Everything Derozan

[SkywalkerAC]

It's not about the money or even the cap space but that he assumes he'll be the goto scorer. Even if he didn't want a max deal he needs to keep the ball moving. The Raptors don't have enough good options to allow the ball to stop when he gets the ball. If he doesn't take a sub 40% 2pt shot the next guy will

I think you're assuming that he's assuming himself to be the goto scorer. I don't think DeMar has the ego that you have projected onto him. Yes, he has a scorers' mentality, but you have to take context into account - the team has always demanded/necessitated that he was a primary/secondary scorer. At the same time, this role has expanded his game - facing double teams, carry the load, leading - in such a way that should benefit him and the team when that burden is alleviated.

Did you watch the game today? Because I saw him passing the ball just fine. There's no reason to think facilitation won't be a major part of his game this season.

[GLF]

I think you're assuming that he's assuming himself to be the goto scorer. I don't think DeMar has the ego that you have projected onto him. Yes, he has a scorers' mentality, but you have to take context into account - the team has always demanded/necessitated that he was a primary/secondary scorer. At the same time, this role has expanded his game - facing double teams, carry the load, leading - in such a way that should benefit him and the team when that burden is alleviated.

Did you watch the game today? Because I saw him passing the ball just fine. There's no reason to think facilitation won't be a major part of his game this season.

I agree that he definitely has improved his court vision and he's been making some nice passes. Sometimes he should be getting more assists than he ends up getting because guys miss open shots. But the problem is he still takes way too many long 2's when he could have passed it either in the pick and roll or the pick and pop. He could average even more assists than he does if he did that more.

[Miekenstien]

demars' game is simple to explain. he is from los angeles when kobe was the best player in the league. he plays the exact same was a kobe. it isn't as viable now as it was then, added to him not being as good as kobe was. the shooting guard position has mostly been played by a player that gets his own shots more than any other position. the game is much faster than before, the players in general are much more athletic. it is really hard to be an effective mid range player. if he could be then the team would have a nice weapon but, as shown, he doesn't do it with the efficiency to make it viable.

todays nba seems to have taken the old 2guards and made them 3/d guys and now the best individual players are 3s with size/speed/skill. i would trade demar for redick if we could.

the money thing is a supply/demand issue and next year, as said ad nauseam, it goes crazy. there is a floor teams have to spend to, there is a desperation gms have when they miss out on their guy. not all gms have the job security to follow a plan and when you and your family are looking at maybe another 2-3 years of 3-5 million dollars then spending someone elses money to make sure you get a player doesn't seem like such a bad idea.

it must be pointed out on here somewhere the teams with money and the players available. demar is going to get paid, that is happening. he would be stupid to not leave us if we offer 18 million and someone else offers 25, hypothetically.

[mcHAPPY]

As is the case for every player. You're always waiting to see how they'll play and progress from season to season.

We've been waiting on his perimeter D, 3 point shooting, and improved shot selection (your criteria) for years now.

[jacobdr4]

The point every one brings up for derozan is that he works really hard in the offseason and gets better every year. Well this preseason is the worst ive seen him in years.

As much of a iso player/chucker at least he did work hard. It seems like he completely took this off season off.

[Snooch]

I think you're assuming that he's assuming himself to be the goto scorer. I don't think DeMar has the ego that you have projected onto him. Yes, he has a scorers' mentality, but you have to take context into account - the team has always demanded/necessitated that he was a primary/secondary scorer. At the same time, this role has expanded his game - facing double teams, carry the load, leading - in such a way that should benefit him and the team when that burden is alleviated.

Did you watch the game today? Because I saw him passing the ball just fine. There's no reason to think facilitation won't be a major part of his game this season.

none of what you posted can be either:

a) supported
b) believed.

[Scraptor]

Did you watch the game today? Because I saw him passing the ball just fine. There's no reason to think facilitation won't be a major part of his game this season.

none of what you posted can be either:
a) supported
b) believed.

This preseason, per nba.com, DeMar is third on the team in assist % after Lowry and Joseph. His assist % would be the highest of his career.

But as usual, who cares about facts.

[Snooch]

This preseason, per nba.com, DeMar is third on the team in assist % after Lowry and Joseph. His assist % would be the highest of his career.

But as usual, who cares about facts.

[Snooch]

Demar in preseason has averaged 2.8 assists per game.

ranking him at 20th among shooting guards.

Tied with a great ball mover in Grievis Vasquez.

Thats pretty awesome right?

21st in assist % among only starting shooting guards.

Behind greats such as Vasquez and Dion Waiters.

[white men can't jump]

This preseason, per nba.com, DeMar is third on the team in assist % after Lowry and Joseph. His assist % would be the highest of his career.

But as usual, who cares about facts.

Of course he's 3rd in assist% on the team. I mean, on most teams it would be the high usage perimeter players and/or primary ballhandlers occupying the top of that list. On a team like ours, with the lack of motion and dependence on ISO, it pretty much guarantees it. So I'm not sure what value this stat has here.

[Just Is]

Demar in preseason has averaged 2.8 assists per game.

ranking him at 20th among shooting guards.

Tied with a great ball mover in Grievis Vasquez.

Thats pretty awesome right?

21st in assist % among only starting shooting guards.

Behind greats such as Vasquez and Dion Waiters.

A little off topic but ... GV is the starting SG for the Bucks?

It also seems like we really did instill that scorer mentality into Vasquez from his previous pass-first one.

[Scraptor]

Of course he's 3rd in assist% on the team. I mean, on most teams it would be the high usage perimeter players and/or primary ballhandlers occupying the top of that list. On a team like ours, with the lack of motion and dependence on ISO, it pretty much guarantees it. So I'm not sure what value this stat has here.

The value of the stat was merely to counter Snooch's assertion that nothing Skywalker said could be supported.

Skywalker said there's no reason to think facilitation won't be part of his game, and that was supportable by the stats.

I just get sick of people using absolutes when it comes to Derozan. In the other thread mcHappy said Demar consistently hurts the team night after night, season after season.

Yes, DeMar is inefficient, has poor shot selection, and isn't an ideal 2-guard for this era. But the tone from some posters makes him out to be some kind of Bargnani incarnate, and what's worse, an egomaniacal one too. I just don't think it's rational or objective or deserved.

[white men can't jump]

The value of the stat was merely to counter Snooch's assertion that nothing Skywalker said could be supported.

Skywalker said there's no reason to think facilitation won't be part of his game, and that was supportable by the stats.

I just get sick of people using absolutes when it comes to Derozan. In the other thread mcHappy said Demar consistently hurts the team night after night, season after season.

Yes, DeMar is inefficient, has poor shot selection, and isn't an ideal 2-guard for this era. But the tone from some posters makes him out to be some kind of Bargnani incarnate, and what's worse, an egomaniacal one too. I just don't think it's rational or objective or deserved.

Kind of more frustrating that the bold doesn't describe him. By all accounts he's a good guy. He works hard, and he wants to win and do what's best for the team. So how come he ends up doing so many things that are just poor decisions on the court? Is it his character? Or have people been pushing him in the wrong direction to become a player he shouldn't try to be?

That's why so many have nothing but hate for Casey. You'd think, even if not a total transformation, DeMar would be a better player today under a coach who used his positive character traits to make him a better player. Put all that willingness to work toward the right kind of play-style. If he did, we might have more of an Iguodala/Rip Hamilton type SG instead of a wannabe Kobe.

*And then the question becomes is it too late for that to happen in Toronto? Even if DeMar could change his game now, will he in this situation? Even if he could, it might need to happen somewhere else at this point.

[Just Is]

Kind of more frustrating that the bold doesn't describe him. By all accounts he's a good guy. He works hard, and he wants to win and do what's best for the team. So how come he ends up doing so many things that are just poor decisions on the court? Is it his character? Or have people been pushing him in the wrong direction to become a player he shouldn't try to be?

That's why so many have nothing but hate for Casey. You'd think, even if not a total transformation, DeMar would be a better player today under a coach who used his positive character traits to make him a better player. Put all that willingness to work toward the right kind of play-style. If he did, we might have more of an Iguodala/Rip Hamilton type SG instead of a wannabe Kobe.

*And then the question becomes is it too late for that to happen in Toronto? Even if DeMar could change his game now, will he in this situation? Even if he could, it might need to happen somewhere else at this point.

The bold is me in a nutshell. Which is what partially confuses me since the biggest Demar supporters tend to be the biggest Casey ones as well.

[Snooch]

A little off topic but ... GV is the starting SG for the Bucks?

It also seems like we really did instill that scorer mentality into Vasquez from his previous pass-first one.

Kidd siad that is his intentions, and he has been starting there,