If Bosh Chooses Chicago

[Bendit]

The following article is an interesting one in that it "guesses" that LJ stays in Cleveland for 3 yrs before choosing again (letting the Cavs fans down a bit more gradually and then going to the team most likely to have developed with all their cap space) and Bosh & Johnson going to the Bulls. The writer indicates a s&t for Gibson & a 1st round pick is what maybe the best return.

Lets assume that this Bosh to Bulls scenario is happening:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...rediction.html

Question to the RR: Is this the best Chicago will do?... should the Raps hold out for more (and dare the Bulls & Bosh)? What should be the realistic return from the Bulls that BC should be willing to go to the mat for?

Remember that this is no different from a high stakes poker game with possibilities, individual "cards" that the players hold, other options and how far each party goes before they fold (walk away) or ante up (because the prize/return is too good to pass up).

[saints91]

I would prefer to get Deng, and gibson, in a sign and trade but I'm okay with just Deng.

That would still leave us plenty of cap space and Turk and/or one of the point guards to trade.

[bayanmn]

I would like James Johnson as well. A young SF that BC was looking at in last year's draft. Low risk, potentially decent reward.
And draft picks. lots of draft picks.

[Raptorfanatic]

If there is big demand for Bosh from teams he has approved, I would like the Raptors to go after both Noah and Deng . If demand is somwhat limited (i.e. Chicago)I would like to see the Raptors receive Deng, Gibson and 2011 1st round pick.

[Bendit]

Draft picks from the Bulls wont be worth much as they will be in the mid-late 20s (expect them to do well) and now that we have drafted Davis, Gibson is of much lesser value.

I would be willing to force a Noah trade. This of course depends on a few factors, LJ remains in Cleveland as the article states, Stoudemire would sign in Miami since they believe CB is committed to the Bulls and the Bulls have done a Johnson deal (they send Deng to Atlanta as the article states). It would now rest on how much value the Bulls put on Bosh and whether Bosh is willing to forego the extra 30 mill. to walk to the Chicago situation.

Of course it would also come down to BC having the cojones to play this card and how he has assessed Bosh's and Reinsdorf's positions. I would be willing to take this risk reward chance...hold out for Noah and dare Bosh.

ps...I believe there is at least Houston who could be a fallback trading partner if the Bulls dont bite.

[saints91]

The Raptors don't choose where Bosh gets signed and traded to.

Also, you have to understand that Bosh is going to another team to win. He isn't going to let the Raptors strip his new teams talent. In sign and trade situations you don;t receive the other teams super stars and biggest prospects. Technically Bosh doesn't have to sign and trade at all. Only if he wants an extra year and 30 million more through out the new contract and the extra year. He'll have another contract after this one. The Raptors really don't have much say in what we get back. Deng would be nice though.

What did Orlando get for signing and trading Turk?

[Bendit]

The Raptors don't choose where Bosh gets signed and traded to.

Also, you have to understand that Bosh is going to another team to win. He isn't going to let the Raptors strip his new teams talent. In sign and trade situations you don;t receive the other teams super stars and biggest prospects. Technically Bosh doesn't have to sign and trade at all. Only if he wants an extra year and 30 million more through out the new contract and the extra year. He'll have another contract after this one. The Raptors really don't have much say in what we get back. Deng would be nice though.

What did Orlando get for signing and trading Turk?

A) While not absolute leverage, the Raptors do in fact have some say where Bosh gets signed&traded. Bosh has every right to just walk and leave the 30 mill coming to him in guaranteed monies if the Raptors are not a willing partner.

B) Turk is not Bosh. Turk did not command the max. The Magic were happy to have Turk walk for nothing and only came to do a s&t because bothe BC & Magic got something out of it.

C) Noah is not a super star...but a very good player and emotional one which the Bulls like v. much but would also be great in a Raptors rebuild without Bosh. The Bulls will have to decide if the cost is worth a retool with Bosh and Johnson or whoever. They will still be very good team without Noah.

D) It'll be 5 years before Bosh can expect his followup contract. Much can happen physically and economically (eg. new cba) in the interim. There is no guarantee for that xtra 30 mill. in the future when he signs his coming deal without the s&t. Check with McGrady.

E) This is hardball time. It depends how important the variables are to each party to get the deal done. And this includes the agents who get a nice percentage of the total deal. @ 10%, 3 million is nothing to sneeze at.

F) No one is gutting the Bulls. I am just advocating the best return for my team. Chicago can arrange to go over the cap later and get themselves another centre...and suck eggs.

G) I disagree about Deng being adequate return. His deal strains the cap and I'd rather walk than further restrain progress of our team.

[saints91]

I believe I was referring to Noah as Chicago's key prospect, and they won't deal him....Nor should we want a player like Noah, when we have Bargs.

There are not many good SF's in free agency this year, and if you check Deng's stats he would be a great player with DeMar and Bargs and 10 million and four years left is not much of a strain with his abilities.

If we can move Turk, and Calderon for a defensive, rebounding, gritty Centre and young prospect PG, this team will be playoff bound

[Bendit]

I believe I concurred that Noah is much liked/key prospect in Chicago. But if the scenario works out (hypothetical at this time of course) then the adage "if you want something great you are going to have give up something at least good"...or something like that....needs to play out imo.

The Bulls are not going to sail thru this f/a period without paying some sort of a price. Stern himself has stated that the cba has certain rules in place (6 yr contract and xtra increments) precisely to allow the current team to have leverage in situations as this.

My proposition is simple, push the Bulls and Bosh (they have to make difficult individual descisions about their future) to provide some semblance of fair return in an exchange for Bosh. This should be Noah. There will never be an equitable return but we neednt grovel nor get raped in the process either. That too has consequences in how BC and the Raptor franchise is viewed in the league and for years to come.

As far as SFs are concerned, Rudy Gay is not bad...will be more expensive but not bad. And there are many other shoes to drop (Turk, Jose, expiring contracts) that could net a decent SF. Besides, we dont have to get it all done this summer.

It'll boil down to how badly Bosh is tied to the extra cash or going to another team on his terms alone.

[saints91]

I totally agree with you, but I think as Raptor fans we have had enough rebuilding in our franchises short life. I hope we make a big splash with trades or free agency to move us into playoffs next year. I think we have enough pieces and money to be a playoff team.

I don;t think loosing Bosh is really that bad... although I'd rather have him. With him we haven't really been all that successful, so I welcome the change.

[Tim W.]

I believe I was referring to Noah as Chicago's key prospect, and they won't deal him....Nor should we want a player like Noah, when we have Bargs.

Because you don't want to pair Bargnani with an excellent interior defender and rebounder?

[saints91]

I wouldn't mind Noah, but his contract is up next year, and I'd rather trade for someone with a long term contract. We don't have the best track record with free agents.

[Tim W.]

I wouldn't mind Noah, but his contract is up next year, and I'd rather trade for someone with a long term contract. We don't have the best track record with free agents.

That's true. Not counting Bosh, who hasn't left yet, the Raptors have lost one major player to free agency: Tracy McGrady. Those are pretty overwhelming numbers, aren't they?

[robito]

That's true. Not counting Bosh, who hasn't left yet, the Raptors have lost one major player to free agency: Tracy McGrady. Those are pretty overwhelming numbers, aren't they?

I guess you weren't as devastated as I was the day Morris Peterson went to New Orleans.

[Tim W.]

I guess you weren't as devastated as I was the day Morris Peterson went to New Orleans.

Well, considering the Raptors didn't really even try and re-sign him, I wouldn't say the Raptors lost him as much as let him go. And while I liked what Peterson brought to the team when he was with them, I was actually for letting him move on.