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  • #16
    Not impressed at all. All his activity is mostly wasted movement, and he struggles to defend pretty much anyone.

    The player with the worst per-possession plus minus last night for the Raptors was Hansbrough, followed closely by JJ (who also looked pretty bad). It's no coincidence. He's still really bad, no matter how "good" he looks to some.
    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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    • #17
      DanH wrote: View Post
      Not impressed at all. All his activity is mostly wasted movement, and he struggles to defend pretty much anyone.

      The player with the worst per-possession plus minus last night for the Raptors was Hansbrough, followed closely by JJ (who also looked pretty bad). It's no coincidence. He's still really bad, no matter how "good" he looks to some.
      Couldn't disagree with you more. Also hate the plus minus jargon.
      It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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      • #18
        DanH wrote: View Post
        Not impressed at all. All his activity is mostly wasted movement, and he struggles to defend pretty much anyone.

        The player with the worst per-possession plus minus last night for the Raptors was Hansbrough, followed closely by JJ (who also looked pretty bad). It's no coincidence. He's still really bad, no matter how "good" he looks to some.
        We're talking about what he looked like in the first game. Where was all the wasted movement in that game? Who did he struggle to defend in that game? I thought he better than I've ever seen him before, but maybe I missed stuff. What "some" are looking at is where we might see signs of improvement, not a wow he's "good".

        What is "per possession plus minus", and how is it calculated? I searched and couldn't find either the stat or the definition. I've a feeling I'd put as much stock in it as the regular +/- though, which is nothing.

        Considering your assessment of DeMar and Casey from that game, I'm shocked you put any stock into +/- yourself, as an assessment of how a player performed. In that game, DeMar had the highest +/- (+4) amongst starters, while Kyle had the worst (-3) on the entire team, yet DeMar got ripped and nary a word about Kyle. And ripping Casey as "stupid" for subbing PPat in for JV with 2:27 to go, when JV's +/- was +3, and PPat had +11. Personally, as I said, I put zero stock in +/- numbers, but wondering why you're using them in assessing Hansbrough's game.

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        • #19
          DanH wrote: View Post
          Not impressed at all. All his activity is mostly wasted movement, and he struggles to defend pretty much anyone.

          The player with the worst per-possession plus minus last night for the Raptors was Hansbrough, followed closely by JJ (who also looked pretty bad). It's no coincidence. He's still really bad, no matter how "good" he looks to some.
          Its not his job Dan, his job is to be the guy that creates chaos. There is more to the game then stats.

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          • #20
            still waiting for that first regular season hansbrough 3. i will either cheer or throw up.

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            • #21
              iblastoff wrote: View Post
              still waiting for that first regular season hansbrough 3. i will either cheer or throw up.
              Possibly both? Throw up as the play develops and he jacks it up....then cheer with vomit rolling down your chin when it goes in....

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              • #22
                bryan colangelo wrote: View Post
                Jack Armstrong mentioned in the broadcast that Dominique Wilken's said that Hansbrough would have been great in his era of basketball, so I watched a classic game (Bulls vs Celtic's game 2) to see if he was right.

                It's insane how physical the game was back then. Most of the fouls would be flagrants in today's game. Hansbrough would have fit right in.
                That's an interesting point. I know LeBron James really does not like to play when Tyler Hansbrough is on the court. Tyler plays just a completely different kind of game from what LeBron is used to. And to be clear, Tyler is always going for the ball.

                Last season, by the way, he had 5 technical fouls total, the same number as LeBron, though of course James played a whole lot more. One of LeBron's was flagrant, as opposed to none of Hansbrough's. Cousins, Griffin, and Durant, all in the Western Conference, led the league with 16.
                Last edited by caccia; Fri Oct 31st, 2014, 09:55 PM.

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                • #23
                  Superjudge wrote: View Post
                  Its not his job Dan, his job is to be the guy that creates chaos. There is more to the game then stats.
                  Literally all there is to the game is having your team out score the other team. I thoroughly enjoy discussing how that comes to be, but ultimately the only relevant thing is whether your team scores more than the other.
                  twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                  • #24
                    chico wrote: View Post
                    We're talking about what he looked like in the first game. Where was all the wasted movement in that game? Who did he struggle to defend in that game? I thought he better than I've ever seen him before, but maybe I missed stuff. What "some" are looking at is where we might see signs of improvement, not a wow he's "good".

                    What is "per possession plus minus", and how is it calculated? I searched and couldn't find either the stat or the definition. I've a feeling I'd put as much stock in it as the regular +/- though, which is nothing.

                    Considering your assessment of DeMar and Casey from that game, I'm shocked you put any stock into +/- yourself, as an assessment of how a player performed. In that game, DeMar had the highest +/- (+4) amongst starters, while Kyle had the worst (-3) on the entire team, yet DeMar got ripped and nary a word about Kyle. And ripping Casey as "stupid" for subbing PPat in for JV with 2:27 to go, when JV's +/- was +3, and PPat had +11. Personally, as I said, I put zero stock in +/- numbers, but wondering why you're using them in assessing Hansbrough's game.
                    This is why I don't look at the raw plus minus. It is junk - it doesn't account for minutes, pace, and possession disparity because of sub patterns.

                    Accounting for those things, Hansbrough was worst on the team. JV and PPat were both very highly ranked. Neither was a bad choice by that metric, but looking at the actual game situation, JV needed to be in - either with PP or Amir.

                    Kyle had a rough game and I noted that, but his norm is unlikely to be near that. He just missed shots. DD forced bad shots, so he got more criticism, because if his shot selection remains the same, the ugly shooting numbers would likely continue. I even said he did a lot of good things when he didn't have the ball, which is supported by his decent plus minus numbers.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                    • #25
                      Noticed it in pre-season. He kept good track of opponent bigs and always seemed to be in good positions. Less flailing, an actual shot (developing), and better positioning. With polishing of those types of skills for a backup, he will have a steady career.

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                      • #26
                        Nobody wants to get hurt preseason giving PsychoT space. Bigs can bully summer league and preseason. Early, Toronto doesn't play big forwards and Hands might get a lot of playing time while Steisma is out butHands isn't our backup C

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                        • #27
                          Nilanka wrote: View Post
                          I can't see Johnson being happy with sparing minutes and no offensive role. I'm a little nervous he'll become a problem in the locker room as the season progresses.
                          That air ball floater didn't help his cause. James just has to start out doing what is asked, while knocking down whatever open shots come his way. With some consistency his offensive role will slowly expand, at least to where his actual skill level is at.

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                          • #28
                            GoingBig wrote: View Post
                            Noticed it in pre-season. He kept good track of opponent bigs and always seemed to be in good positions. Less flailing, an actual shot (developing), and better positioning. With polishing of those types of skills for a backup, he will have a steady career.
                            He's much more deliberate with his off the ball movement on offense. He knows were he's supposed to be (compared to a guy like Bruno, who plays with tons of hustle but always seems a little confused.)

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                            • #29
                              Hansborough is a beast,always love his tenacity and hard work,he might not b the most talented,but he gives it his all. I'm glad raptors still have him around,u always need those kind of players.
                              "Never apologize for coming to me. Office hours are for patients.
                              My kitchen is always open to friends"

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                              • #30
                                I would like the Raps to have exactly the same 7 players upfront next year. Well, exactly the same team except a 3rd PG instead of Fields.

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