Everything Derozan

[Gambino]

Turned down a LOT of wide open 3pt attempts in the playoffs, because he had no confidence in it going down.

I was responding to a claim that him becoming a reliable 3pt threat off the ball would never happen. The ability is clearly there, just needs to increase his confidence and be encouraged to get into space and take and make those shots more.

It's like JV with mid-range Js. Can clearly knock them down but passes them up all the time.

[Barolt]

I was responding to a claim that him becoming a reliable 3pt threat off the ball would never happen. The ability is clearly there, just needs to increase his confidence and be encouraged to get into space and take and make those shots more.

It's like JV with mid-range Js. Can clearly knock them down but passes them up all the time.

I don't think the ability is totally there. I think he might be an ok 3pt shooter as long as he only shoots assisted, wide open, catch and shoot 3s. But that's not enough to be a good 3pt shooter.

I don't think DeMar's outside game is ever going to be 'good'. It might be 'acceptable'.

[Miekenstien]

I don't think the ability is totally there. I think he might be an ok 3pt shooter as long as he only shoots assisted, wide open, catch and shoot 3s. But that's not enough to be a good 3pt shooter.

I don't think DeMar's outside game is ever going to be 'good'. It might be 'acceptable'.

has to be psychological, he can make a shot 1-2 steps inside the line. i don't care if he gets a 3 ball. a decent stretch 4 will solve that problem. i want to see demar come back as an engaging decent defender.

[Barolt]

has to be psychological, he can make a shot 1-2 steps inside the line. i don't care if he gets a 3 ball. a decent stretch 4 will solve that problem. i want to see demar come back as an engaging decent defender.

He's not a good midrange shooter though. You remember the ones he makes, but his percentages from 16-23ft are actually pretty bad.

[Gambino]

I don't think the ability is totally there. I think he might be an ok 3pt shooter as long as he only shoots assisted, wide open, catch and shoot 3s. But that's not enough to be a good 3pt shooter.

I don't think DeMar's outside game is ever going to be 'good'. It might be 'acceptable'.

the numbers suggest it is. Nobody's asking him to be an elite 3pt shooter who can make them contested. I was referring to a question about a "reliable" three point threat off the ball. Being able to knock down open ones off the catch would qualify.

[Barolt]

the numbers suggest it is. Nobody's asking him to be an elite 3pt shooter who can make them contested. I was referring to a question about a "reliable" three point threat off the ball. Being able to knock down open ones off the catch would qualify.

The numbers don't suggest that. They suggest that he's closer to a 30-35% off the catch 3pt shooter, and got hot for a stretch this year, combined with his low number of attempts, making things look better. His midrange numbers suggest that he's more the guy he was the last 3 years, than the guy he was this year.

[Gambino]

The numbers don't suggest that. They suggest that he's closer to a 30-35% off the catch 3pt shooter, and got hot for a stretch this year, combined with his low number of attempts, making things look better. His midrange numbers suggest that he's more the guy he was the last 3 years, than the guy he was this year.

How do they suggest that when his percentage is 41.8%?

You can't just look at past years when he made a clear improvement in all aspects of his game this year. His overall 3 point percentage was 34% and he shot 44% from the corner and 41.8% on catch and shoot opportunities. Those are the numbers and they suggest a guy who can hit threes off the catch reliably. He's not going to take 4-5 a game, but he doesn't need to since most of his value comes from slashing and pick and roll.

[Barolt]

How do they suggest that when his percentage is 41.8%?

You can't just look at past years when he made a clear improvement in all aspects of his game this year. His overall 3 point percentage was 34% and he shot 44% from the corner and 41.8% on catch and shoot opportunities. Those are the numbers and they suggest a guy who can hit threes off the catch reliably. He's not going to take 4-5 a game, but he doesn't need to since most of his value comes from slashing and pick and roll.

Because we're talking about a sample size of 90 catch and shoot 3s. So there's a lot of noise there. The same guy, last year, shot 31.7% on catch and shoot 3s and 31.7% on catch and shoot 2s this year. These aren't the hallmarks of an elite shooter. 41% on catch and shoot 3s is elite. If you're suddenly claiming because of a sample size that small that DeMar is an elite 3pt shooter, I don't know what to tell you.

[Barolt]

Further, with DeMar's catch and shoot 3s:

He went 13/20 on catch and shoot 3s in the month of January. Which means for the rest of the season, he was 25/70(35%).

So either the month he hit 65% of his 3s is a false positive, or he's Steph Curry.

[Gambino]

But three point shooting is naturally streaky anyway.

[Barolt]

But three point shooting is naturally streaky anyway.

That is my point. DeMar doesn't take enough 3s over the course of any single season to ever be a decent sample size, so you have to evaluate based on long term trends. In his career, he's only taken 717 3s.

That one month of January was more likely a hot stretch than a sign of him being a far better 3pt shooter than he's ever previously shown.

[Gambino]

That is my point. DeMar doesn't take enough 3s over the course of any single season to ever be a decent sample size, so you have to evaluate based on long term trends. In his career, he's only taken 717 3s.

That one month of January was more likely a hot stretch than a sign of him being a far better 3pt shooter than he's ever previously shown.

Even if he's only shooting 35% on catch and shoot 3s thats still reliable three point shooting. He's not going to be an elite three point shooter, but he can be reliable off the catch as he gets more confident with taking them.

[Barolt]

Even if he's only shooting 35% on catch and shoot 3s thats still reliable three point shooting. He's not going to be an elite three point shooter, but he can be reliable off the catch as he gets more confident with taking them.

35% is 1.05 PPP. League average on non-transition opportunities was 1.056 PPP this year.

He's decidedly average, at best.

[Gambino]

35% is 1.05 PPP. League average on non-transition opportunities was 1.056 PPP this year.

He's decidedly average, at best.

The word reliable at least to me doesn't really suggest above and beyond.

[Barolt]

The word reliable at least to me doesn't really suggest above and beyond.

What I'm saying though is that a career 28% 3pt shooter who is at best a average shooter from there if all he EVER shoots are wide open catch and shoot 3s, who also isn't a good midrange shooter or defender, and dominates the ball...

I'm just having a hard time justifying giving that guy $144 million.