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  • KeonClark wrote: View Post
    Lol, sounds like you're rehearsing Masai's lines on the phone with atlanta management. I dont think there's a gm in the league who values sully more than pat right now
    Lol maybe I've got some inside knowledge.

    This is the same Masai that got value out of Greivis and Bargs. I'm not worried.

    Comment


    • Im really surprised the biggest outcry here is about Pat but...

      1. ATL is losing their star PF, you have to expect them to pick which ever one of ours they favor

      2. Sully is a decent defender himself and we can combine him with Sap as well which is arguably a better idea since he is the best rebounder of all 3

      3. As much as I want an increased role for Norm, we need a shooter like Ross. He is the best one on our roster and unlike Powell, he can do so off the dribble and it is going to be much needed against CLE when they have their shooters bombing away

      Again I much rather it be Corey because Delon and Norm should be able to handle some the ballhandling duties that would be lost and BOTH guys are great defenders so thats not a concern either. But again worse comes to worse I do the deal and find another shooter somehow. But people need to stop acting like our picks are throwins, we arguably need those the most with the impending luxury tax and need for cheap talent, especially to develop as our guys age.

      Comment


      • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
        Im really surprised the biggest outcry here is about Pat but...

        1. ATL is losing their star PF, you have to expect them to pick which ever one of ours they favor

        2. Sully is a decent defender himself and we can combine him with Sap as well which is arguably a better idea since he is the best rebounder of all 3

        3. As much as I want an increased role for Norm, we need a shooter like Ross. He is the best one on our roster and unlike Powell, he can do so off the dribble and it is going to be much needed against CLE when they have their shooters bombing away

        Again I much rather it be Corey because Delon and Norm should be able to handle some the ballhandling duties that would be lost and BOTH guys are great defenders so thats not a concern either. But again worse comes to worse I do the deal and find another shooter somehow. But people need to stop acting like our picks are throwins, we arguably need those the most with the impending luxury tax and need for cheap talent, especially to develop as our guys age.
        We're overstating how much wed miss ross. He's a 6th man bench scorer, and wildly inconsistent. Sure he can shoot us into some games, but Powell is a half decent off the dribble 3 and a good overall 3, AND a better overall player. We already have an insanely good offense, our defense is middling, so essentially trading ross and pat for Millsap and Powell increases our net gain significantly
        It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

        Comment


        • tDotted wrote: View Post
          Not worried at all. Millsap's never led the Hawks in per 36 FGA in any season he's been there. Right now he's 3rd on the team, behind Shroeder and Hardaway. Millsap is not a ball dominant player in the slightest.
          ATL generally spreads their O around since Bud is their coach, in the sense that they don't overrely on one single guy. Millsap still gets 24.2% (2nd behind Schroeder, who's their primary ballhandler) usage and over 14 FGA/game which is basically tied with Schroeder (I don't know why per 36 would be your choice here). We have DeMar at 34.2%, Lowry at 24.5%, and the next guy is Ross at 20.5%. Nobody averages more than 8.8 FGAs/game after our "big 2".

          Patterson's USG is 12.4%, one of the lowest on the team. His FGA/game is 6.8, which is among the lowest in our rotation with only Bebe and Siakam being lower (I can't count Powell who's in and out of the rotation depending on the night).

          So where does Millsap fit in there? Are we going to ask him to take less shots here? If DeMar sacrifices usage, does his effectiveness nosedive?

          While Millsap isn't a ball-dominant player, he still needs the ball, and on the flip side, DeMar is a ball-dominant player who's never done a good job playing off the ball. And if it cost us 2Pat AND Ross to get him, we'd lose our two best off-the-ball players offensively, so we'd be more limited in the combinations we try to fit around them if we want to break them up more to get them into bench lineups.

          Comment


          • Nice to hear Millsap profess his love for Atlanta but I wonder if the last story about him being sent out if the Hawks retained Horford carries any weight.

            Comment


            • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
              But people need to stop acting like our picks are throwins, we arguably need those the most with the impending luxury tax and need for cheap talent, especially to develop as our guys age.
              People need to stop overvaluing our own assets and acting like Atlanta is going to gift us a 3x all-star for our table scraps.

              Play too hard to get and there's a real chance Millsap is dealt elsewhere.

              Comment


              • Do you guys really think the Atlanta fan base is going to be jumping up and down for Ross/2pat for Milsap? Honestly thats a steal of a deal in my opinion. Especially if you don't add any picks. I think you guys are forgetting just how good Sap is. Same guy that scored 40 on

                Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                @Chr1st1anL

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                • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                  Do you guys really think the Atlanta fan base is going to be jumping up and down for Ross/2pat for Milsap? Honestly thats a steal of a deal in my opinion. Especially if you don't add any picks. I think you guys are forgetting just how good Sap is. Same guy that scored 40 on

                  Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                  So what would you give up for Millsap? would you really give up JV or/and Powell for him?
                  Mamba Mentality

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                  • TRex wrote: View Post
                    So what would you give up for Millsap? would you really give up JV or/and Powell for him?
                    Not Powell. He has a very bright future in this league. Ross/2pat in a heartbeat.

                    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                    @Chr1st1anL

                    Comment


                    • Scraptor wrote: View Post
                      People need to stop overvaluing our own assets and acting like Atlanta is going to gift us a 3x all-star for our table scraps.

                      Play too hard to get and there's a real chance Millsap is dealt elsewhere.
                      Well depending on what kind of package they want, there is a very good chance he'd be dealt elsewhere. If they want to win now, they probably shouldn't be trading Millsap for Ross and Pat. If they want to win now, they also shouldn't be trading him to a team ahead of them in the same conference. If they don't want to win now or at least want to prioritize getting youth/picks, there are probably teams that could blow our trade offers out of the water.

                      Comment


                      • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                        Do you guys really think the Atlanta fan base is going to be jumping up and down for Ross/2pat for Milsap? Honestly thats a steal of a deal in my opinion. Especially if you don't add any picks. I think you guys are forgetting just how good Sap is. Same guy that scored 40 on

                        Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                        You got to think about the future tho. What if Milsap signs with the other team few months later?

                        Comment


                        • Sorry but personally I feel like comparing Pat (or JV) usage to Millsap seems like a waste of time. Paul is so much more respected as a player and far more well rounded that his usage will not be the same as those 2 if he were to come here. Why they heck would we use Pat or JV more?! Neither guy can pass well (which Paul does) and neither guy can create for himself well off the high PnR (which again Paul does)....its comparing apples to oranges.

                          Pat in a PnR typically rolls to the perimeter for a shot and JV dives down to the rim or a incredibly predictable pump fake at the top of the key (for the most part). Unlike either 2, Paul will be able to do either or (step out for a jumper or go to the basket) BUT he can also take the pass and set up someone else with a pass or create his own shot. Sap is really going to play the role someone like Draymond does, except he is arguably smarter and more crafty so fitting in with 2 high usage guards (like DG does with Curry n Klay) will not be an issue.

                          Comment


                          • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                            Do you guys really think the Atlanta fan base is going to be jumping up and down for Ross/2pat for Milsap? Honestly thats a steal of a deal in my opinion. Especially if you don't add any picks. I think you guys are forgetting just how good Sap is. Same guy that scored 40 on

                            Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                            I know I keep saying swapping out Ross for CoJo but I still agree this would be a heck of deal imo too if no picks are included.

                            Comment


                            • rocwell wrote: View Post
                              You got to think about the future tho. What if Milsap signs with the other team few months later?
                              2pat is a free agent anyways. I was never ok with signing him to 15+. At some point Ross was going to be moved to make room for Powell. Might as well get Sap in return.

                              If Sap is all about winning there aren't many other teams to go to.

                              Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                              @Chr1st1anL

                              Comment


                              • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
                                ATL generally spreads their O around since Bud is their coach, in the sense that they don't overrely on one single guy. Millsap still gets 24.2% (2nd behind Schroeder, who's their primary ballhandler) usage and over 14 FGA/game which is basically tied with Schroeder (I don't know why per 36 would be your choice here). We have DeMar at 34.2%, Lowry at 24.5%, and the next guy is Ross at 20.5%. Nobody averages more than 8.8 FGAs/game after our "big 2".

                                Patterson's USG is 12.4%, one of the lowest on the team. His FGA/game is 6.8, which is among the lowest in our rotation with only Bebe and Siakam being lower (I can't count Powell who's in and out of the rotation depending on the night).

                                So where does Millsap fit in there? Are we going to ask him to take less shots here? If DeMar sacrifices usage, does his effectiveness nosedive?

                                While Millsap isn't a ball-dominant player, he still needs the ball, and on the flip side, DeMar is a ball-dominant player who's never done a good job playing off the ball. And if it cost us 2Pat AND Ross to get him, we'd lose our two best off-the-ball players offensively, so we'd be more limited in the combinations we try to fit around them if we want to break them up more to get them into bench lineups.
                                Patterson just doesn't try to score that often. He passes up a lot of shots.

                                I've watched my fair share of Millsap. Despite his usage, the Hawks don't actually run many plays for him. 14th in spot up possessions for a big man. 6th among big men for ISOs (mainly off pick & pops). 3rd in PnR possessions. 56% of his field goal attempts happen within 2 seconds he receives it. And he's got a lower post up frequency than even JV! He'll fit right in.

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