Everything Valanciunas

[Uncle_Si]

Maybe the coaching staff has determined that JV is a player who responds well to negative punishment (psychological term meaning taking away something good (minutes) in order to decrease a particular behaviour (bad defense))?

"Negative punishment is most effective when:

It immediately follows a response
It is applied consistently"

Just looking at this from a psychological perspective. Valanciunas' defense HAS been improving as a result and he does make less mistakes than he ever has.

Exactly. It's amazing how much guys know considering they're not around the team at all. I mean AT ALL. Good plan, fire the coach that's leading the team to the best start in franchise history with the 2nd best offence in the league. Brilliant. We might aswell fire Masai and bring in OldSkool.

JV is in his 3rd year, centres take 5 years to develop. He's doing just fine.

[bryan colangelo]

Hate to nitpick, but I listen to all the basketball podcast on Grantland and I don't ever remember them saying the Raptors should trade JV. They just noticed that Casey doesn't trust JV yet late in games.

[JimiCliff]

Was listening to some padcasts (Grantland) today and they flat out said that Casey has no confidence in JV and they might as well trade for a new C.

The idea that JV is being utilized is not just some crack-pot theory by some crack-pot posters on an internet forum.

I'm going to come out and say it, Casey is a loser coach with winning players and needs to be replaced by a coach who will effectively use our players correctly and give our players confidence.

Who said this on Grantland?

Regardless - what kind of confidence Casey has in JV at this moment is debatable, but I've never got the sense that he doesn't have confidence in him in the long term. If anything, I'd say that the short leash he has him on, both in terms of PT and the way he runs plays for him, suggests that Casey thinks he's a good long term piece, and he's grooming him the way he thinks will benefit JV most (while at the same time using JV where he can to help this team, right now).

I get the same sense from the way Ross is used, and even Bruno (lol).

That's not to say I agree with how Casey's handling him, or any of the younguns. But to suggest he's lost all confidence in JV - that sounds like something someone who isn't very familiar with the team (cough *Grantland analyst* cough) would say.

[OldSkoolCool]

Hate to nitpick, but I listen to all the basketball podcast on Grantland and I don't ever remember them saying the Raptors should trade JV. They just noticed that Casey doesn't trust JV yet late in games.

You're right, Bill Simmons did not flat out say it, however by saying that they might as well go out and get someone like DeAndre Jordan is implying that you might as well trade the guy and let someone else play C.

******************************

"Negative Reinforcement" is not, and will never be more effective than "Positive Reinforcement" in professional sports (or at level, or in any walk of life)*. You cannot argue any differently**

Why?

Positive reinforcement builds confidence and negative reinforcement destroys it. Confidence is a huge component in playing well.

If Casey only ever focuses on how much JV screws up on defense and never gives him any lee-way to play through it on offense...at what point does JV start believing he isn't good? That lack of confidence leads to making mistakes that you wouldn't normally do (for example, miss chippies), which leads to frustration (everyone has seen him be frustrated), which leads to more mistake and more frustration.

It is a vicious cycle that is perpetuated by Casey.



*The only time negative reinforcement is applicable is in the military, where people are mentally utterly destroyed and rebuilt to be mould-able and compliant to authority and aggression. Does this sound like a good way to develop a basketball player?

**Positive reinforcement does not mean you can never criticize (which would be bad as well), but overall the positive comments outweigh the negative

[Chr1s1anL]

Was listening to some padcasts (Grantland) today and they flat out said that Casey has no confidence in JV and they might as well trade for a new C.

The idea that JV is being utilized is not just some crack-pot theory by some crack-pot posters on an internet forum.

I'm going to come out and say it, Casey is a loser coach with winning players and needs to be replaced by a coach who will effectively use our players correctly and give our players confidence.

You got to be kidding me! How about JV just being an average C right now? I do agree that Casey doesn't trust JV in some situations but, whats not being mention is that how about the players trust in JV? From watching the games So far the only player that seems to have faith in JV offensive repertoire is Lowry. Players aren't like is eh? They don't go around checkin JV's per48, WS and all that garbage. They just go off what they see in practise and in games.

[Fully]

You're right, Bill Simmons did not flat out say it, however by saying that they might as well go out and get someone like DeAndre Jordan is implying that you might as well trade the guy and let someone else play C.

******************************

"Negative Reinforcement" is not, and will never be more effective than "Positive Reinforcement" in professional sports (or at level, or in any walk of life)*. You cannot argue any differently**

Why?

Positive reinforcement builds confidence and negative reinforcement destroys it. Confidence is a huge component in playing well.

If Casey only ever focuses on how much JV screws up on defense and never gives him any lee-way to play through it on offense...at what point does JV start believing he isn't good? That lack of confidence leads to making mistakes that you wouldn't normally do (for example, miss chippies), which leads to frustration (everyone has seen him be frustrated), which leads to more mistake and more frustration.

It is a vicious cycle that is perpetuated by Casey.



*The only time negative reinforcement is applicable is in the military, where people are mentally utterly destroyed and rebuilt to be mould-able and compliant to authority and aggression. Does this sound like a good way to develop a basketball player?

**Positive reinforcement does not mean you can never criticize (which would be bad as well), but overall the positive comments outweigh the negative

Oh god, the drama!

[OldSkoolCool]

You got to be kidding me! How about JV just being an average C right now? I do agree that Casey doesn't trust JV in some situations but, whats not being mention is that how about the players trust in JV? From watching the games So far the only player that seems to have faith in JV offensive repertoire is Lowry. Players aren't like is eh? They don't go around checkin JV's per48, WS and all that garbage. They just go off what they see in practise and in games.

How many perimeter players do you know look off all bigs? (Every single one on the whole team)

Personal opinion as a player...the easiest way to win games is done by using the big man down the middle

[NaijaBoy17]

You're right, Bill Simmons did not flat out say it, however by saying that they might as well go out and get someone like DeAndre Jordan is implying that you might as well trade the guy and let someone else play C.

So you flat-out lied to prove a point? Nice

******************************

"Negative Reinforcement" is not, and will never be more effective than "Positive Reinforcement" in professional sports (or at level, or in any walk of life)*. You cannot argue any differently**

Why?

Positive reinforcement builds confidence and negative reinforcement destroys it. Confidence is a huge component in playing well.

First of all, I wasn't even talking about Negative Reinforcement, I was talking about Negative Punishment. And no, they're not the same thing. Negative Reinforcement is taking something away in order to get a favorable behaviour to be repeated. That's not what Casey does to JV. He does negative punishment; ie. taking something away (minutes) in order to get an unfavourable behaviour (defensive mistakes) to decrease.

I'm not sure which sports psychology degree you have that you can make a statement like "You cannot argue differently".

"Research studies have found that punishment is effective in suppressing or eliminating unwanted behavior. But in order for punishment to be effective it must happen immediately after the behavior, be severe, and occur every time the behavior occurs.

Read more: Punishment - Negative, Unwanted, Psychologists, and Effective - JRank Articles http://psychology.jrank.org/pages/523/Punishment.html#ixzz3KzGopQDy"

If Casey only ever focuses on how much JV screws up on defense and never gives him any lee-way to play through it on offense...at what point does JV start believing he isn't good? That lack of confidence leads to making mistakes that you wouldn't normally do (for example, miss chippies), which leads to frustration (everyone has seen him be frustrated), which leads to more mistake and more frustration.

It is a vicious cycle that is perpetuated by Casey.



*The only time negative reinforcement is applicable is in the military, where people are mentally utterly destroyed and rebuilt to be mould-able and compliant to authority and aggression. Does this sound like a good way to develop a basketball player?

**Positive reinforcement does not mean you can never criticize (which would be bad as well), but overall the positive comments outweigh the negative

Dude you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about.

[3inthekeon]

Reading some of the comments on this thread is like attending the Dunning-Kruger Coaching Academy.

[Zeknight]

TIN FOIL HAT TIME

Anyone else notice refs never let JV get going?

He gets hacked on the offensive end, and doesn't get foul

He breath on someone on the defensive end and he gets called for a foul.

Imagine what that would do to his confidence, a young guy like JV.

I don't see it stopping anytime soon, because if a team like the Raptors has a solid big man like JV, with all of the other weapons that they have available; then we get into the true Contender bracket.

And the NBA doesn't want a team from Canada being a true contender :/

JV is a very talented Offensive player, remember when people were saying JV being a 14/10 guy would move the raptors to the next level? HE IS a 14/10 guy, I mean his help defense leaves something to be desired (it takes time for a young guy to learn how to anchor a defense). I just don't think he gets the chance to really play...

Side note:
I don't blame Casey for giving him the hook half the time, because Casey is defensive minded, and when JV blunders on the defensive end, and they are running the offense through the wing... then whats the point of having him out there? (other than rebounds)

Casey has been a phenomenal coach this month and is deserving of his coach of the month honours. They way he handles JV's minutes is perfect, and with the shit he gets from refs, his poor help defense. He is utilizing JV as well as he possibly can.

[rocwell]

"JV is in his 3rd year, centres take 5 years to develop. He's doing just fine." Who told ya about this magic number?

Too bad we'll have to extend him to a huge contract very soon

[bryan colangelo]

Reading some of the comments on this thread is like attending the Dunning-Kruger Coaching Academy.

LOL.

Semi-related: if you gave Casey the choice of a team full of numbskulls that believed in themselves or a team full of guys that worked super hard because they hated themselves, he'd definitely pick the latter.

It's kind of the perfect identity for a Toronto team, to think it's never good enough even when it obviously is. Reflection of the fanbase.

[Chr1s1anL]

How many perimeter players do you know look off all bigs? (Every single one on the whole team)

Personal opinion as a player...the easiest way to win games is done by using the big man down the middle

I'm pretty sure these players wouldn't look off Monroe, Gasol, Noah, Jefferson. Cause they respect them as offensive players. I just don't believe his earned the respects of his teammates. Like DeRozan said "Casey let's us do what we want on offense". Well most of these player don't want get JV the ball.

[white men can't jump]

I'm pretty sure these players wouldn't look off Monroe, Gasol, Noah, Jefferson. Cause they respect them as offensive players. I just don't believe his earned the respects of his teammates. Like DeRozan said "Casey let's us do what we want on offense". Well most of these player don't want get JV the ball.

You say that like it's a good thing...

Oh, and Noah's a terrible offensive player. If he didn't become a good passer, he'd be Omer Asik out there, maybe worse.

*I'm also far from convinced those guys wouldn't get looked off...or rather, if Casey had to incorporate a big man who he basically would have no choice but to get the ball to, it would probably mean a shift in our O so some other player/position goes underutilized.

[bryan colangelo]

It's kind of hard to fast track a bigs development, isn't it? Stan Van Gundy is trying to do it in Detroit, and their team is terrible.

The biggest issue for JV (and Amir) is we just don't run straight-up pick and rolls. The truth might be that Lowry is a bad pick-and-roll point guard.