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'21-'22 Roster Construction

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  • If you look at our roster construction Dragic is really needed. He can still score and lead the the bench minutes without too much drop off. I doubt we get a similar player without adding a pick it asset of some kind.

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    • magoon wrote: View Post

      Right now, with 16 salaries (and recognizing that they won't have all 16 on the roster), the Raps are at just over $138m. Ish has the cheapest salary for the next two years and he's a guard so I agree he's likely. Dekker and Bonga are both forwards and neither can really defend the 2; I figure we're going to see a few more guys invited to training camp on non-guaranteed deals.

      I also think our salary situation makes it a near-certainty that Dragic gets traded before training camp starts. We can trade him before the end of the month and we know there's a market for him; Masai and Bobby are just taking their time looking for the right offer before his salary becomes an issue (since they obviously want to sign a few more guys for training camp at the least).
      I think Bonga can defend guards. Certainly more so than Dekker. Heck, he came into the league as a PG.

      Careful with your total salary math there. Some things are calculated differently when doing tax calculations - for example, Wainright's salary is 0.9M but he counts as 1.7M against the tax. Also, the team will want Trent's 250k bonus to fit under the tax.

      Right now, they barely have room to fit 14 guys, Trent's bonuses and all the dead salary they've handed out to camp invites.

      But that's OK, they can go into and even finish the season like that with no issue. They just can't add another guy. I expect a Dragic deal too, but they aren't forced into it.

      But I'd also not expect further camp invites. I think the guys they have signed are the list.

      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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      • So if we sign vets to minimum contracts they don’t count against the cap? Do they count against the tax? I think we could use a couple experienced guys to help our young core along.

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        • saints91 wrote: View Post
          So if we sign vets to minimum contracts they don’t count against the cap? Do they count against the tax? I think we could use a couple experienced guys to help our young core along.
          All contracts (except two way deals) count against the cap and tax. One year minimum contracts never count as more than the 2-year veteran minimum. Non-draftee minimum contracts never count as less than the 2-year veteran minimum against the tax.

          The reason you can always sign minimum deals is not because they don't count, but because every team has the minimum salary exception which allows you to sign players to minimum salary deals (up to 2 years in length) even if you are over the cap.

          I strongly suspect that the current plan is to just keep 3 of the 5 guys competing in camp (Yuta, Gillespie, Wainright, Dekker, Bonga).
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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          • With regards to a potential Dragic to Dallas trade.. I wonder if we could use Redick's contract in a S&T to make it work? JJ Redick was mad at Griffin for trading him to Dallas when he told them he preferred playing in the East (he lives in Brooklyn). If we can get him on a 1 year deal (well S&T's are 3 years, but the last 2 can be non-guaranteed) and some other asset like Brown/Green.. we could get the depth we need and duck the tax even if we fielded 15 guys. Or have a small TPE that we can use in a trade later in the season.

            I'd rather have a potential JJ Redick contract than Powell's contract that goes into next season at $11M. Dallas is about $18M shy of the tax. So if they send even a single prospect back like Brown they should be able to duck it.

            Of course this all depends on Redick and his agent and if he would be okay with this. JJ is 37 and might want to play for a contender to try and win his first chip before he retires. Of course we could also buy him out by the deadline. But at worst we can bring a floor spacer to the squad. Likely better than what Sam Dekker can provide (assuming he can get healthy).

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            • DanH wrote: View Post

              Missing a few details there.

              Raps have 11 guys locked in.

              FVV, Trent, OG, Pascal, Birch, Dragic, Flynn, Barnes, Boucher, Precious, Banton.

              They have room under the tax for 14 guys. They can't fit a 15th unless they shed salary in a trade.

              Those final three spots are a camp competition between a bunch of guys with varying guarantees.

              Yuta (375k), Gillespie (50k assuming he at least makes it to camp), Dekker (350k), Wainright (250k), Bonga (200k)

              Three spots for 5 guys. Yuta I'd expect to be a heavy favourite for one. Leaving 2 spots for the final 4 guys. Personally I think Wainright should get one. So it comes down to Dekker, Bonga and Gillespie for the final spot. And we need a guard. So I think Bonga makes more sense.
              You're saying there is no room to invite Hartenstein to Training Camp?

              Would be nice to have. Yuta vs Dekker vs Wainwright vs Bonga and then Gillespie vs Hartenstein. Keep 2 and a C.

              Raptors: Could Isaiah Hartenstein replace Freddie Gillespie? (raptorsrapture.com) posted about it today.

              Somebody should tell him we don't have any more cap space. lol
              Last edited by c-troop; Sun Aug 15, 2021, 12:31 PM.

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              • DanH wrote: View Post

                Missing a few details there.

                Raps have 11 guys locked in.

                FVV, Trent, OG, Pascal, Birch, Dragic, Flynn, Barnes, Boucher, Precious, Banton.

                They have room under the tax for 14 guys. They can't fit a 15th unless they shed salary in a trade.

                Those final three spots are a camp competition between a bunch of guys with varying guarantees.

                Yuta (375k), Gillespie (50k assuming he at least makes it to camp), Dekker (350k), Wainright (250k), Bonga (200k)

                Three spots for 5 guys. Yuta I'd expect to be a heavy favourite for one. Leaving 2 spots for the final 4 guys. Personally I think Wainright should get one. So it comes down to Dekker, Bonga and Gillespie for the final spot. And we need a guard. So I think Bonga makes more sense.
                Grange said Raptors wanted Moses Brown from Dallas for Dragic but can't move him til Oct 1st, that's why we keep Dragic in the first place if we move Dragic on Oct. 1st for Brown, Powell, and maybe another player, we would have to open up 2 more roster spots. I think Gillispie is most likely to be gone and another player could be Johnson/Champ or Wainright

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                • planetmars wrote: View Post
                  With regards to a potential Dragic to Dallas trade.. I wonder if we could use Redick's contract in a S&T to make it work? JJ Redick was mad at Griffin for trading him to Dallas when he told them he preferred playing in the East (he lives in Brooklyn). If we can get him on a 1 year deal (well S&T's are 3 years, but the last 2 can be non-guaranteed) and some other asset like Brown/Green.. we could get the depth we need and duck the tax even if we fielded 15 guys. Or have a small TPE that we can use in a trade later in the season.

                  I'd rather have a potential JJ Redick contract than Powell's contract that goes into next season at $11M. Dallas is about $18M shy of the tax. So if they send even a single prospect back like Brown they should be able to duck it.

                  Of course this all depends on Redick and his agent and if he would be okay with this. JJ is 37 and might want to play for a contender to try and win his first chip before he retires. Of course we could also buy him out by the deadline. But at worst we can bring a floor spacer to the squad. Likely better than what Sam Dekker can provide (assuming he can get healthy).
                  Redick, Lowry and Dragic are all impactful players but they're older and better suited on a team ready to contend. They all know these are their last high-end basketball years they have, so they prefer not to be on a rebuilding situation.

                  We need to look for a "contending" team that has a rotation caliber young prospect that is not necessarily critical for them to contend, and move Dragic +Boucher (rotation vets that will help you contend) in exchange.
                  2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                  • Eric Montross 00 wrote: View Post

                    Grange said Raptors wanted Moses Brown from Dallas for Dragic but can't move him til Oct 1st, that's why we keep Dragic
                    If Grange said it then....

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                    • 3 spots for 5 guys. Yuta, Dekker, Freddie, Bonga, Wainright. I feel like Yuta already has a spot locked up so whatever. Wainright to me should be a lock. He's tough and he's a good defender. He reminds me a bit of Tucker. As for the last spot? I want Dekker on the team. We need shooting BADLY. Dekker shot 45% from 3 last year,
                      Mamba Mentality

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                      • inthepaint wrote: View Post

                        We need to look for a "contending" team that has a rotation caliber young prospect that is not necessarily critical for them to contend, and move Dragic +Boucher (rotation vets that will help you contend) in exchange.
                        it’s really hard to find matching contracts for that though. It would be ideal... I almost rather attach a pick and get a player like Heild, LeVert, or Rozier. A younger combo guard that can come off the bench and fill it up.

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                        • Everyone's framing the timing of a possible Dragic trade in terms of the permutations of who is allowed to be traded when and in what combinations - and that might indeed be a factor.

                          Assuming they do trade eventually Dragic, however, I don't think they do so until Pascal is back on the floor. Dragic obviously can't replace nearly everything Pascal does - they play very different positons - but he can score, handle, and pass at a level higher than our prospects, which will allow the Raptors additional flexibility in matching up against the teams they face early in the season without lowering their overall talent level on the floor too much.

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                          • saints91 wrote: View Post

                            If Grange said it then....
                            He did say, Lowry blocked him a long time ago lol

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                            • Eric Montross 00 wrote: View Post

                              Grange said Raptors wanted Moses Brown from Dallas for Dragic but can't move him til Oct 1st, that's why we keep Dragic in the first place if we move Dragic on Oct. 1st for Brown, Powell, and maybe another player, we would have to open up 2 more roster spots. I think Gillispie is most likely to be gone and another player could be Johnson/Champ or Wainright
                              I like Moses Brown, fits with what we're doing here. If you're Dallas receiving Dragic on a deal, you now have listed as point guards:

                              Doncic
                              Dragic
                              Trey Burke
                              Jalen Brunson
                              Tyrell Terry

                              Some of these guys can play other positions but that's 5 point guard specialists on a roster of ~15 (meaning about 1/3 of your roster would be point guards). I get that Dallas likes all of these guys, but they would probably send one out if they're getting Dragic (likely Brunson or Burke).

                              So the deal would then be Dragic for Brown, Brunson and Powell (ballast). That's a net of 2 players to our roster. We have 3 spots left, so if that happened (3 incoming players from Dallas), the last spot would likely be Yuta's.
                              2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                              • inthepaint wrote: View Post

                                Redick, Lowry and Dragic are all impactful players but they're older and better suited on a team ready to contend. They all know these are their last high-end basketball years they have, so they prefer not to be on a rebuilding situation.

                                We need to look for a "contending" team that has a rotation caliber young prospect that is not necessarily critical for them to contend, and move Dragic +Boucher (rotation vets that will help you contend) in exchange.
                                I mentioned Redick as salary ballast. Of course it's up to him, but we could just buy him out and he could then go where he wants anyway. Powell's contract is fully guaranteed for over $11M next year. We don't need Powell either, but Redick's new contract can make things just so much more flexible for both Toronto and Dallas.

                                In order to make a Dragic trade, we need to use the 125% rule. So he makes about $19.4M. 125% less than that is $15.5M give or take.

                                So let's say we want Brown and Green. They make a total of about $4.6M. So to make a trade work, Dallas would also have to send $10.9M.

                                Let's say they sign Redick to that number and then flip him to Toronto. We don't guarantee his second or third years (a S&T salary has to be at least 3 years, but his last two can be non-guaranteed).

                                The Raptors just buy him out.. maybe save a little more cap space as he heads to Brooklyn/LA/etc.

                                Dallas gets Dragic
                                Raptors get Brown, Green and a TPE (about $3.9M).
                                Redick gets $10.9M and a buyout and can choose where he wants to go, but got paid handsomely for it.

                                Dallas and Toronto will both duck the tax as well.


                                I mean we can take Powell instead, but his contract is fully guaranteed for next season. That's over $11M that would be on our books for a guy that isn't really needed since we're so flush at the PF spot as is.

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