Poeltl & Pascal - The 2016 Draft

[Hotshot]

From Basketball Insiders:

FWIW; I'd take this with a grain of salt.

He's one of the guys that I like the most that would still be available at 9 so I'd be more than fine with this pick.

If the Raptors were to promise him at 9, he wouldn't have worked out for anybody else. I am sure Sabonis is in the discussion for that pick but it would be crazy if Masai made his decision now and told people around him about it.

[Chr1s1anL]

I honestly still don't get the Ellenson to Toronto stuff. I have a really hard time believing Casey is down with a starting 5 that includes JV, Demar and Ellenson (eventually).


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Draft the best available player and workout it out later.

[3inthekeon]

Ainge has acquired just a boatload of 2nd round picks but he can't possibly use them all... Its like the story of Irishman who gets 2 wishes... and he asks for two bottomless glasses of guiness... just can't use them all.

I'm guessing he'll sell 58, like Masai did with the OKC 2nd 2 years ago. But the other 4 range from 31-51, in from what I've heard is an extremely deep draft. How the hell he manages to trade them will be fascinating. But they are tradeable, because they are more valuable than maybe any year past.

[Chr1s1anL]

But keep in mind that offence heavily depended on the back court in spite of already having a ridiculously effective front court scorer. Adding another effective scorer (ignoring the possibility that Ellenson is no such thing) will not fix the issue.

What makes you think that Ellenson can't be an effective scorer in the NBA? I'm personally not worried about his offense. He's in a time that players with his offensive skill set are more valued than ever.

[DanH]

What makes you think that Ellenson can't be an effective scorer in the NBA? I'm personally not worried about his offense. He's in a time that players with his offensive skill set are more valued than ever.

I don't think he can't be. I think we don't know that he will be, and his inability to be an effective scorer in the NCAA is a little concerning. It's not like he was unstoppable in college and is a good bet to continue that. What is his offensive skill set? Because he can handle the ball a bit but a lot of the thinking about how he could be effective is built off his ability to shoot which is entirely unproven.

[Chr1s1anL]

I don't think he can't be. I think we don't know that he will be, and his inability to be an effective scorer in the NCAA is a little concerning. It's not like he was unstoppable in college and is a good bet to continue that. What is his offensive skill set? Because he can handle the ball a bit but a lot of the thinking about how he could be effective is built off his ability to shoot which is entirely unproven.

At 20 points per-40 minutes, Ellenson ranked among the most prolific freshmen in college basketball this season offensively. Able to put the ball in the basket from virtually anywhere on the floor, his instincts and natural scoring touch are extremely impressive for someone his age.*

Ellenson shows potential as a perimeter shooter, knocking down 30 3-pointers in 33 games this season, but is not quite there yet in terms of consistency, hitting just 29% of his attempts. Looking at his shooting mechanics, and the fact that he knocked down 75% of his free throw attempts, it's not difficult to envision him becoming an effective floor spacing big man in time, as his streakiness as a shooter seemed to have more to do with shot-selection than any concerns about his natural ability. He was very effective in the mid-range area, hitting 40% of his attempts on the season there (SST), sometimes pulling up off the dribble impressively, but had a tendency to short-arm many of his 3-point attempts, which often came with a hand in his face.*

What separates Ellenson from most big men is the skill-level he demonstrates with the ball in his hands. He's extremely impressive with his ability to put the ball on the floor, not just when grabbing a defensive rebound and going coast to coast, but also in the half-court, using shot-fakes, advanced ball-handling moves and body control to create his own shot and get to the rim.*

Ellenson is a real mismatch at his size, something that can probably be utilized even more effectively with NBA spacing, particularly in smaller lineups with multiple shooting options surrounding him. He's the rare big man who can be utilized effectively as the ball-handler in both pick and roll or isolation situations, as he can drive left and right and mix in some impressive change of speed and direction moves. He knows how to slow down and speed up instinctively with his long strides to beat defenders and make his way to the rim, and utilizes outstanding footwork to spin around opponents and finish with soft touch.*

[Demographic Shift]

I'm guessing he'll sell 58, like Masai did with the OKC 2nd 2 years ago. But the other 4 range from 31-51, in from what I've heard is an extremely deep draft. How the hell he manages to trade them will be fascinating. But they are tradeable, because they are more valuable than maybe any year past.

Maybe...if supply exceeds demand though Danny might have to sell those hard won assets at less than 60 cents on the dollar...

With no "farm" system in the NBA the compiling of assets in the hopes of developing them and then having them turn into players on the big team is a pretty tough task. I get there is the D League.. but in order to bring guys up and send them down they have to be rostered players.... If you want to contend.. you just can't have 8 development players on the roster...

[DanH]

At 20 points per-40 minutes, Ellenson ranked among the most prolific freshmen in college basketball this season offensively. Able to put the ball in the basket from virtually anywhere on the floor, his instincts and natural scoring touch are extremely impressive for someone his age.*

Ellenson shows potential as a perimeter shooter, knocking down 30 3-pointers in 33 games this season, but is not quite there yet in terms of consistency, hitting just 29% of his attempts. Looking at his shooting mechanics, and the fact that he knocked down 75% of his free throw attempts, it's not difficult to envision him becoming an effective floor spacing big man in time, as his streakiness as a shooter seemed to have more to do with shot-selection than any concerns about his natural ability. He was very effective in the mid-range area, hitting 40% of his attempts on the season there (SST), sometimes pulling up off the dribble impressively, but had a tendency to short-arm many of his 3-point attempts, which often came with a hand in his face.*

What separates Ellenson from most big men is the skill-level he demonstrates with the ball in his hands. He's extremely impressive with his ability to put the ball on the floor, not just when grabbing a defensive rebound and going coast to coast, but also in the half-court, using shot-fakes, advanced ball-handling moves and body control to create his own shot and get to the rim.*

Ellenson is a real mismatch at his size, something that can probably be utilized even more effectively with NBA spacing, particularly in smaller lineups with multiple shooting options surrounding him. He's the rare big man who can be utilized effectively as the ball-handler in both pick and roll or isolation situations, as he can drive left and right and mix in some impressive change of speed and direction moves. He knows how to slow down and speed up instinctively with his long strides to beat defenders and make his way to the rim, and utilizes outstanding footwork to spin around opponents and finish with soft touch.*

Yeah, I've read the scouting report, thanks. I stand by my point - everything is still "it looks good" and potential, outside of the heavy usage and mediocre efficiency driving his totals up (being the only option on your team will do that). He's a size mismatch for anyone in college, so he scored efficiently inside over smaller players, but in the NBA he can't defend anybody and can be defended by many.

So, yeah, there's a chance he becomes an effective scorer. There's a decent chance he never does, too. Heck, Hansbrough put up way over 20 points per 40 with better percentages than Ellenson had. He turned out to be an elite scorer in the NBA, didn't he...

[3inthekeon]

Ainge will probably trade them, but maybe not all. He can also draft and stash, or he can trade some of the R J Hunter/Jordan Mickey group to open up spots.

Just requires creativity.

[Demographic Shift]

Ainge will probably trade them, but maybe not all. He can also draft and stash, or he can trade some of the R J Hunter/Jordan Mickey group to open up spots.

Just requires creativity.

As the saying goes... nice problems to have.

8 days to the draft... I am anticipating and hoping for a wild night of trades.. reaches on players....

[3inthekeon]

Yeah, I've read the scouting report, thanks. I stand by my point - everything is still "it looks good" and potential, outside of the heavy usage and mediocre efficiency driving his totals up (being the only option on your team will do that). He's a size mismatch for anyone in college, so he scored efficiently inside over smaller players, but in the NBA he can't defend anybody and can be defended by many.

So, yeah, there's a chance he becomes an effective scorer. There's a decent chance he never does, too. Heck, Hansbrough put up way over 20 points per 40 with better percentages than Ellenson had. He turned out to be an elite scorer in the NBA, didn't he...

Was going to point out Hansbro was drafted as a senior. Took a look at his freshman numbers and they were almost the same per game. How many senior picks, much less senior lottery picks plateau like that? Guessing he's one of a very few.if any.

[Chr1s1anL]

Yeah, I've read the scouting report, thanks. I stand by my point - everything is still "it looks good" and potential, outside of the heavy usage and mediocre efficiency driving his totals up (being the only option on your team will do that). He's a size mismatch for anyone in college, so he scored efficiently inside over smaller players, but in the NBA he can't defend anybody and can be defended by many.

So, yeah, there's a chance he becomes an effective scorer. There's a decent chance he never does, too. Heck, Hansbrough put up way over 20 points per 40 with better percentages than Ellenson had. He turned out to be an elite scorer in the NBA, didn't he...

Ellenson is way more skilled than Hansbrough. None of these players in the draft are proven commodities either. From what we've seen in the NCAA he's one of the best offensive players.

[3inthekeon]

Ellenson is way more skilled than Hansbrough. None of these players in the draft are proven commodities either. From what we've seen in the NCAA he's one of the best offensive players.

So you think Masai is taking him, at 9?

[Chr1s1anL]

So you think Masai is taking him, at 9?

I think Masai will take the best available player. If the draft goes as planned he will be the best available player at 9.

I think Ellenson will be Kevin Love light on offense but, with more potential as a rim protector(because of length and how more agile he is compared Love)

[MixxAOR]

BPA offensively or BPA defensively?