Everything Bismack Biyombo

[Rudy Bargnani]

Perhaps someone can help me out with this:

The eye test tells us Bismack is playing great ball. Me anyway.

The quick recap tonight notes that his plus minus is completely awful. Nba.com notes his plus minus as the worst on the team. Worse then Anthony Bennett.

Now look I tend to have a few drinks and eat a lot of cheesies during raps games but what am I missing? I know he is significantly limited offensively but watching him the last few games I have been all over the bandwagon. Has he really been that bad the last 6 games? The recap tonight said he has been minus 45 or something the last 6 games!

[rightsideup]

i think in offensive situations his teammates are understanding the positions he needs the ball in order to score and once he scores his confidence increases as do his teammates confidence in him. win win

[Chr1s1anL]

Has been simply just dominating the defense end last couple games. Beastmack!

[Miekenstien]

Perhaps someone can help me out with this:

The eye test tells us Bismack is playing great ball. Me anyway.

The quick recap tonight notes that his plus minus is completely awful. Nba.com notes his plus minus as the worst on the team. Worse then Anthony Bennett.

Now look I tend to have a few drinks and eat a lot of cheesies during raps games but what am I missing? I know he is significantly limited offensively but watching him the last few games I have been all over the bandwagon. Has he really been that bad the last 6 games? The recap tonight said he has been minus 45 or something the last 6 games!

we love hustle plays and hard work.

[DanH]

Perhaps someone can help me out with this:

The eye test tells us Bismack is playing great ball. Me anyway.

The quick recap tonight notes that his plus minus is completely awful. Nba.com notes his plus minus as the worst on the team. Worse then Anthony Bennett.

Now look I tend to have a few drinks and eat a lot of cheesies during raps games but what am I missing? I know he is significantly limited offensively but watching him the last few games I have been all over the bandwagon. Has he really been that bad the last 6 games? The recap tonight said he has been minus 45 or something the last 6 games!

We see activity, hard work, and tangible defensive possessions (like steals and blocks). But blocks are way overvalued by observation, for example. While less obvious things to the eye, such as spacing, rotations, etc, are areas where he hurts the team.

He is truly a terrible offensive player and drags the offence down into the mud. Meanwhile, he doesn't have nearly the impact defensively that you would expect.

[charlesnba23]

Last 5 games: 8 PPG, 16 RPG, 3 BPG

[Wild-ling#1]

Perhaps someone can help me out with this:

The eye test tells us Bismack is playing great ball. Me anyway.

The quick recap tonight notes that his plus minus is completely awful. Nba.com notes his plus minus as the worst on the team. Worse then Anthony Bennett.

Now look I tend to have a few drinks and eat a lot of cheesies during raps games but what am I missing? I know he is significantly limited offensively but watching him the last few games I have been all over the bandwagon. Has he really been that bad the last 6 games? The recap tonight said he has been minus 45 or something the last 6 games!

We see activity, hard work, and tangible defensive possessions (like steals and blocks). But blocks are way overvalued by observation, for example. While less obvious things to the eye, such as spacing, rotations, etc, are areas where he hurts the team.

He is truly a terrible offensive player and drags the offence down into the mud. Meanwhile, he doesn't have nearly the impact defensively that you would expect.

Last 6 games:

vs. Bucs............ -10....W 111-90
vs. Mavs............ +8....W 103-99
vs. Sacr............ -22.....L 104-94
vs. Heat............ +12....W 108-94
vs. Hornets........ +8......L 109-99
vs. Pacers.......... -6 ......L 106-90

These are the raw/box-score plus/minus numbers. I understand Dan prefers other +/- data. But Biz is minus 10 in these games, by the box-scores, not -45. This includes a tough night versus DeMarcus Cousins for the minus 22. Seems the +/- figures can be odd; Lowry and DeRozan were only +5, each, in a 21 point win tonight. Casey opted for both Patterson and Scola (with Ross, Lowry and DD), though, to put the game away, as I recall.

I'm not sure what to make of all this - but with all due respect, I am disinclined to simply accept the suggestion that the +/- tells the whole tale (and that he simply kills the offense and is not very impactful on defense) where he's averaging a double-double and the team has done quite well (with him playing big minutes) in the line-up. I'd add that other starters have had rough nights, while Biz has put up his impressive numbers, during this stretch.

Odd. I'm still curious about this too ...

[Axel]

He is truly a terrible offensive player and drags the offence down into the mud. Meanwhile, he doesn't have nearly the impact defensively that you would expect.

I can't think of a worse offensive player playing in the NBA now.

[DanH]

Last 6 games:

vs. Bucs............ -10....W 111-90
vs. Mavs............ +8....W 103-99
vs. Sacr............ -22.....L 104-94
vs. Heat............ +12....W 108-94
vs. Hornets........ +8......L 109-99
vs. Pacers.......... -6 ......L 106-90

These are the raw/box-score plus/minus numbers. I understand Dan prefers other +/- data. But Biz is minus 10 in these games, by the box-scores, not -45. This includes a tough night versus DeMarcus Cousins for the minus 22. Seems the +/- figures can be odd; Lowry and DeRozan were only +5, each, in a 21 point win tonight. Casey opted for both Patterson and Scola (with Ross, Lowry and DD), though, to put the game away, as I recall.

I'm not sure what to make of all this - but with all due respect, I am disinclined to simply accept the suggestion that the +/- tells the whole tale (and that he simply kills the offense and is not very impactful on defense) where he's averaging a double-double and the team has done quite well (with him playing big minutes) in the line-up. I'd add that other starters have had rough nights, while Biz has put up his impressive numbers, during this stretch.

Odd. I'm still curious about this too ...

DeRozan and Lowry were only a +5 because they were not on the court when we crushed them early in the 4th to put the game away. +/- is not a tell all, but it tells us one thing absolutely incontrovertibly - whether and by how much the team out scored their opponents when that player was on the floor.

It can be victim to massive swings from game to game, and single game results shouldn't be used to project future performance. But it IS descriptive of how the team played with that player in that game. Like you said, it is very possible that over a small sample of games this is caused by teammates getting cold, opponents getting hot, etc. It is over a larger sample of games that we can begin to be confident in those factors averaging out (with some exceptions, though more advanced versions of plus minus like APM or RPM look to correct some of those issues) and those plus minus numbers being descriptive of a player's impact rather than the noise that is evident in smaller samples. And it is over this entire season that Bismack's on-off numbers are very, very bad, on both ends.

I wouldn't draw much conclusion from a sample of 5 or 6 games - it is a season long trend and the last few games are just a continuation of it - Bismack does well enough for his skill set, puts up very solid individual numbers, and is still the biggest weak link on the team - which is no surprise, he's not a starting caliber C, though he's a very nice backup (which is what we signed him to do).

[Puffer]

Last 6 games:

vs. Bucs............ -10....W 111-90
vs. Mavs............ +8....W 103-99
vs. Sacr............ -22.....L 104-94
vs. Heat............ +12....W 108-94
vs. Hornets........ +8......L 109-99
vs. Pacers.......... -6 ......L 106-90

These are the raw/box-score plus/minus numbers. I understand Dan prefers other +/- data. But Biz is minus 10 in these games, by the box-scores, not -45. This includes a tough night versus DeMarcus Cousins for the minus 22. Seems the +/- figures can be odd; Lowry and DeRozan were only +5, each, in a 21 point win tonight. Casey opted for both Patterson and Scola (with Ross, Lowry and DD), though, to put the game away, as I recall.

I'm not sure what to make of all this - but with all due respect, I am disinclined to simply accept the suggestion that the +/- tells the whole tale (and that he simply kills the offense and is not very impactful on defense) where he's averaging a double-double and the team has done quite well (with him playing big minutes) in the line-up. I'd add that other starters have had rough nights, while Biz has put up his impressive numbers, during this stretch.

Odd. I'm still curious about this too ...

Taking nothing away from him, especially wrt hard work, effort and hustle.

Off the top of my head:
1. Rebounding wise, notice how many times he grabs a rebound and it would have fallen into another Raptors hands
2. Still on rebounding, how many times does he grab a second rebound off of his own miss
3. Notice the spacing on offense when he is on the floor
4. When he sets a screen there is no point in a pick and roll because the odds are he will not be able to catch the ball while rolling to the basket.
5. Think bunnies. How many possessions end up with the ball being delivered to him and he misses the layup? Check the bunny watch numbers.

Again, I want to take nothing away from his effort and hustle. And to be fair, I think his flaws have been less, relatively speaking on a per minute basis, since he began starting

[Chr1s1anL]

Last 5 games: 8 PPG, 16 RPG, 3 BPG

Guy just dominating on D right now. You can tell every player was looking where he was when they were around the rim. The kid is only 23. He can still get better. His just scratching the surface of his potential right now.

[Chr1s1anL]

17 games as a starter(has started more game than JV now). 11-6 in that span. Raptors would of been lost without this guy.

6.7 PTS, 11.7 REB, 1.9 BLK, .513 FG, .618 FT

[KHD]

I have a bad feeling JV is going to be a bench player with Casey coaching and Biyombo getting these individual numbers.

[Chr1s1anL]

I have a bad feeling JV is going to be a bench player with Casey coaching and Biyombo getting these individual numbers.

Still think JV will start for the rest of this season. Casey doesn't let injury effect roles. I do think the minutes will be more split. BB was averaging 16.9 mins off the bench. I can see with at around 22 min/G now and JV at 26 min/G. With who ever is having more impact on the game closing out. Biyombo has earned that increase of minutes. JV better come back with his A game. He struggled the last couple games before he got hurt I believe. Also Raps were only 8-6 with JV as a starter this year.

[raptors999]

I have a bad feeling JV is going to be a bench player with Casey coaching and Biyombo getting these individual numbers.

Biyombo has issues on offense and defense. Reggie Evans doesnt start for the same reasons and he has doesnt have Biyombos hands. As soon as JV gets back he should be worked up to a full load with Biyombo coming in occasionally.