Extend Lowry?

[charlesnba23]

Extend Lowry 3yr 24M$

[KeonClark]

How does the Knicks rumored offer of Felton & MWP prove that 'we' undervalue him?

If that's among the best offers MU has received for Lowry, then it would appear to be far more likely that 'we' are overvaluing Lowry, compared to other GMs.

Why are you getting so upset? I said he was top FIFTEEN, meaning, y'know, 14th or 15th! I gave you actual legitimate stats in every major category but now we're "cherry picking random stats"..then you go and list a bunch of guys with potential and change the category to include those "who GM's most covet in the future".

Then you FINALLY shorten your list to guys who are actually BETTER than LOWRY now, and what do you know, I count THIRTEEN guys. So basically, you're fighting way too hard on this one.

[chris]

http://is.gd/5qi3w7

Lowry is easilly top 10 on your list in terms of performance this season.



.

congratulations on definitively proving that kyle lowry is one of the very best players in the nba.

but considering his age, contract situation, and that we may be in a rebuilding year, should we trade him for a younger long term project with high upside, like john wall, kyrie irving, or damian lillard? there are rumours that portland, cleveland, and washington are desperate and in win-now mode, so i can't see their GMs saying no to that.

the question is, should we do it? those players are not as good as kyle lowry, but they do have potential, and it might improve our own lottery odds this june by making our team worse.

[KeonClark]

congratulations on definitively proving that kyle lowry is one of the very best players in the nba.

but considering his age, contract situation, and that we may be in a rebuilding year, should we trade him for a younger long term project with high upside, like john wall, kyrie irving, or damian lillard? there are rumours that portland, cleveland, and washington are desperate and in win-now mode, so i can't see their GMs saying no to that.

the question is, should we do it? those players are not as good as kyle lowry, but they do have potential, and it might improve our own lottery odds this june by making our team worse.

Please tell me this whole post was tongue in cheek...

edit: saw some of your other posts. You're a sarcastic jerk, not a absolute dumb ass.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

Why are you getting so upset? I said he was top FIFTEEN, meaning, y'know, 14th or 15th! I gave you actual legitimate stats in every major category but now we're "cherry picking random stats"..then you go and list a bunch of guys with potential and change the category to include those "who GM's most covet in the future".

Then you FINALLY shorten your list to guys who are actually BETTER than LOWRY now, and what do you know, I count THIRTEEN guys. So basically, you're fighting way too hard on this one.

First, you replied to the wrong post.

Second, I listed 13 players for quirk, who I felt were beyond argument, as far as comparing Lowry to goes.

Third, I stand by the original list of players I presented (22 I think), as PGs I personally think are arguably better or at least equal to Lowry. I could spend hours digging up current and past stats to support this, describe evidence witnessed through countless 'eye-test' viewings, dig up expert analysis, reviews and summaries, but I don't have any desire to. It's not like any of the players I listed are scrubs or unknown to everybody here, and all of them are legitimate starters.

Fourth, you did cherry-pick stats. You compared stats for a single quarter-season, in a vacuum. Rondo hasn't played a game. Rose was never fully healthy, rusty and now injured again. Williams has been injured throughout the season. Irving has had a down season so far that isn't a fair representation of him as a complete player. If you used ESPN, both Bledsoe & Dragic are listed as SG. I could go on, but the fact is that stats in a vacuum don't 'prove' anything and the ones you used are incomplete/inaccurate, regardless of how you spin them to suit your pre-disposed bias and pre-determined conclusion.

Fifth, I stated my agreement that good debate could be had when comparing Lowry to several players on that original list, meaning it was very likely that consensus would be to put him somewhere in the 15-25 range. Given that my original post was in response to a claim that Lowry was a top-15 PG in the NBA, I stand by my belief that he's not.

Sixth, I'm not the least bit upset. If anything, I'm bewildered by the recent surge of excessive support for Raptors players, whether it's DeRozan, Johnson or Lowry. I'm assuming objectivity is being clouded by a combination of passionate support of 'our' Raptors, frustration over pro-tankers' continual call to trade these quality players/people, and anxiety over what the future holds with regards to MU's plans for each of them. I'm not Dr. Phil, but the angst on here lately has been palpable!

[CalgaryRapsFan]

Please tell me this whole post was tongue in cheek...

edit: saw some of your other posts. You're a sarcastic jerk, not a absolute dumb ass.

Please keep it respectful and avoid temptation to personally attack other posters you disagree with.

Cheers,
CRF

[enlightenment]

Go through the list of starting PG in the league and ask yourself if you'd honestly trade them for Lowry. Lowry would be lucky to even break the top-20 in the league when talent, potential, age, salary, etc... are all considered.

Starting PGs who are equal/better than Lowry:
- Rondo
- D-Williams
- MCW (Wroten also looks good on Philly)
- Rose
- Irving
- Jennings
- Hill
- Teague (Atlanta)
- Walker
- Wall
- Curry
- Paul
- Bledsoe
- Dragic
- Conley
- Holiday
- Parker (though not long-term due to age)
- Lawson
- Rubio
- Westbrook
- Lillard
- Burke (still raw but looks good early in his career)



I don't know if the anti-tank fumes have been let loose here in the republic lately or what, but this extreme over-evaluation of remaining Raptors players is getting silly.

Fine points, but you have to take a few names off that list.

Burke? Walker? Teague? Jennings? How are you defining better?

[CalgaryRapsFan]

Fine points, but you have to take a few names off that list.

Burke? Walker? Teague? Jennings? How are you defining better?

I actually said equal to or better. I probably should have left Burke off that list, though my comments about him and Parker should show that I consider them on the fringe of that list.

There's definitely argument to be had about where in that list Lowry falls, but the only point I was making is that Lowry is definitely not a top-15 PG in the NBA (when everybody is healthy). Personally, I'd probably put him around 20th currently. That would probably drop when considering his age and likelihood of requesting a $7-8M+ contract this offseason though.

[enlightenment]

I actually said equal to or better. I probably should have left Burke off that list, though my comments about him and Parker should show that I consider them on the fringe of that list.

There's definitely argument to be had about where in that list Lowry falls, but the only point I was making is that Lowry is definitely not a top-15 PG in the NBA (when everybody is healthy). Personally, I'd probably put him around 20th currently. That would probably drop when considering his age and likelihood of requesting a $7-8M+ contract this offseason though.

If you admit that there is definitely an argument to be had, how can you say that he is definitely NOT top-15? You phrased it better afterwards when you admit it comes from your own personal evaluation of these talents.

Considering his age, he is actually not even at his prime.

[chris]

Please tell me this whole post was tongue in cheek...

edit: saw some of your other posts. You're a sarcastic jerk, not a absolute dumb ass.

i'm not always a sarcastic jerk, usually just when i see things i think are completely retarded

anyhow, the fact that you even had to ask says a lot about some posters, uhh, optimism, with regards to the raptors roster

[enlightenment]

If you want to cherry-pick some stats in an attempt to 'prove' that Lowry is better than any players on this list (granted, some are indeed injured this season), go right ahead, but you'll never convince me (or most NBA GMs, I'd be willing to bet).

This is what I got from this quote:

"If you want to give me objective, performance based data, to 'prove' that this Player is better... go right ahead, but youll never convince me!"

AKA:
Your logical fallacy is: Anecdotal

It's often much easier for people to believe someone's testimony as opposed to understanding complex data and variation across a continuum. Quantitative scientific measures are almost always more accurate than personal perceptions and experiences, but our inclination is to believe that which is tangible to us, and/or the word of someone we trust over a more 'abstract' statistical reality.

[DanH]

Extend Lowry 3yr 24M$

Impossible. 3 years, 21.5 M is the max we can extend him for. He wouldn't take it.

[psrs1]

If you admit that there is definitely an argument to be had, how can you say that he is definitely NOT top-15? You phrased it better afterwards when you admit it comes from your own personal evaluation of these talents.

Considering his age, he is actually not even at his prime.

Do you still feel the same given his recent performance.

[psrs1]

It is time to extend Lowry!

[Nilanka]

It is time to extend Lowry!

Let's pretend you're Lowry's agent. Convince your client why it's best to sign an extension now, rather than causing a bidding war in the summer (which would inevitably drive up price).