2011 Draft Rumors & Discussion

[Raptors_]

im no bargs apologist but to say he doesn't love the game is wrong. he just doesn't love defense.

ya if he didn't love the game he wouldn't be playing

[Quixotic]

he averaged 19 points and 9.3 APG in his first year. Thats insane for a guy his height. 41% FGP isn't that bad, now your just throwing out random BS to try to make yourself sound like your right. And mike miller is a solid player and good 3 PT shooter on a GOOD team. Walker didn't win the NCAA championship for nothing. Kemba already has 3 year experience in the NCAA and i think he'll be able to help us make a push for the playoffs. I really don't care what you think but i have high hopes for him.

Random BS? LOL. And 40.6% at FGs *is* bad. You're the one comparing him to Stoudemire btw, not me. I'm just saying if Stoudemire is, as you say, what he'll amount to be, that's not very good at all. And take a look at the ROTY winners for each year. You can't possibly argue that Stoudemire/Miller aren't two of the worst winners in the last 16 years.

BTW, the 2010 Duke team that won the NCAA championship -- not a single one of those players are projected to be stars in the NBA. Winning a NCAA championship means nothing at the NBA level.

Look, I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else how to think about Kemba. I wouldn't be terribly upset if we drafted him either, but the comparisons you and others are making don't really help his case.

[Quixotic]

But again, I was never expecting or pinning Kemba to be the best player on his team.
If you look at a guys like J.R.Smith, Jason Terry, Jamal Crawford and Barbosa, they are all VERY important to their teams success, but not even close to being the best players. And yet the team can afford to let them dominate the ball for short spurts, because they are in just that, short spurts. Again, this is how I see Kemba being utilized.

This I can agree with. I definitely think he'll be useful on a playoff team off the bench, but unfortunately, all we really have right now are Davis, DeRozan, Amir Johnson and a bunch of maybes. We don't need a bench player for when we're contending; we need potential stars. I know as bad as this draft looks, there's almost always players who will end up surprising. Not saying we should gamble on a high risk, high reward type, but we should worry more about how the player will be in 3 years than in his first year. We're not exactly in a position to go anywhere fast.

[Tim W.]

But again, I was never expecting or pinning Kemba to be the best player on his team.
If you look at a guys like J.R.Smith, Jason Terry, Jamal Crawford and Barbosa, they are all VERY important to their teams success, but not even close to being the best players. And yet the team can afford to let them dominate the ball for short spurts, because they are in just that, short spurts. Again, this is how I see Kemba being utilized.

You're not understanding my point. NO ONE thinks Walker is going to be the best player on a good team. But my question is whether he can contribute meaningfully if he's not dominating the ball. Yes, there are instances of bench players coming in and dominating the ball for short periods, but, for the most part, those types of guys play limited minutes (20-25 at most) and rarely play on true contenders. Those guys you mentioned are also all pure scorers who can put up 30 points on any given night. Can Walker do that? Because if not, and I really wonder if he could, then he can't play the same type of role those guys play. It's why I brought up Stoudamire. He didn't have an elite skill. And when he moved to a better team he suffered because of it.

[Tim W.]

Just to clarify, I'm not saying that Walker is going to be a bust, or anything, but if he's got a limited ceiling, which I believe he does, then the Raptors would be far better off taking someone else. Walker might very well end up being a decent player in the NBA, but that's not something you look for with your fifth pick.

[Tim W.]

Bargnani's 2.0 assists per 40 minutes is 33% higher than the 1.5 average for NBA centers.

http://www.hoopdata.com/passingstats...11&gp=0&mins=0

Bargnani is no Alvan Adams but then again, even Brad Miller is no Alvan Adams.

Bargnani's 1.8 assists per game in 2010-11 is also a 50% increase over his previous best season. I don't have the data to support this one but I think part of the increase was due to him finding a cutting DeRozan more and more often as the season progressed.

Of course, Bargnani has the ball in his hands far, far more than the average center, so he's going to end up with more assists, hopefully. He's got a negative assist to turnover ration, though. That's not good.

[Mack North]

No, he doesn't understand it. He has a one track scoring mentality. How many assists does the dude have?

-----------------

Tristan Thompson, what would your feelings be if the Raptors drafted the home town kid at the 5 spot? He's projected to be the first college front court player drafted, ahead of Faried and Biyombo.

First, his skill set is pretty redundant for what the Raptors already have at the four and for the time being is undersized for the 5 spot. But if drafting on talent instead of need he has probably one of the highest ceilings in the draft. At worst he can be like Cole Aldrich and develop in the D-league before getting serious minutes in the NBA.

Although I would one day love to see Tristan in a Raps uni, I'm hoping it doesn't come at the expense of him being our pick at number 5. Too many 4's and not enough 5's already, I don't think he'd really help our situation. Unless BC plans on getting rid of Amir(highly unlikely), I'd like to see another player selected.

Chad Ford has him as the 8th ranked prospect right now, and I believe Doug Gottlieb had him as high as 3 a few days ago. Watching him play at Texas you could see the potential, but I'm not sure he should have came out this year though. I guess with a lot of top-tier guys going back to college and a nice crop coming into the NCAA's, he figured he could make the most money by being drafted higher this season.

[Quixotic]

Although I would one day love to see Tristan in a Raps uni, I'm hoping it doesn't come at the expense of him being our pick at number 5. Too many 4's and not enough 5's already, I don't think he'd really help our situation. Unless BC plans on getting rid of Amir(highly unlikely), I'd like to see another player selected.

Chad Ford has him as the 8th ranked prospect right now, and I believe Doug Gottlieb had him as high as 3 a few days ago. Watching him play at Texas you could see the potential, but I'm not sure he should have came out this year though. I guess with a lot of top-tier guys going back to college and a nice crop coming into the NCAA's, he figured he could make the most money by being drafted higher this season.

I totally agree with Thompson's decision to come out this year. Yes, he's raw but when you're pretty much guaranteed to be a mid/late-lottery pick, you take that chance. Had he gone back, worst case scenario he gets injured or he doesn't really improve, with best case scenario being he improves but is still a mid-late lottery pick due to a better pool of prospects. Sullinger is another player who definitely should have come out this year. He was viewed as possibly the #1 overall pick for a while. Next year, if he plays well again, he'll likely be a mid-lottery pick.

If we had an additional late-lottery pick, I would be happy with us picking up Thompson, but definitely not with #5 (unless he really is the BPA there). The #11 pick looks pretty good to me, actually. At #11, you're guaranteed to get one of Valanciunas, Biyombo, Thompson, Vesely, Leonard, Burks, or even Knight/Walker, if they fall. I'd be happy with any one of those players at #11 (Vesely not so much though), and hopefully one of the teams before #11 picked up Montiejunas, so we'd have a choice between two of the aforementioned players.

[Hugmenot]

Of course, Bargnani has the ball in his hands far, far more than the average center, so he's going to end up with more assists, hopefully. He's got a negative assist to turnover ration, though. That's not good.

The average NBA center has a 0.88 A:T ratio so Bargnani's 0.78 is not that far off.

It seems to me Dwight Howard has the ball in his hand at least as much as Bargnani and yet I never heard any criticism of his lower assist output (1.5 per 40 minutes) or his awful A:T ratio (0.39).

Selective unsupported criticism of the one player you WANT to be traded?

[Quixotic]

The average NBA center has a 0.88 A:T ratio so Bargnani's 0.78 is not that far off.

It seems to me Dwight Howard has the ball in his hand at least as much as Bargnani and yet I never heard any criticism of his low assist output (1.5 per 40 minutes) or his awful A:T ratio (0.39).

Selective unsupported criticism of the one player you WANT to be traded?

Dwight also has a lot of other things going for him. It's far more reasonable to pick on someone for not being a good passer because he's also not a good rebounder or defensive player, than it is to pick on someone who is a great rebounder and great defensive player for not also being a good passer.

[Mack North]

I totally agree with Thompson's decision to come out this year. Yes, he's raw but when you're pretty much guaranteed to be a mid/late-lottery pick, you take that chance. Had he gone back, worst case scenario he gets injured or he doesn't really improve, with best case scenario being he improves but is still a mid-late lottery pick due to a better pool of prospects. Sullinger is another player who definitely should have come out this year. He was viewed as possibly the #1 overall pick for a while. Next year, if he plays well again, he'll likely be a mid-lottery pick.

If we had an additional late-lottery pick, I would be happy with us picking up Thompson, but definitely not with #5 (unless he really is the BPA there). The #11 pick looks pretty good to me, actually. At #11, you're guaranteed to get one of Valanciunas, Biyombo, Thompson, Vesely, Leonard, Burks, or even Knight/Walker, if they fall. I'd be happy with any one of those players at #11 (Vesely not so much though), and hopefully one of the teams before #11 picked up Montiejunas, so we'd have a choice between two of the aforementioned players.

Point taken about him coming out this season, I think I meant to say I don't really think he's ready for the NBA and may take a while to develop if he's stuck on a bench. But this is the case for many players who come out, so who knows. I wouldn't be opposed to taking him with a late-lottery either, I don't know if he'll get past Milwaukee or Charlotte though. Shoot, SacTown or even Washington might consider him.

[Chr1s1anL]

I'm watching the draft combine and Enes Kanter looks great. He looks big and real defined. Measured out well 6'9.75" in socks and 6'11.25" in shoes, a 7'1.5". He weighted in at 259lbs with 5.9 body fat.

[Tank]

I'm watching the draft combine and Enes Kanter looks great. He looks big and real defined. Measured out well 6'9.75" in socks and 6'11.25" in shoes, a 7'1.5". He weighted in at 259lbs with 5.9 body fat.

He sure does, too bad the teams drafting above us think he's great too. I have a really hard time seeing him fall to the 5th spot in the draft, I just don't see it happening. Hope I'm wrong.

[ceez]

I'd like thompson buuuuuut there's a few other dudes I'd rather have.

[Quixotic]

He sure does, too bad the teams drafting above us think he's great too. I have a really hard time seeing him fall to the 5th spot in the draft, I just don't see it happening. Hope I'm wrong.

Best case scenario for us right now would be for Cleveland to pick Williams at #1. With that, Irving at #2 could be in play, Utah might go with Knight/Walker over Kanter at #3 (his refusal to interview with them, if true, could help in this regard), and Cleveland wouldn't be so locked into picking a big at #4 as they would be if they had picked Irving at #1. With a little luck, we could hope to swipe Irving via Minnesota's #2 and Kanter with our #5. Please, basketball gods, show us some favor.