Everything Derozan

[OptimalOptimist]

I don't know how people can say that DeRozan has reach his ceiling.

He has clearly improves from a year to year basis. He has becom a better shooter, a better passer and is now pretty much a really good all-around offensive player. If he's dedicated to work (lol) on his handles that should lead to an increase in all shooting categories and also decrease his turnover rate.

Regarding the defensive issues, He also has all the tools to become a good defensive player as well, it seems to me that his stance isn't low enough as it allows quicker players to go around him and bigger wings to push him under the basket. I also think he's a better team defender that he's given credit for. I remember the play he made on Zeller that resulted in a win vs the Bobcats. He is getting better at picking charges as well. He plays the passing lanes more.

I doubt the weakness in his game that were revealed against the Nets are fatal ones. He now has experienced, seven games in a row, them and should have a better understanding of his weakness and his to-do list to become a better player.

Selling on DeRozan now would be a terrible mistake imo. He isn't close to the player he can become and even the TNT panel refer to him as a superstar in the making.

[JimiCliff]

Yeah, you're right on both counts.

Still, if we're going to talk about the quality of the defense, it's important to mention that they did throw a lot of doubles at him, which would have hurt him in certain areas, statistically. Unfortunately, DD couldn't capitalize on those opportunities for his team mates, but I think if he improves his passing, not only will he help the team, his own percentages will improve.

Of course. They were scheming for him (although I feel like they were also scheming just as much, if not more for Lowry, even though the most popular narrative has been that the defence was all geared towards DD).

Don't get me wrong, he had a very good series, offensively. The next test for his progression as a scorer/offensive lynch pin will be facing the pressure of playoff basketball while being hounded by a lock-down defender.

[imanshumpert]

No one thinks he's a star like Kobe, LeBron etc..






And if you take out game 1, he shot around 41% which is not bad for the playoffs against a physical experienced Nets team, I guess.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

DeRozan's true shooting percentage on the series was 55%. This means he was actually efficient despite his low field goal percentage. It's funny how people are conveniently ignoring TS% now that it favours DeRozan.

[imanshumpert]

Bold 1: If you're going to take a swipe at my ideas, at least make sure they are mine.

Bold 2: I didn't make the statement. Usually one who makes a claim should back it up.... unless you're the government of course.

Bold 3: Bahahaha, nice change of topic. You know there are two sides to the ball correct? This isn't football.

Statement #1: I didn't say those trade ideas I mentioned were yours. Basic reading comprehension. I said "you and others" and then I said "read that someone [ie. not you]".

Statement #2: I've demonstrated this many times in the past so I'll just wait for you to find a counter to it.

Statement #3: I said offensive because that's where the bulk of DeRozan's value is. He's a huge plus on the offensive end and about a net-zero (neither positive nor negative) on the defensive end. I'm hoping he can change that net-zero to a positive.

[imanshumpert]

If Demar ever actually gets super, defensively, then I will instantly join those who get super defensive about him

If DeMar gets super defensively he would be a top 10 player in the league.

Nobody is saying he's that good right now. He's an all-star/fringe all-star not a superstar.

[imanshumpert]

I think in deciding between Ross and DD, it's important to consider DD's work ethic.

People here rave about Ross like he's got unlimited potential, but he's only 18 months younger than Demar. I could be completely wrong about Ross, but I don't ever hear about him being a gym rat the way I do Demar.

Who's actually more likely to take significant strides over the next few years?

There's nothing to decide between Ross and DD imo. Idk why people are acting like Ross is due for an 8 figure extension.

We can keep both and Ross can be moved to the bench as a spark-plug similar to JR Smith except with an actual brain/conscience and good defense. If Ross hit the open market right now he wouldn't get paid that much. If he improves to a level where he would be fielding 8, 9, 10M plus offers from other teams then we need to make a decision because we can't tie up 20M in two players that play the same position.

Idk why people are acting like Ross has done anything to indicate that it makes sense to trade DeRozan.

[stooley]

There's nothing to decide between Ross and DD imo. Idk why people are acting like Ross is due for an 8 figure extension.

We can keep both and Ross can be moved to the bench as a spark-plug similar to JR Smith except with an actual brain/conscience and good defense. If Ross hit the open market right now he wouldn't get paid that much. If he improves to a level where he would be fielding 8, 9, 10M plus offers from other teams then we need to make a decision because we can't tie up 20M in two players that play the same position.

Idk why people are acting like Ross has done anything to indicate that it makes sense to trade DeRozan.

Is it reasonable to trade Ross for someone like Barnes who's a better fit then? I just think that Ross has pretty good trade value at this point, and if our long term plan for him is a backup to Demar, I think we could get something better than that on the market right now.

[imanshumpert]

Is it reasonable to trade Ross for someone like Barnes who's a better fit then. I just think that Ross has some trade value right now, and if our long term plan for him is a backup to Demar, I think we could get something better than that on the market right now.

I don't really like the idea of marginalizing talent for fit. If Ujiri thinks Barnes is a better player than Ross then he might be inclined to do that, but I doubt it.

But speaking on fit, first of all why would the Warriors want Ross? They have Klay already and also Iguodala eating up minutes on the wings. Barnes is actually better for them because he can slide to the 4 in some lineups.

Idk why people have become obsessed with this Barnes for Ross trade idea. It makes no sense for the Warriors, and I don't really like it for us either. Barnes is extremely inefficient (48.6% TS) despite being able to play off Curry, Lee, Klay and Iguodala. His dRTG and oRTG are both significantly worse than his team's and he doesn't really stand out in any area. Sure he has SF size, but I don't see how he would help our team other than filling a hole with an average player.

People overhyping a few playoff games way too much. And he wasn't even THAT good in the 2013 playoffs. 15-6 on 54% TS, solid but nothing spectacular.

[stooley]

I don't really like the idea of marginalizing talent for fit. If Ujiri thinks Barnes is a better player than Ross then he might be inclined to do that, but I doubt it.

Ok well, Barnes is just one idea, I was just throwing that out there because it's been mentioned so much.

It's not talent that makes a team better, but the value that that talent brings to the team. I just feel like having a really good backup 2, who doesn't necessarily fit that well as a 6th man, instant offence, is wasting talent.

The point remains that fit is incredibly important. You can have a bunch of talent that doesn't fit and you end up like the Cavs, or even stupider, like the Pels (Holiday, Tyreke, Gordon, like wtf were they thinking).

Having each player fit well and knowing their roles is one of the many reasons the Spurs are so good. Proper fit helps get the best results out of the talent on the team.

I think that lateral moves for players that fit better within the system or add to team chemistry, are some of the best trades out there.

[stooley]

but whatever, lets get back to Demar.

Haters be like, "uh uh, he sucks."

And fanbois be like, "DD, you's a superstar."

[JimiCliff]

Except "super, defensively" is a subjective measure, and every defender has breakdowns. I think a lot of the problem here is that both sides only see plays that justify their point on DeMar, which will continue even as DeMar does better.

Overall, DeMar is a very good offensive player who can sometimes take bad shots, and a league average defensive player who is capable of both breakdowns and lack of good defensive instinct but also is committed to the rotation defense that has been driven into the team by Casey.

I liked the quote by the personal trainer, because it indicates that it is believed that DeMar can fix or at least improve on those things that are currently considered to be his greatest weaknesses. If that is the case, I wouldn't be trading him even for what his value currently is, even with the issues the Raptors have with both him and Ross on the floor at the same time against big wings.

I was joking about this. It will never happen.

I think that at this point in his career, the only possible element of him game that could significantly improve is his 3pt shooting.

[imanshumpert]

I was joking about this. It will never happen.

I think that at this point in his career, the only possible element of him game that could significantly improve is his 3pt shooting.

Yeah that's what people said about his passing too.

[007]

I was joking about this. It will never happen.

I think that at this point in his career, the only possible element of him game that could significantly improve is his 3pt shooting.

Well that is very pessimistic.

[DanH]

I say trade DD for Barnes. That way you are getting better fit AND potentially better talent in the long run.

[BigCamB]

I say trade DD for Barnes. That way you are getting better fit AND potentially better talent in the long run.

Wut