Everything Derozan

[Joey]

Shooting that 3 pointer with confidence! 4/5 against the Heat.

We also haven't really seen that floater shot much from Demar that they show at around 1:10 the recap.

He's a bad man when he plays with this level of confidence.

[JWash]

Like I said in the game thread yesterday, if DeRozan adds the three... it's over. Like it could put him at superstar level as an offensive player.

That's a massive if though. Almost no data of a guy magically becoming a great 3PT shooter after playing this many minutes in the NBA...but then his leap this year overall was sort of unprecedented (although it could've been predicted by an optimist) so who knows.

[Barolt]

Like I said in the game thread yesterday, if DeRozan adds the three... it's over. Like it could put him at superstar level as an offensive player.

That's a massive if though. Almost no data of a guy magically becoming a great 3PT shooter after playing this many minutes in the NBA...but then his leap this year overall was sort of unprecedented (although it could've been predicted by an optimist) so who knows.

I agree with you, he was very, very good against Miami. I still don't really 'believe' in his above the break 3 at this point.

The interesting thing is that despite his leap this year, advanced stats still don't really 'love' him. I'm normally a stats guy, but with DeMar right now the eye test is telling me he's elite, but the stats still are kinda disagreeing a bit.

I enjoy watching it though, especially the little bit of DeMar/JV two man game we saw last night. That's incredibly tough to stop if we use it more, especially if DeMar uses it to create for JV.

[LJ2]

I agree with you, he was very, very good against Miami. I still don't really 'believe' in his above the break 3 at this point.

The interesting thing is that despite his leap this year, advanced stats still don't really 'love' him. I'm normally a stats guy, but with DeMar right now the eye test is telling me he's elite, but the stats still are kinda disagreeing a bit.

I enjoy watching it though, especially the little bit of DeMar/JV two man game we saw last night. That's incredibly tough to stop if we use it more, especially if DeMar uses it to create for JV.

I don't think it is a coincidence that both his handles and decision making both improved this season. I think he was a much more limited player in seasons past because he was much weaker with his dribble. When his initial drive was cut off he settled for jumpers. This year he's been taking it to the rim with so much more confidence because he has more than one move to offer. Still takes one too many turn around fade away for my liking but I can see his advanced stats looking better in the future if he continues to improve his dribble.

[tDotted]

Like I said in the game thread yesterday, if DeRozan adds the three... it's over. Like it could put him at superstar level as an offensive player.

I agree with you, he was very, very good against Miami. I still don't really 'believe' in his above the break 3 at this point.

All in the legs fellas

[S.R.]

Let's face it, we're also seeing the upside to continuity after two disappointing playoff appearances. When you keep the band together, you hope they'll learn from the past and grow. From systems to individual players to better and better synergy, this is what Masai would have been hoping for in keeping Casey and the core together.

Still a couple steps away from contender status, but I'm enjoying this season a lot more than last year. DeMar especially.

We'll see how long these Republic warm fuzzies last when a 3 or 4 game losing streak hits

[distorsun]

I agree with you, he was very, very good against Miami. I still don't really 'believe' in his above the break 3 at this point.

The interesting thing is that despite his leap this year, advanced stats still don't really 'love' him. I'm normally a stats guy, but with DeMar right now the eye test is telling me he's elite, but the stats still are kinda disagreeing a bit.

I enjoy watching it though, especially the little bit of DeMar/JV two man game we saw last night. That's incredibly tough to stop if we use it more, especially if DeMar uses it to create for JV.

''advanced stats still don't really 'love' him''.
It will increase slowly IF he maintain his latest level of efficiency and play a little defence (just a little).
Advance stats do not like volume scorers, who are normally a net negative, even with great performances

[Jrice9]

That's a massive if though. Almost no data of a guy magically becoming a great 3PT shooter after playing this many minutes in the NBA...but then his leap this year overall was sort of unprecedented (although it could've been predicted by an optimist) so who knows.

Ron Artest did.

Before he turned 27, Artest had 3 point shooting seasons of 31.4%, 29.1% 31.2% 33.6% 31% 30.8% (I'm ignoring the 04-05 season when he only had 17 attempts).

At age 27, Artest turned a corner and went 35.8%, 38%, 39.9%, 35.5%, 35.6% before falling off again in 2011-2012 (when his career began going off the rails)

[Barolt]

Ron Artest did.

Before he turned 27, Artest had 3 point shooting seasons of 31.4%, 29.1% 31.2% 33.6% 31% 30.8% (I'm ignoring the 04-05 season when he only had 17 attempts).

At age 27, Artest turned a corner and went 35.8%, 38%, 39.9%, 35.5%, 35.6% before falling off again in 2011-2012 (when his career began going off the rails)

The thing is, Artest had seasons before that where he shot 41%, 42%, 42% from 16-23ft. DeMar's only been above 40% from that range once, and his percentage from there has been dropping the last 4 seasons.

[JWash]

Ron Artest did.

Before he turned 27, Artest had 3 point shooting seasons of 31.4%, 29.1% 31.2% 33.6% 31% 30.8% (I'm ignoring the 04-05 season when he only had 17 attempts).

At age 27, Artest turned a corner and went 35.8%, 38%, 39.9%, 35.5%, 35.6% before falling off again in 2011-2012 (when his career began going off the rails)

Man I've been scouring basketballreference for years trying to find an example of this lol. Good find!

[DanH]

Artest is a great, rare example.

Here's the concern. Artest went from a 31% shooter for his early career to a 36% shooter in his prime. Huge jump (about a 1.15 factor in success rate), mostly unprecedented, extremely impressive feat.

DeRozan has had percentages (ignoring his first two small sample years) of 26, 28, 30, and 28%. So a similar increase in success rate for DeMar would put him only at 32%. Not great (in fact, in line with Artest's early career). So DD would need to exhibit almost double the jump that Artest did to have a real threatening three point shot.

Now, that said, he might do it. He's done a lot that many, myself included, didn't think he could or would. But let's be real about what a feat it would be, and how rare that really is.

[Jrice9]

The thing is, Artest had seasons before that where he shot 41%, 42%, 42% from 16-23ft. DeMar's only been above 40% from that range once, and his percentage from there has been dropping the last 4 seasons.

I think you topped me in terms of research. Kudos

I'll have to do a bit more searching, one idea I had was Bruce Bowen (its cheating a bit because you can't look up 16-23 stats) but he couldn't shoot 3s in College and early on in the NBA and suddenly got it.

DeMar's roll is fundamentally different. i'll keep thinking about it. Kidd isn't a great fit either if anyone is thinking about bringing it up

[JWash]

The thing is, Artest had seasons before that where he shot 41%, 42%, 42% from 16-23ft. DeMar's only been above 40% from that range once, and his percentage from there has been dropping the last 4 seasons.

Uh no. Artest had 2 seasons where he shot 41.1% and 42.6% from 16-23 feet. You're including a 3rd "year" which was actually only 7 games in Indiana lol because he got suspended.

Prior to Artest's 3PT leap at age 27, he shot an average of about 38.1% from 16-23 feet. Coincidentally, DeRozan is at 37.9%.

Not guaranteeing he's going to pull an Artest, but JRice definitely raises a case that shows it's possible to make that leap.

[Jrice9]

Artest is a great, rare example.

Here's the concern. Artest went from a 31% shooter for his early career to a 36% shooter in his prime. Huge jump (about a 1.15 factor in success rate), mostly unprecedented, extremely impressive feat.

DeRozan has had percentages (ignoring his first two small sample years) of 26, 28, 30, and 28%. So a similar increase in success rate for DeMar would put him only at 32%. Not great (in fact, in line with Artest's early career). So DD would need to exhibit almost double the jump that Artest did to have a real threatening three point shot.

Now, that said, he might do it. He's done a lot that many, myself included, didn't think he could or would. But let's be real about what a feat it would be, and how rare that really is.

DeMar being a higher volume 33% shooter from 3 would be a pretty decent addition to his game, not quite what we would want but yeah, you have an argument here though I'm not sure improving shooting is done by rate of improvement/ how much you can get by with practice vs natural talent.

i'm not sure DeMar's can't exceed Artest and get to 34-35% though it would be unique.

[Jrice9]

Uh no. Artest had 2 seasons where he shot 41.1% and 42.6% from 16-23 feet. You're including a 3rd "year" which was actually only 7 games in Indiana lol because he got suspended.

Prior to Artest's 3PT leap at age 27, he shot an average of about 38.1% from 16-23 feet. Coincidentally, DeRozan is at 37.9%.

Not guaranteeing he's going to pull an Artest, but JRice definitely raises a case that shows it's possible to make that leap.

Wow great job on checking that methodology.

The level of discourse in this thread on a Saturday Night is pretty great lol.