywhere close to the player Iguodala is. He can play 2 or 3, and in a pinch when you decide to go small, he's tough and athletic enough to play the 4. I'd take that deal in a nano-second.

iguodala is a decent player but he isnt borderline anything....he's at best a 2nd option guy whos inconsistent...at that price point ? hell no....and he aint a winner...he's a classic stat guy on a bad team who doesnt win you games....SF version of Al Jeff deal wit it