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  • Mid-season Player Grades

    Got some time to kill till the next game, so I thought we could hand out some grades for our rotation guys.

    Here's mine:

    Starters

    DeMar: B+. Offensively gets an A/A+ - elite usage, scoring and passing for his position with improved shot selection (though a bit too much mid-range for my liking). Still not the defence I would expect from a team leader.

    Kyle: B. Usage down, not attacking the rim as much as in the past, but taking over 60% of his shots from 3 at 39% is excellent. Passing the ball, but turning it over a bit too much. Gets gets beaten off the dribble, but still does a lot of things well defensively. 10% rebound rate is outstanding for a guy his age/size.

    JV: B Terrific rebounding, improved passing and defensive awareness. Love the 3 ball.

    Serge: C Deadly from mid-range, 3 pt shot has regressed this year, though still OK. Offensive rebounding is a shell of what it was in his OKC days. Poor passing skills. Looked slow far too often on D, with almost totally inactive hands. Mediocre rebounding on D, though still good block rate.

    OG: C High effort, low usage. Smart for his age both on O and D. Cuts well. Terrific shot selection when he does shoot, almost all rim or 3's, even if the 3 accuracy has regressed. Active hands and energy on D. Seems unflappable.

    Bench

    FVV: B- Epitome of "Not the size of the dog in the fight." Massively exceeding expectations. Smart floor leader, keeps mistakes to minimum. 40% from 3. Still has trouble finishing at the rim (and probably always will). Like Lowry, does a lot of smart stuff on D, with even more toughness, although lack of length will always be an impediment.

    Pascal: C+ The really, really bad 3 ball (only 1 player in history has taken 104 3's in a season with a worse % than Pascal).Excellent finishing at the rim, helped by often beating his man down the floor. Poor rebounding on both O and D. Surprisingly good passing skills, with outstanding assist/usage ratio for a guy his size. Extremely disruptive on D with length, athleticism, intensity and good hands.

    Poeltl: C+ No range (I think - 94% of his shots are inside 10 ft). Soft hands on the catch and decent finisher. Needs to dunk with authority more. Great offensive rebounding instincts. Contests everything on D, to the detriment of rebounding. Also gets pushed around when boxing out. Foul machine - a lot him, but good for at least one weak call per game from refs.

    Delon: C+. Solid from 3 and maybe should shoot more. Has flashed a nice euro-step, but his finishing isn't much better than FVV's - not good. Decent assist rate considering he plays off ball quite a bit though a few too many TO's. Terror in the passing lanes, making good use of his length without excessive gambling. Very good rebounder for his position.

    C. J.: C- 39% from 3 on high volume would merit a higher grade if he did much else. Finishes well, but hardly ever drives. Passing not much better (or more frequent) than Ibaka, only positive is he hardly ever turns it over. Decent steal and block rates for a wing, but provides little else on D except excessive fouls and is one of the box out culprits.

    Others

    Bebe: D- Great lob finisher and willing even if not really effective passer. Awful rebounder. Blocks and especially alters a ton of shots when he plays well; unfortunately "well" can probably be counted on the fingers of one hand this year.

    Norm: D- Wanted to give him a better grade than Bebe, but I can't. He's been multi-faceted awful. Tunnel vision drives to the hoop, 3 ball not falling, Way too many turnovers. Plays hard on D with good block and steal rates for his position, but his D is too often over-aggressive, turning him into a foul machine.
    If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

  • #2
    Serge has been really disappointing this season overall when one considers what he was not too long ago. It's like he's older than his drivers' license suggests...

    Comment


    • #3
      3inthekeon wrote: View Post
      Got some time to kill till the next game, so I thought we could hand out some grades for our rotation guys.

      Here's mine:

      Starters

      DeMar: B+. Offensively gets an A/A+ - elite usage, scoring and passing for his position with improved shot selection (though a bit too much mid-range for my liking). Still not the defence I would expect from a team leader.

      Kyle: B. Usage down, not attacking the rim as much as in the past, but taking over 60% of his shots from 3 at 39% is excellent. Passing the ball, but turning it over a bit too much. Gets gets beaten off the dribble, but still does a lot of things well defensively. 10% rebound rate is outstanding for a guy his age/size.

      JV: B Terrific rebounding, improved passing and defensive awareness. Love the 3 ball.

      Serge: C Deadly from mid-range, 3 pt shot has regressed this year, though still OK. Offensive rebounding is a shell of what it was in his OKC days. Poor passing skills. Looked slow far too often on D, with almost totally inactive hands. Mediocre rebounding on D, though still good block rate.

      OG: C High effort, low usage. Smart for his age both on O and D. Cuts well. Terrific shot selection when he does shoot, almost all rim or 3's, even if the 3 accuracy has regressed. Active hands and energy on D. Seems unflappable.

      Bench

      FVV: B- Epitome of "Not the size of the dog in the fight." Massively exceeding expectations. Smart floor leader, keeps mistakes to minimum. 40% from 3. Still has trouble finishing at the rim (and probably always will). Like Lowry, does a lot of smart stuff on D, with even more toughness, although lack of length will always be an impediment.

      Pascal: C+ The really, really bad 3 ball (only 1 player in history has taken 104 3's in a season with a worse % than Pascal).Excellent finishing at the rim, helped by often beating his man down the floor. Poor rebounding on both O and D. Surprisingly good passing skills, with outstanding assist/usage ratio for a guy his size. Extremely disruptive on D with length, athleticism, intensity and good hands.

      Poeltl: C+ No range (I think - 94% of his shots are inside 10 ft). Soft hands on the catch and decent finisher. Needs to dunk with authority more. Great offensive rebounding instincts. Contests everything on D, to the detriment of rebounding. Also gets pushed around when boxing out. Foul machine - a lot him, but good for at least one weak call per game from refs.

      Delon: C+. Solid from 3 and maybe should shoot more. Has flashed a nice euro-step, but his finishing isn't much better than FVV's - not good. Decent assist rate considering he plays off ball quite a bit though a few too many TO's. Terror in the passing lanes, making good use of his length without excessive gambling. Very good rebounder for his position.

      C. J.: C- 39% from 3 on high volume would merit a higher grade if he did much else. Finishes well, but hardly ever drives. Passing not much better (or more frequent) than Ibaka, only positive is he hardly ever turns it over. Decent steal and block rates for a wing, but provides little else on D except excessive fouls and is one of the box out culprits.

      Others

      Bebe: D- Great lob finisher and willing even if not really effective passer. Awful rebounder. Blocks and especially alters a ton of shots when he plays well; unfortunately "well" can probably be counted on the fingers of one hand this year.

      Norm: D- Wanted to give him a better grade than Bebe, but I can't. He's been multi-faceted awful. Tunnel vision drives to the hoop, 3 ball not falling, Way too many turnovers. Plays hard on D with good block and steal rates for his position, but his D is too often over-aggressive, turning him into a foul machine.
      I like your grades but would add one grade up for everbody.A+ for Demar instead of B+,B+ for all the bench.The team is top 4 offence and defence.Top 3 point difference in the league.

      Comment


      • #4
        A lot of your ratings seem unfairly harsh 3inthe. Demar Derozan should be an A, he's top 10 in every MVP list.

        Are these based off of "compared to Lebron James at A+ so every bench player is a C"? Because it should be based on expectations for said player and whether he is exceeding them. FVV should be an A all day for what he has done, C+ for Pascal when many expected he fell out of the rotation? OG as a C when many thought he wouldn't crack the rotation?

        How does a team in first place have 0 players above B+?
        It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

        Comment


        • #5
          I guess if I criticize I have to do my own

          Demar Derozan A+
          Kyle Lowry C+
          OG Anunoby A-
          Jonas Valanciunas A-
          Serge Ibaka C

          Fred VanVleet A+
          Delon Wright B+
          CJ Miles C
          Pascal Siakam A-
          Jakob Poeltl A-
          Norman Powell D
          It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

          Comment


          • #6

            Comment


            • #7
              DeRozan: A-
              Lowry: C-
              OG: C
              Ibaka: C-
              JV: B+

              VanVleet: A-
              Miles: B
              Poeltl: C+
              Siakam: C+
              Wright: C-

              Powell: F
              Noguiera: F

              DeRozan started the season as a legit MVP candidate. But his play since the Warriors game has been up and down hence the A-(highest grade on the team).
              Mamba Mentality

              Comment


              • #8
                KeonClark wrote: View Post
                A lot of your ratings seem unfairly harsh 3inthe. Demar Derozan should be an A, he's top 10 in every MVP list.

                Are these based off of "compared to Lebron James at A+ so every bench player is a C"? Because it should be based on expectations for said player and whether he is exceeding them. FVV should be an A all day for what he has done, C+ for Pascal when many expected he fell out of the rotation? OG as a C when many thought he wouldn't crack the rotation?

                How does a team in first place have 0 players above B+?
                Yeah, Motivated Lebron is A+. And I did give DeMar an A/A+ on offence, which is pretty well the only things MVP lists use. But defence is a thing and Demar has too often not been a positive there, both by eye test and stats.

                If bench guys played 30 minutes, their grades would be higher. And yeah, no one here would want me as a teacher in school, graduation rates would plummet.
                If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Apollo wrote: View Post
                  Serge has been really disappointing this season overall when one considers what he was not too long ago. It's like he's older than his drivers' license suggests...
                  Here's hoping Serge is just fine tuning his body for a long playoffs run. That last game against Chicago before the All-Stars break, Serge had his best game as a Raptor ( cause he knew he can rest his body for a whole week lol). My final judgement about Serge will be determined based on this year playoffs performance.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    KeonClark wrote: View Post
                    I guess if I criticize I have to do my own

                    Demar Derozan A+
                    Kyle Lowry C+
                    OG Anunoby A-
                    Jonas Valanciunas A-
                    Serge Ibaka C

                    Fred VanVleet A+
                    Delon Wright B+
                    CJ Miles C
                    Pascal Siakam A-
                    Jakob Poeltl A-
                    Norman Powell D
                    So you have DeMar as A+, Lowry C+.

                    Could you explain why Lowry has a better Net Rating (110.5 O - 103.7 D, +6.8 Net) than DeMar (111.1 O- 104.8 D, +6.3 Net)
                    If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      TRex wrote: View Post
                      DeRozan: A-
                      Lowry: C-
                      OG: C
                      Ibaka: C-
                      JV: B+

                      VanVleet: A-
                      Miles: B
                      Poeltl: C+
                      Siakam: C+
                      Wright: C-

                      Powell: F
                      Noguiera: F

                      DeRozan started the season as a legit MVP candidate. But his play since the Warriors game has been up and down hence the A-(highest grade on the team).
                      To me a C should mean "I expected better from them"

                      Don't know how anyone can give Poeltl Siakam or OG a C
                      It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        3inthekeon wrote: View Post
                        Got some time to kill till the next game, so I thought we could hand out some grades for our rotation guys.

                        Here's mine:

                        Starters

                        DeMar: B+. Offensively gets an A/A+ - elite usage, scoring and passing for his position with improved shot selection (though a bit too much mid-range for my liking). Still not the defence I would expect from a team leader.

                        Kyle: B. Usage down, not attacking the rim as much as in the past, but taking over 60% of his shots from 3 at 39% is excellent. Passing the ball, but turning it over a bit too much. Gets gets beaten off the dribble, but still does a lot of things well defensively. 10% rebound rate is outstanding for a guy his age/size.

                        JV: B Terrific rebounding, improved passing and defensive awareness. Love the 3 ball.

                        Serge: C Deadly from mid-range, 3 pt shot has regressed this year, though still OK. Offensive rebounding is a shell of what it was in his OKC days. Poor passing skills. Looked slow far too often on D, with almost totally inactive hands. Mediocre rebounding on D, though still good block rate.

                        OG: C High effort, low usage. Smart for his age both on O and D. Cuts well. Terrific shot selection when he does shoot, almost all rim or 3's, even if the 3 accuracy has regressed. Active hands and energy on D. Seems unflappable.

                        Bench

                        FVV: B- Epitome of "Not the size of the dog in the fight." Massively exceeding expectations. Smart floor leader, keeps mistakes to minimum. 40% from 3. Still has trouble finishing at the rim (and probably always will). Like Lowry, does a lot of smart stuff on D, with even more toughness, although lack of length will always be an impediment.

                        Pascal: C+ The really, really bad 3 ball (only 1 player in history has taken 104 3's in a season with a worse % than Pascal).Excellent finishing at the rim, helped by often beating his man down the floor. Poor rebounding on both O and D. Surprisingly good passing skills, with outstanding assist/usage ratio for a guy his size. Extremely disruptive on D with length, athleticism, intensity and good hands.

                        Poeltl: C+ No range (I think - 94% of his shots are inside 10 ft). Soft hands on the catch and decent finisher. Needs to dunk with authority more. Great offensive rebounding instincts. Contests everything on D, to the detriment of rebounding. Also gets pushed around when boxing out. Foul machine - a lot him, but good for at least one weak call per game from refs.

                        Delon: C+. Solid from 3 and maybe should shoot more. Has flashed a nice euro-step, but his finishing isn't much better than FVV's - not good. Decent assist rate considering he plays off ball quite a bit though a few too many TO's. Terror in the passing lanes, making good use of his length without excessive gambling. Very good rebounder for his position.

                        C. J.: C- 39% from 3 on high volume would merit a higher grade if he did much else. Finishes well, but hardly ever drives. Passing not much better (or more frequent) than Ibaka, only positive is he hardly ever turns it over. Decent steal and block rates for a wing, but provides little else on D except excessive fouls and is one of the box out culprits.

                        Others

                        Bebe: D- Great lob finisher and willing even if not really effective passer. Awful rebounder. Blocks and especially alters a ton of shots when he plays well; unfortunately "well" can probably be counted on the fingers of one hand this year.

                        Norm: D- Wanted to give him a better grade than Bebe, but I can't. He's been multi-faceted awful. Tunnel vision drives to the hoop, 3 ball not falling, Way too many turnovers. Plays hard on D with good block and steal rates for his position, but his D is too often over-aggressive, turning him into a foul machine.
                        Pretty fair overall. I'd bump up both Kyle (B+), DeMar (A-) and Jakob (B- or B), but otherwise, looks about right. Jak is so damn efficient on offense, and also brings great defense on most nights that he has to be at least somewhere in the B range.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          3inthekeon wrote: View Post
                          So you have DeMar as A+, Lowry C+.

                          Could you explain why Lowry has a better Net Rating (110.5 O - 103.7 D, +6.8 Net) than DeMar (111.1 O- 104.8 D, +6.3 Net)
                          We're using net rating?

                          A quick look at it shows me the top 5 in the NBA are

                          1. Fred VanVleet
                          2. Shaun Livingston
                          3. Steph Curry
                          4. Luca Mbah a Moute
                          5. Eric Gordon

                          OG Anunoby ranks 7th in the NBA who you yourself have as a "C". Lebron James is in the NEGATIVE for net rating

                          So I think there may not be a direct translation to "best player"
                          It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Unexpectedly harsh grades 3inthekeon. I agree with KeonClark that grading should be relative to expectations.

                            I'd go:
                            DeMar A-
                            Kyle B+
                            OG B (remember that he wasn't even supposed to be ready for the start of the season)
                            Serge B-
                            JV B (big improvement to 28th of 73 centres in DRPM)

                            FVV A (I doubt anyone predicted he'd have this type of impact, 14th in NBA in RPM)
                            Delon B
                            Jakob B+
                            Pascal B-
                            Miles C
                            Powell D

                            Casey A+ (yes he has made me look like an idiot, great job coach)

                            In my head I did the average and this works out to a B average, so you could even scale us up a bit as I think we've been a B+/A- team. (Need to beat the Dubs to get an A for me.)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              3inthekeon wrote: View Post
                              So you have DeMar as A+, Lowry C+.

                              Could you explain why Lowry has a better Net Rating (110.5 O - 103.7 D, +6.8 Net) than DeMar (111.1 O- 104.8 D, +6.3 Net)
                              FVV leads the entire league in net rating and you gave him a B-...

                              Comment

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