Everything Derozan

[MACK11]

Sidenote: Thibs is still a guy I hope is in serious consideration for when Casey gets fired (it has to happen at some point, right?).

What a shame it is that someone with Thibs resumè is sitting at home while someone like Casey is out here still trying to call himself a defensive coach. You know what Dwane Casey is? A fucking joke!

Every single playoff team is lining up to play us because we have this buffoon in charge who scoffs at the idea of adjusting in the playoffs.

This team for Swept by Randy fucking Whitman!!!!!!!

"Oh we never adjusted in Dallas"

Guess what this isn't the damn Dallas Mavericks! It's the TORONTO RAPTORS who don't have a Dirk or Kidd or Terry or Carlisle or Tyson or any god damn playoffs experience and we're lead by the long 2 king and Kyle Lowry.

[raptors999]

Sidenote: Thibs is still a guy I hope is in serious consideration for when Casey gets fired (it has to happen at some point, right?).

demar is a good player that is used terribly and every passing season means more iso play long two's and under utilized on D. under thibs or almost any other coach he would have been better.

[JimiCliff]

Guys, guys, guys! The interview with Thibs was in a pre-game scrum. Clearly, he called Demar a superstar because he was trying to inflate his ego and goad him into taking as many mid-range jumpers as possible.

When you're at Thibs' level, you work ALL THE ANGLES.

[JWash]

Guys, guys, guys! The interview with Thibs was in a pre-game scrum. Clearly, he called Demar a superstar because he was trying to inflate his ego and goad him into taking as many mid-range jumpers as possible.

When you're at Thibs' level, you work ALL THE ANGLES.

Think we have a winner here folks. All strategy from Thibs, all the time. Give the man a max. (wait coaches don't have those...)

[JimiCliff]

What a shame it is that someone with Thibs resumè is sitting at home while someone like Casey is out here still trying to call himself a defensive coach. You know what Dwane Casey is? A fucking joke!

Every single playoff team is lining up to play us because we have this buffoon in charge who scoffs at the idea of adjusting in the playoffs.

This team for Swept by Randy fucking Whitman!!!!!!!

"Oh we never adjusted in Dallas"

Guess what this isn't the damn Dallas Mavericks! It's the TORONTO RAPTORS who don't have a Dirk or Kidd or Terry or Carlisle or Tyson or any god damn playoffs experience and we're lead by the long 2 king and Kyle Lowry.

That was the funniest/most depressing/most head-scratching, because Dallas made an absolutely massive adjustment by putting Barea into the starting lineup midway through the finals. I guess Dwane just forgot

[raptors999]

That was the funniest/most depressing/most head-scratching, because Dallas made an absolutely massive adjustment by putting Barea into the starting lineup midway through the finals. I guess Dwane just forgot

they also adjusted the defense to man LBJ then zone everyone else

[JWash]

I don't see Masai moving DD in a deal that isn't a clear talent upgrade.

Even in situations where he should have lost out (trading Bargnani's contract, trading Gay's huge deal when he was shooting like 35%, trading Melo when everyone knew he wanted to leave) he still came out with significant return. Now we're in a position of strength with a guy who's enjoying winning here, has a great relationship with the coach and franchise and Masai is going to dump him out of fear? I don't see it.

If DD can be moved for a star (whether it's at the same position or a different one) or packaged for an upgrade I'm (and I think Masai would be) all for it. But the idea of simply trying to get whatever return we can get because we don't wanna pay him? I don't see how a guy who has such a great understanding of value like Masai subscribes to that logic.

[Snooch]

I don't see Masai moving DD in a deal that isn't a clear talent upgrade.

Even in situations where he should have lost out (trading Bargnani's contract, trading Gay's huge deal when he was shooting like 35%, trading Melo when everyone knew he wanted to leave) he still came out with significant return. Now we're in a position of strength with a guy who's enjoying winning here, has a great relationship with the coach and franchise and Masai is going to dump him out of fear? I don't see it.

If DD can be moved for a star (whether it's at the same position or a different one) or packaged for an upgrade I'm (and I think Masai would be) all for it. But the idea of simply trying to get whatever return we can get because we don't wanna pay him? I don't see how a guy who has such a great understanding of value like Masai subscribes to that logic.

no one, other than you, has ever said to trade him because we dont want to pay him,

Most if not all want him moved for MANY reasons, one of which, usually the last point entered is he is gonna cost too much.

[Wild-ling#1]

Are you saying that you think Demar is a legitimate superstar? If the answer to that is yes, why do you think that? You know, beyond the quote you have there. If the answer to that is no, why use that quote?

The issue here is that you won't find anyone (either in the pro-DD, anti-DD, or neutral groups) that will agree with that though based on available stats or just the plain ol' eye test.

Yes, coaches are gracious in a scrum like Thibs was in.

But we're bickering about the term "Superstar", now?

Paris Hilton is a "superstar", and what's she ever done? It's about being a part of the (American) collective consciousness. Being on the US national team and appearing in the All-"Star" game, and dunk competitions, appearing near the top of the scoring leader-boards (etc.) will do that for you.

Doesn't mean he's LeBron or Kevin Durant. "Star" vs. "Superstar"? Not a distinction worth getting pissy about, I don't think.

[JWash]

The mean mug alone is worth like 15M a season

[Superjudge]

Demar is worth more than people give him, but maybe not the max. comes down to leverage, timing and the market.

[Wild-ling#1]

But as teams have to spend to around 90% of the cap, or get charged the money anyway, and as there are dramatic fluctuations in salary, while teams pay for future years based on past performance, it's all a little kooky anyway, really.

DeMar gets $9M this year. He's been underpaid for awhile. Some of this is about respect. Some of it is about having more money than you might really be able to use, very sensibly, and having to spend it ... or lose it.

But as I've said, I don't think he'll get the max. He'll get somewhere between $18 and $22 ... based upon what the team can afford - and what they have to budget for a guy DeMar himself wants brought in (That's where the Jonas bonus will go. If they can get such a guy - If not ... well, like I said, they have to spend it ... and he was quite underpaid for awhile.

Whatever.

[golden]

But as teams have to spend to around 90% of the cap, or get charged the money anyway, and as there are dramatic fluctuations in salary, while teams pay for future years based on past performance, it's all a little kooky anyway, really.

DeMar gets $9M this year. He's been underpaid for awhile. Some of this is about respect. Some of it is about having more money than you might really be able to use, very sensibly, and having to spend it ... or lose it.

But as I've said, I don't think he'll get the max. He'll get somewhere between $18 and $22 ... based upon what the team can afford - and what they have to budget for a guy DeMar himself wants brought in (That's where the Jonas bonus will go. If they can get such a guy - If not ... well, like I said, they have to spend it ... and he was quite underpaid for awhile.

Whatever.

Not sure if he has even been underpaid, though. That's a bit of a myth. If you look at win shares, last season DD had 4 WS out of 49 of the team's total wins. So, he contributed to 8% of the team's wins last season. Team payroll was $63M, so he deserved 8% of that, which is about $5M, which means DD was overpaid last season. Injuries were a factor - but he still got paid.

The previous season, Demar contributed 8 WS out of 47, which is 17% of the team total. Raps team payroll was $58.7M, so he should have received $9.9M, which is pretty close to his salary. So, even in his all-star year, he was fairly compensated.

And the Raps don't have really high win share players because they win a lot of games because of the overall talent depth. Paying any of the Raps "stars" near the max would be unfairly compensating them for the success of the team.

[JWash]

Not sure if he has even been underpaid, though. That's a bit of a myth. If you look at win shares, last season DD had 4 WS out of 49 of the team's total wins. So, he contributed to 8% of the team's wins last season. Team payroll was $63M, so he deserved 8% of that, which is about $5M, which means DD was overpaid last season. Injuries were a factor - but he still got paid.

The previous season, Demar contributed 8 WS out of 47, which is 17% of the team total. Raps team payroll was $58.7M, so he should have received $9.9M, which is pretty close to his salary. So, even in his all-star year, he was fairly compensated.

And the Raps don't have really high win share players because they win a lot of games because of the overall talent depth. Paying any of the Raps "stars" near the max would be unfairly compensating them for the success of the team.

LeBron 10.4 WS last year out of 53 for the Cavs, <20%... worth 12M last season. Injuries were a factor, but he was overpaid.

[JWash]

LeBron 10.4 WS last year out of 53 for the Cavs, <20%... worth 12M last season. Injuries were a factor, but he was overpaid.

Even if you looked at Steph Curry.

15.7 WS out of 67 wins = ~23% of a 63M cap so 14.8M. So was Steph Curry really worth less than 15M last year? Really the league MVP?

I don't think this is the best way to measure a player's contract value. Based on the calculation you're doing, Nerlens Noel was worth a hair less than Stephen Curry last year. The finals MVP, Andre Iguodala, was worth 4.7M