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  • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

    on this team yes. If we were a team that was slated to not be in the playoffs as in below the 8th seed at the end of the year and traded away our vets.. different story.




    If you are finding a cute way to try to ask me a question. I have already answered the question. Do I have to repeat myself on a daily basis.

    FVV should chuck less shots. Scottie is by the numbers second in terms of initiating offence but should be more assertive with taking shots. These points can be connected and yet they are not mutually exclusive.


    You already know my stance on FVV which isn't vastly different than yours.. I just think you can have a good old Masai "chat" with Fred at some point. Again at this point I shouldn't have to repeat myself on that point. As you would say moving on.

    If by the end of next season he hasn't moved up in the pecking order THEN freak out.
    Kagemusha wrote: View Post
    Why are you guys so enamored with these awards?
    TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

    personally I could care less. Barnes should care because these things effect your future earnings and incentives.
    Confusing because you keep harping in this forum that he should wait for his turn….so this is the only year he can get a Rookie of the Year award in his first year….obviously that ship would have sailed on year 2 lol

    last time I checked there is no SOY award as in Sophomore

    but he still can wait for ASG … hard if he is an after thought because this organization is already grooming two
    Last edited by The Claw Reborn; Thu Jan 20, 2022, 02:27 AM.
    #TradeVanVleet

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    • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post





      Confusing because you keep harping in this forum that he should wait for his turn….so this is the only year he can get a Rookie of the Year award in his first year….obviously that ship would have sailed on year 2 lol

      last time I checked there is no SOY award as in Sophomore

      but he still can wait for ASG … hard if he is an afterthought because this organization is already grooming two
      Let me clarify. I don't care PERSONALLY if he wins it. He won't win it and I never expected him to win it because of how the media talks about our team..



      I have specified that he needs time to develop. He is not at a level where he can carry an offense on his own. Scotties offensive contribution shouldn't be judged solely by focusing on FGA per game.


      In terms of ASG... literally almost impossible for rookies to make it. Only ones who do it are flashy and not just with passing but with other aspects. Dunking isoing.. etc Hence why Jordan is one of the only 3 individuals to ever make it in his rookie year.



      Scottie should continue to grow but I believe BOTH that he should have a higher amount of shots without getting to an extreme. I think any time he takes less than 10 shots that is bad. His shots should be 10-15. I have outlined that multiple times. Fred shouldn't take more than 15 ESPECIALLY if he is shooting 20%.


      David Thorpe said the same thing that I am saying. Barnes winning the award does not matter in the grand scheme of this team. It matters to Barnes because again it can affect his next salary negotiations but it isn't like he won't be good enough to overcome that because the kid will be at an all NBA level and recognized for it by his 3rd year.


      I don't think I have ever stated he should wait for "his turn" in the way that you are suggesting. I keep explaining that and there seems to be a lack of comprehension around that topic. I think Barnes is incredibly smart but he is still a rookie. The point is you give him more and more throughout the year but not all on day one. Otherwise you develop bad habits and other things. Barnes learning a difficult defence and learning how to play at an NBA level while managing other factors is key.


      There is a reason why he is 2nd on the team in terms of initiating offence. I posted that article. I can repost it if necessary:
      https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-its-paid-off/



      So it is about building him up. He needs to shoot the ball better and he needs a better handle. If he had that It would be a different discussion perhaps but that is the case. The handle is something that has improved but usually y you see the biggest improvements after an off-season of work.



      Wiseman was potentially given too much to handle and it stifled his development because he was given so many things to work on. Also this is partially how the raptors tend to develop guys. They tend to have them work on a few things.. perfect those tings then move on from there.



      Now at this point do you understand what I am getting at or are you still super confused?

      Comment


      • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

        Let me clarify. I don't care PERSONALLY if he wins it. He won't win it and I never expected him to win it because of how the media talks about our team..



        I have specified that he needs time to develop. He is not at a level where he can carry an offense on his own. Scotties offensive contribution shouldn't be judged solely by focusing on FGA per game.


        In terms of ASG... literally almost impossible for rookies to make it. Only ones who do it are flashy and not just with passing but with other aspects. Dunking isoing.. etc Hence why Jordan is one of the only 3 individuals to ever make it in his rookie year.



        Scottie should continue to grow but I believe BOTH that he should have a higher amount of shots without getting to an extreme. I think any time he takes less than 10 shots that is bad. His shots should be 10-15. I have outlined that multiple times. Fred shouldn't take more than 15 ESPECIALLY if he is shooting 20%.


        David Thorpe said the same thing that I am saying. Barnes winning the award does not matter in the grand scheme of this team. It matters to Barnes because again it can affect his next salary negotiations but it isn't like he won't be good enough to overcome that because the kid will be at an all NBA level and recognized for it by his 3rd year.


        I don't think I have ever stated he should wait for "his turn" in the way that you are suggesting. I keep explaining that and there seems to be a lack of comprehension around that topic. I think Barnes is incredibly smart but he is still a rookie. The point is you give him more and more throughout the year but not all on day one. Otherwise you develop bad habits and other things. Barnes learning a difficult defence and learning how to play at an NBA level while managing other factors is key.


        There is a reason why he is 2nd on the team in terms of initiating offence. I posted that article. I can repost it if necessary:
        https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-its-paid-off/



        So it is about building him up. He needs to shoot the ball better and he needs a better handle. If he had that It would be a different discussion perhaps but that is the case. The handle is something that has improved but usually y you see the biggest improvements after an off-season of work.



        Wiseman was potentially given too much to handle and it stifled his development because he was given so many things to work on. Also this is partially how the raptors tend to develop guys. They tend to have them work on a few things.. perfect those tings then move on from there.



        Now at this point do you understand what I am getting at or are you still super confused?
        Do yourself a huge favor amigo….reread your post response to Kag….lol

        You responded to him that Barnes should care to get a Rookie of the Year award (ROY) because it would affect his future earnings and incentives, right?

        How can he get a ROY award which as you know can only be awarded on the first year as a professional player especially if you keep pounding in this forum that he has to wait for his turn on offense? He ain’t getting the ROY award over Mobley with the way they are utilizing him

        Don’t go grasping other straws.
        Last edited by The Claw Reborn; Thu Jan 20, 2022, 03:04 AM.
        #TradeVanVleet

        Comment


        • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post
          The rook has to be tough minded and has to accept any kind of criticisms from the coaching staff especially from Nick Nurse.

          But what is an ongoing disappointment for him is that, plays like a PnR, PnP or a Post up that should be specifically designed for him, are way way too far in between.

          For him to watch VanVleet iso the ball, jack up Hail Marys after Hail Marys then having to witness a 6 foot guard drive the ball to the basket against 4 Maverick defenders can be so frustrating but yet he got all the anger directed towards him by his coach

          poor guy
          Nurse can be an idiot sometimes.

          Comment


          • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

            Do yourself a huge favor amigo….reread your post response to Kag….lol

            You responded to him that Barnes should care to get a Rookie of the Year award (ROY) because it would affect his future earnings and incentives, right?

            How can he get a ROY award which as you know can only be awarded on the first year as a professional player especially if you keep pounding in this forum that he has to wait for his turn on offense? He ain’t getting the ROY award over Mobley with the way they are utilizing him

            Don’t go grasping other straws.
            Reread what I wrote. I said he does care and yes he should. He isn't going to win it. He needs to be more assertive. Even if he was utilized more he wouldn't win it because of narratives.



            We keep both saying the same thing about fred but he has to also be more assertive that's that. Look if it was up to me you know who I would choose or you should.


            Scottie will be the guy. Whether nurse likes it or not Bobby knows what we have. Siakam knows, OG knows.
            Last edited by TrueTorontoFan; Thu Jan 20, 2022, 09:23 AM.

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            • Starting to sound like an echo chamber in here. Or maybe a music clip on an endless loop.

              Comment


              • Puffer wrote: View Post
                Starting to sound like an echo chamber in here. Or maybe a music clip on an endless loop.
                To be fair, some posters have called RR "the cult of DanH" - which is implying an even bigger echo chamber. Know what I mean? All opinions are welcome as long as we keep it respectful.

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                • golden wrote: View Post

                  To be fair, some posters have called RR "the cult of DanH" - which is implying an even bigger echo chamber. Know what I mean? All opinions are welcome as long as we keep it respectful.
                  All opinions are indeed welcome. But to keep repeating the same argument, with the same claims, to the same person who hasn't been convinced by that argument the previous 30 times gets tedious to read through.

                  Comment


                  • Puffer wrote: View Post

                    All opinions are indeed welcome. But to keep repeating the same argument, with the same claims, to the same person who hasn't been convinced by that argument the previous 30 times gets tedious to read through.
                    I guess you never browsed the 'Everything DeRozan' thread.

                    Comment


                    • Puffer wrote: View Post

                      All opinions are indeed welcome. But to keep repeating the same argument, with the same claims, to the same person who hasn't been convinced by that argument the previous 30 times gets tedious to read through.
                      It'd be great if it was at least confined to one thread. It's literally in every single thread now, even every new game thread.

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                      • Puffer wrote: View Post
                        Starting to sound like an echo chamber in here. Or maybe a music clip on an endless loop.
                        which is exactly why I was tired of repeating myself.

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                        • Primer wrote: View Post

                          It'd be great if it was at least confined to one thread. It's literally in every single thread now, even every new game thread.
                          Same posters saying the same things about the same players in every thread.

                          Comment


                          • golden wrote: View Post

                            I guess you never browsed the 'Everything DeRozan' thread.
                            Been there and done that. Happy to leave it behind and glad to see DD doing so well. The forum seems to have had a long run of reasonable and entertaining posting. It does seem to be circling around toward a similar drain as the DD thread days. Maybe they win a few games and it all goes away.

                            Comment


                            • Primer wrote: View Post

                              It'd be great if it was at least confined to one thread. It's literally in every single thread now, even every new game thread.
                              Amen to that brother.

                              Comment


                              • Puffer wrote: View Post

                                Been there and done that. Happy to leave it behind and glad to see DD doing so well. The forum seems to have had a long run of reasonable and entertaining posting. It does seem to be circling around toward a similar drain as the DD thread days. Maybe they win a few games and it all goes away.
                                RR, like the Raptors, has been bleeding talent for years. Now we're top heavy, and severely lacking in depth.
                                9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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