Everything Derozan

[Mr.Z]

DeRozan is barely even getting to the line anymore.

[yabadabayolo]

I've got to pin a lot on coaching, though. Last year DD WAS elite, offensively. Why did he regress?

Looking at the numbers, last year DD had career highs in 3pt attempts and passing. Those are the 2 parts of his game he should have worked on in the off-season. Yet, all we see are these HandleforLife videos and DD doing And1 dribbling through Walmart aisles. It's pretty clear that he was told or believe that the next step of evolution was to become a dribble drive specialist and get to the FT line. Casey mentions that all the time. He should have been improving his 3-pt shot and passing skills, as that would open up space for the dribble-drive game, instead of now, everybody knows exactly what's coming so he can be crowded quite easily. Bad coaching and strategy, IMO.

And even worse, you start reading some of the quotes from last night's game. DD himself is saying that he needs to be passing more. Yet Casey, is still in full denial mode, saying "those were good looks." It's that 'More Cowbell' skit, all over again. Even DD is questioning his green light. smh.

It's the same thing with JV and Ross, whose development has been mis-handled to varying degrees. Pity Ross, who was already an elite 3pt shooter, and was encouraged to train with DD in the off-season to change his game away from his strengths. Now, he can't even shoot anymore. And JV is well documented. He came into the league as a bouncy, pick and roll specialist. Now JV's a lumbering post-up big, in an NBA era that's moved heavily into small ball. Even so, Bogut, Gasol and Hibbert are all less athletic than JV, yet they are all-defensive candidates.

I for one am okay with demar not shooting threes. He can't do it, he has too slow a release. I'm totally cool with him focusing in his strengths, (granted I don't know what his strengths are anymore) rather than start forcing threes. He's elite at getting to the line and that's all he does well tbh. Why would he starts hooting threes, like c'mon man have you watched him the last 5 years he just can't do it even though all the work he puts into it.

And when Casey was saying those things, I feel he just doesn't want to throw his players under the bus. He has a good relationship with them and it's just not what he does. It's not his style if coaching, out of all the years he's coached he's only called out his players a handful of times. It's just not something he does. And at least demar admits he's a ball hog now.

And where does it say that the raptors 'encouraged' ross to train with demar in the offseason. That's a load of bullshit if you ask me. I think you just made that up. I feel they trained together since i don't know, their actually friends off the court. And ross can still shoot, he was shooting like 43% from three earlier on in the year until his game just left from him. He's in a slump hence the benching. And the next step for ross was to be able to drive and pass and not SOLELY shoot the three. now we know he can't do that. NOW we know he's just a glorified threepoint shooter who can sometimes shoot the three.

And last but not least, Jv is getting better at defence. I guess I'm the minority here but I actually like big jonas. Skinny jonas always got bullied down low and reminded me of an energy big who finishes on the pick and roll like Amir. Now when you need a bucket, you can throw it into him and he can get you an easy 2.

[McRealistic]

The one good news from all of this is that we have a GM who has a track record of being able to trade guys like DD easily.

He is not going to get a star back for DD. He is not going to get high draft picks back for DD BUT he has the ability to trade DD for few mid-to late first round draft picks, maybe some 2nd round picks, few small expiring or 2 year contract , role players.

MU is quite capable of that. Also given that DD will be an expiring contract on a 10 Million salary, then many teams will be willing to take him and see him up close for a year.

Example, Lakers will be willing to trade Jordan Hill's expiring contract, Ed Davis and 1 first round draft pick (2017) and 2 2nd round picks for DD.
Will you take it ?

[golden]

I for one am okay with demar not shooting threes. He can't do it, he has too slow a release. I'm totally cool with him focusing in his strengths, (granted I don't know what his strengths are anymore) rather than start forcing threes. He's elite at getting to the line and that's all he does well tbh. Why would he starts hooting threes, like c'mon man have you watched him the last 5 years he just can't do it even though all the work he puts into it.

And when Casey was saying those things, I feel he just doesn't want to throw his players under the bus. He has a good relationship with them and it's just not what he does. It's not his style if coaching, out of all the years he's coached he's only called out his players a handful of times. It's just not something he does. And at least demar admits he's a ball hog now.

And where does it say that the raptors 'encouraged' ross to train with demar in the offseason. That's a load of bullshit if you ask me. I think you just made that up. I feel they trained together since i don't know, their actually friends off the court. And ross can still shoot, he was shooting like 43% from three earlier on in the year until his game just left from him. He's in a slump hence the benching. And the next step for ross was to be able to drive and pass and not SOLELY shoot the three. now we know he can't do that. NOW we know he's just a glorified threepoint shooter who can sometimes shoot the three.

And last but not least, Jv is getting better at defence. I guess I'm the minority here but I actually like big jonas. Skinny jonas always got bullied down low and reminded me of an energy big who finishes on the pick and roll like Amir. Now when you need a bucket, you can throw it into him and he can get you an easy 2.

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/01...ce-for-raptors

Casey said. “I mean, you can learn some things in one summer, but I see growth in Terrence. It’s in his demeanour and in his approach. A lot of the things he’s doing now is mimicking DeMar so he’s growing as a young man. If he continues to do that over the next few summers, I think it can be huge both for him and (rookie) Bruno (Caboclo). If they follow the pied piper in DeMar, they are going to be OK.”

Ahem.... you were saying....?

[yabadabayolo]

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/01...ce-for-raptors



Ahem.... you were saying....?

Lol nowhere in that quote does it say that casey 'encouraged' ross to train with dd. It says that he wants bruno and ross to keep working on their games like dd does.

If you wanna pull shit out of your ass, so can I. I think that quote says that Casey is trying to enter the nba as a roll player. He wants to overtake ross spot as the teams starting sf. He thinks he has the shot at winning the MVP because of his amazing coach like basketball iq.

See we can both make shit up !!

[golden]

Lol nowhere in that quote does it say that casey 'encouraged' ross to train with dd. It says that he wants bruno and ross to keep working on their games like dd does.

If you wanna pull shit out of your ass, so can I. I think that quote says that Casey is trying to enter the nba as a roll player. He wants to overtake ross spot as the teams starting sf. He thinks he has the shot at winning the MVP because of his amazing coach like basketball iq.

See we can both make shit up !!

Straight outta Casey's mouth isn't enough? 'Mimicking' seems even stronger endorsement than 'encouraging', but whatever. Agree to disagree. Next question, man....

[yabadabayolo]

Straight outta Casey's mouth isn't enough? 'Mimicking' seems even stronger endorsement than 'encouraging', but whatever. Agree to disagree. Next question, man....

all that quote says is that casey sees ross copying demar, that means ross took it upon himself to be more like demar. It doesnt say anywhere that casey told him to be more like demar.

but hey agree to disagree then...

[raptors999]

all that quote says is that casey sees ross copying demar, that means ross took it upon himself to be more like demar. It doesnt say anywhere that casey told him to be more like demar.

but hey agree to disagree then...

Casey had Ross running Demars set during the injury even with JJ much better suited to play a mid-range to-the basket game. He even had Fields spread the floor for him.

[Joey]

Straight outta Casey's mouth isn't enough? 'Mimicking' seems even stronger endorsement than 'encouraging', but whatever. Agree to disagree. Next question, man....

I think Casey was simply referring to Demars work ethic rubbing off on Terrence. Which of all things to rag on him for, you can't question his dedication. Or perhaps you could, who knows anymore.

[Joey]

I've got to pin a lot on coaching, though. Last year DD WAS elite, offensively. Why did he regress.

I'm saying it was because of his busy summer with Team USA (people always used to say how much it messed with Calderon, why is it inconceivable it had an affect on his early numbers this year?) and then the injury compounded on it.
I very much still believe in Demar Derozan.

Bring on the Tar and Feathers. Lol

[mcHAPPY]

I'm saying it was because of his busy summer with Team USA (people always used to say how much it messed with Calderon, why is it inconceivable it had an affect on his early numbers this year?) and then the injury compounded on it.
I very much still believe in Demar Derozan.

Bring on the Tar and Feathers. Lol

[Scraptor]

I'm saying it was because of his busy summer with Team USA (people always used to say how much it messed with Calderon, why is it inconceivable it had an affect on his early numbers this year?) and then the injury compounded on it.
I very much still believe in Demar Derozan.

Bring on the Tar and Feathers. Lol

@Golden... Last year DeMar was not elite. He was pretty good because of his passing, but I don't think you can call any wing with a below-average true shooting % elite.

@Joey.... We have to be careful to address the right causes. Playing for Team USA and getting injured does not affect your shot selection or whether or not you share the ball, and both are key reasons why DeMar has looked so bad. The only thing it might really affect are speed/lift/stamina, but those don't appear to be an issue; driving into traffic and hoisting up contested jumpers is.

That said, I still believe DeMar can be a useful third option in the NBA. Look at how much more effective Rudy is now. His true shooting percentage and assist % are both up around 8% this year next to a true number one option and as part of a better system. That could be DeMar... But unless we do something before soon, he's going to continue to believe he's the number one guy and deserves to be paid like the number one guy. Rudy took a pretty reasonable contract once he "saw the light"; I bet DeMar would too.

[Joey]

We have NO IDEA what Demar will command/ demand in terms of a Contract.

[golden]

I'm saying it was because of his busy summer with Team USA (people always used to say how much it messed with Calderon, why is it inconceivable it had an affect on his early numbers this year?) and then the injury compounded on it.
I very much still believe in Demar Derozan.

Bring on the Tar and Feathers. Lol

I'm with you - the district of DD. Population: 2. lol.

After seeing how Rudy Gay got absolutely vilified for his "selfish" style of play and seeing how his career has recovered nicely and now seeing the exact same thing happening to DD (and Lowry); it's pretty clear that Casey has to share blame in putting these guys in a no-win situation. Just look at Gay's AST% pre-Casey (15%), with Casey (11%), post Casey (16 & and 20%), directly correlating to WS/48, drop and increase again. More passing = higher efficiency = winning basketball. Casey clearly has philosophical disagreements with this.

Trading DD now or at least until he gets back to last year's production would be the dumbest thing to do, as his trade value is
artificially depressed by the system he's being forced to play. There is no physical, mental or character reason why DD can't have more seasons like last season with a different offensive system and better guidance/accountability. We just saw this movie with Rudy Gay.

[golden]

@Golden... Last year DeMar was not elite. He was pretty good because of his passing, but I don't think you can call any wing with a below-average true shooting % elite.

@Joey.... We have to be careful to address the right causes. Playing for Team USA and getting injured does not affect your shot selection or whether or not you share the ball, and both are key reasons why DeMar has looked so bad. The only thing it might really affect are speed/lift/stamina, but those don't appear to be an issue; driving into traffic and hoisting up contested jumpers is.

That said, I still believe DeMar can be a useful third option in the NBA. Look at how much more effective Rudy is now. His true shooting percentage and assist % are both up around 8% this year next to a true number one option and as part of a better system. That could be DeMar... But unless we do something before soon, he's going to continue to believe he's the number one guy and deserves to be paid like the number one guy. Rudy took a pretty reasonable contract once he "saw the light"; I bet DeMar would too.

It's arbitrary, but I use > 25% USG and > 110 ORTG as a quick-and-dirty filter for points produced by elite offensive players. ORTG is not TS%, but points produced or scoring. There's obviously a discrepancy between points produced and TS% correlation, but points produced should be the ultimate goal, no? Demar at 28% USG and 110 ORTG, is indeed "cusp" of elite. The other players on that list were definitely the elite scorers in the league last year. Regardless, he is stinking it up now, and it's directly correlated to his lack of passing, which is plain to see by everybody (except one individual, who shall not be named).

http://bkref.com/tiny/E4CsY

Player TS% USG% ORtg WS
Kevin Durant .635 33.0 123 19.2
LeBron James .649 31.0 121 15.9
Kevin Love .591 28.8 120 14.3
Stephen Curry .610 28.3 117 13.4
James Harden .618 27.8 120 12.8
Blake Griffin .583 29.0 114 12.2
Dirk Nowitzki .603 26.9 120 10.9
Carmelo Anthony .561 32.4 113 10.7
Anthony Davis .582 25.2 119 10.4
Damian Lillard .568 25.0 116 9.6
DeMar DeRozan .532 28.0 110 8.8
Isaiah Thomas .574 26.3 114 7.7
Dwyane Wade .588 27.9 110 5.5
Jamal Crawford .556 27.2 110 5.3
Brook Lopez .629 27.1 121 2.3