What's your price on Amir?

[mcHAPPY]

LaMarcus Aldridge is a top five MVP candidate. You wouldn't swap him for Amir?

He's not quite as special as you guys are making him out to be. I hate to even say this because like I said, I love Amir. But what would your reaction be if the Raptors trade the 6th overall pick next summer for Carl Landry? Rioting in the streets? Well, that's basically the equivalent of another team trading it for Amir.

And I still don't see the reason why Toronto doesn't go after him in free agency in 18 months.

[JawsGT]

1) Zach Randolph
2) Serge Ibaka
3) Blake Griffin
4) David Lee
5) Tim Duncan
6) LaMarcus Aldridge
7) Josh Smith
8) Chris Bosh
9) David West
10) Dirk Nowitzki
11) Carlos Boozer,
12) Paul Millsap
13) Ryan Anderson
14) Pau Gasol
15) Kevin Love
16) Kenneth Faried
17) Anthony Davis
18) Jefferson
19) Monroe
20) Sanders
21) Cousins
22) ...

I take any of these guys to start NOW on my team in the PF position over Amir.

I wouldn't, not even close. Ibaka, randolph, Aldridge, Duncan, West, Nowitzki, Love, Davis, Monroe...that's about it for me. And I'd have to think hard about Randolph, Duncan and Nowitzki due to their age and the current state of the Raps. Griffin, Gasol, Boozer, Smith...are you serious?

[Fully]

And I still don't see the reason why Toronto doesn't go after him in free agency in 18 months.

I'm not sure Amir is chomping at the bit to come back to Toronto if we trade him away now, especially if he doesn't want to leave. Hypothetically, if they trade him to a contender and he has a great couple of seasons with some postseason success... he'll probably fall in love with that city too.

[S.R.]

I like that you judge Rudy Gay based on his 20 some games with the Raps this year as opposed to his 5 years in a row of being a 20/6 guy on 45%+ shooting and a borderline All-Star in the West. That's a completely objective and fair point of view to take.

Who said I did that? I never did that.

I'd rather have Amir with his contract, than Rudy - of any vintage, take your pick - with his contract on this team. Easy.

[psrs1]

Admittedly, a 5-10 2014 pick would be the ideal return for Amir.

But a mid-late first rounder is an asinine suggestion. That cherry picked list of 25 players (which included Rudy Gay) was a pretty self-defeating argument.

Amir is a talented player on a good contract, still 26 years old and still improving. Don't forget that bit. Amir hasn't even hit his ceiling yet. He's become a bit more effective each season and clearly has more potential in his jumper/range.

The Raps don't need to trade Amir for a draft pick that will hopefully be about as good - they should only trade him for a return that makes the Raps markedly better (immediately or in the future). There is no pressure or good reason to dump Amir Johnson for any kind of first round pick that will amount to a roll of the dice re: the returns developing into a higher quality asset. What a stupid, pointless gamble.

We just need him to hit those clutch 3s at the end of games! Lol.

[S.R.]

I wouldn't, not even close. Ibaka, randolph, Aldridge, Duncan, West, Nowitzki, Love, Davis, Monroe...that's about it for me. And I'd have to think hard about Randolph, Duncan and Nowitzki due to their age and the current state of the Raps. Griffin, Gasol, Boozer, Smith...are you serious?

Yeah, considering the age of many guys on that list, the huge contracts on that list, and the current state of the Raps, Amir is definitely a better fit at this time than several of those players, even those with more successful careers to date.

I think context is a big part of the "keep Amir, or only trade him for a top 10 pick" perspective. His age is right. His contract is right. His attitude is right. His developmental curve is right. The Raps are rebuilding and Amir is an asset with a reasonable contract who fits on this team. WTF - why would you trade him for a #35 pick? (Suggested previously.)

This is no Bargnani/Gay "get them off the team because they're doing more harm than good" situation, or an expiring contract situation (Kyle Lowry), or an overpriced contract (Fields), or a questionable fit (Novak), or a redundant asset. The asking price for the Raps should be higher than what "most GMs" would "realistically" offer. That's how you improve your team one transaction at a time - especially when discussing a player who currently fits your roster.

BTW getting a #5-10 pick for Amir would depend on the package of players involved. Ex. the Raps would probably have to take some bad salary back, or a secondary player may be included that the other team clearly wants as well. I suppose I'm opening an entirely different can of worms here...

[isaacthompson]

I'm not sure Amir is chomping at the bit to come back to Toronto if we trade him away now, especially if he doesn't want to leave. Hypothetically, if they trade him to a contender and he has a great couple of seasons with some postseason success... he'll probably fall in love with that city too.

This is exactly what I'm worried about regarding Matt's proposition. This was my gut feeling as well.. there's little guarantee he comes back if we trade him now.

[JawsGT]

I think many of us are over-valuing Amir here, and that's fine. If you wouldn't trade him for anything less than a top10 pick, then there isn't anything wrong with that. But, one has to consider what type of team one is building for the future, and where a guy like Amir fits in. Now, what's great about Amir is that he can pretty much fit in with any team, start or come off the bench depending on personnel, and have an impact whether it can be measured with stats or not. And, based on his current contract, he's a steal regardless of his role. One thing we do know, is that amir is not the type of player you just give the ball to and expect to make people better. And that is usually what you want to get out of a top ten pick, so what type of team out there is willing to take that sort of 'risk' of passing up on a guy that could 'potentially' be a 'go-to-guy' for a glue guy that is a bench player on many teams? I think the only way you get a top ten pick with Amir is if he is packaged with JV, DD, or Lowry. A shitty team has to be giving up the pick right, and Amir alone, as valuable as he may be, isn't going to make a shitty team that much better (we all know this first hand).

Now, don't get me wrong, I love Amir, he is my favorite Raptor, and personally, I wouldn't want him traded unless it was for something significant, but I can't really say what. But Amir's value to the Raps is much higher than it would be for many teams. Why? Because of the style of game we play and how we run our offence. We run it through DD, Lowry, and JV, we have both the east-west and north-south thing going now that Gay is gone, and Amir fits perfect in this type of system because of the skills he does possess and because he works well without the ball and is great in the PnR. So, if you are MU and you're plan is to continue with a team that's employs that sort of system, then Amir becomes extremely valuable because of what he does on the court. However, if the plan is to get a post guy in the PF spot, thus running your offence through two bigs, then Amir becomes more expendable, although he would still be quite valuable as a bench guy because he can play C or PF.

So, for me, placing a value on Amir is kinda dependent on the direction the team is taking going forward. Personally, I think any starting lineup should have no more than 3 players that need the ball to be effective. We have JV, DD, and Lowry. And then, the other two guys that can impact the game without necessarily having the ball in their hands (well, at least to initiate the offence), those are Amir and Ross right now for this club. Remember, when Gay was here we ran our offence almost entirely through the perimeter, and Amir was for the most part ineffective. He needs to be paired with a scoring big, and now that Gay is gone JV is getting more touches which is helping. Vasquez too helps Amir a lot, as they both love the PnR. So, MU, where are you taking this team? What positions do you envision for the Raptors future to be the predominant 'ball-controlling' positions? If PF isn't one of them, then I wouldn't trade Amir unless the other team was grossly over-paying, because I believe few PF's in the league can be as effective as Amir in the type of system that this team currently runs.

[Superjudge]

For my part, I'm just saying he is way better for this team than some here give credit for. I don't need any help understanding a players skill level or value. I wouldn't trade the guy for a pick higher that the lottery.

Not sure why you fix what isn't broke, there are a lot of other broken things to worry about first I would think, Jettisoning good players with horrific contracts (Gay) i get, good players with good contracts (Johnson), not a priority unless bringing back a sure fire improvement. a 5% gamble on a 20th pick..... not my thing.

Like I said, a bird in the hand is worth 2 in the Bush.

[mcHAPPY]

This is exactly what I'm worried about regarding Matt's proposition. This was my gut feeling as well.. there's little guarantee he comes back if we trade him now.

Whats the guarantee he resigns as a free agent?

If you love someone, set them free and trust they return to thee.

[Superjudge]

Powerful matty!

[isaacthompson]

Whats the guarantee he resigns as a free agent?

If you love someone, set them free and trust they return to thee.

Let's hope so. lol

[Superjudge]

I figured it out Mountie.... you went to school with Amir didn't you?

And you guys used to be buddies, and at tha time, he was smaller than you an dyou used to bully him on the court. Then one day, after months of regular hardwood beatings, Amir turned a corner, grew a set, and this happened:




You were never the same after this day and vowed to never, EVER talk to Amir again. Amir, he grew a foot that following Summer, played his last year, and then went straight to the NBA. You called him for tickets when he got to Toronto, because you were paying for 1/4 seasons.

Amir didn't accept that call did he.
Amir never accepts that call does he Mountie. Lesson learned.

Nobody?

NOBODY???

really???????

Jesus, I better keep my day job...what a kick in the balls.

[Roarque]

What's your price on Amir

What's your price on Amir? PRICELESS!!!

[Jamshid]

hahaha that's what kills me about this thread, I love Amir, I'd be happy for him to stay here, but for the love of god people be a little bit objective here.

Hahahaha, there are fans here who would not trade Amir for Blake Griffin or Anthony Davis !!! That should tell you about the level of objectivity on this thread