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  • KHD wrote: View Post
    kawhi is gonna be the first guy to announce his decision via t-shirt when new balance drops the "He Stay" model.
    Those shirts will sell like crazy
    Abbas wrote:

    First of all i was my own source

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    • TheWaterboy wrote: View Post

      It is just on the very edge of what is possible, given what we know/think we know, that Kawhi *does not* opt out. (I'm not enough of a capologist to be sure that he can opt in and then sign a five year max over the summer, but I would assume that that would have to be part of the plan if he opts in.)

      Opting in would do two *very* interesting things:
      * It would drive large swaths of the basketball press bananas (I'm looking at you, ESPN and Fox Sports), and
      * If my math is correct, it would allow the Raptors to bring the entire main rotation back (Danny Green included) with a payroll plus luxury tax of less than the dreaded two hundred million threshhold.

      Again: it's not an impossibility that Kawhi, but it's just on the very edge of what's possible. The conventional view is that either a max contract now (for security), or a 1+1 (for flexibility and an even higher max contract in two years) is what's best, and both options certainly have a lot going for them in their own ways. Opting in is so far out in left field that it's almost over the outfield fence.
      To answer your implied questions:

      No, Kawhi cannot opt in and then sign a 5 year max over the summer.

      No, Kawhi will not be opting in.
      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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      • KHD wrote: View Post
        kawhi is gonna be the first guy to announce his decision via t-shirt when new balance drops the "He Stay" model.
        you might be onto something. He could probably make half his contract over in sales. Let's see...30 million Canadians x $40 per shirt - labour costs...

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        • “I don’t know the percentage [of chance that he stays],” (Danny) Green said during the event Saturday. “But i think it’s a higher percentage for him to be here than to leave.”

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          • G__Deane wrote: View Post
            “I don’t know the percentage [of chance that he stays],” (Danny) Green said during the event Saturday. “But i think it’s a higher percentage for him to be here than to leave.”
            based on the fact that he's out and about the city, which I guess he hasn't done in the past. And what they accomplished. He doesn't have any insider info... according to Danny

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            • Okay, for Kawhi to reach his 10 year in service max contract, with home town incentives...that means he would have to be here for 2 years, make a All NBA Team and sign with us for another 5 years. Am I correct? That doesn't seem likely to me. If he stays for two years and signs with someone else, he doesn't get the hometown incentives (extra money to retain players).

              If he stays one year and then goes to LA the second year. Would they have his bird rights after only spending one year? Giving him the option of signing that 10 year vet super max contract.

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              • I think the vet max is simply for being in the league 10 years. So, he can command that percentage of the cap. Although, I think he can still only get four years from other teams. (Like LeBron with the Lakers)

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                • saints91 wrote: View Post
                  Okay, for Kawhi to reach his 10 year in service max contract, with home town incentives...that means he would have to be here for 2 years, make a All NBA Team and sign with us for another 5 years. Am I correct? That doesn't seem likely to me. If he stays for two years and signs with someone else, he doesn't get the hometown incentives (extra money to retain players).

                  If he stays one year and then goes to LA the second year. Would they have his bird rights after only spending one year? Giving him the option of signing that 10 year vet super max contract.
                  There is no all-NBA requirement. That’s for if a home grown player wants to get the 35% max before they hit 10 years experience. Kawhi’s chance at that disappeared with the trade to the Raptors.

                  No matter what he does between now and then (so long as he plays in the NBA), two summers from now he’ll be eligible to sign for the 35% max with any team that has the cap room or rights for him (assuming he is a free agent at that time).

                  The only difference is how long that contract can be when he signs it, and how big the raises can be from year to year. In your scenario where he stays one year, and switches teams next summer as well, re-signing with his team at that point would be no different than signing with a new team - 4 years maximum contract length, smaller 5% raises. In any of these scenarios

                  If he is with a team for two years before signing, he can still only get 4 years, but gets the bigger raises (8%, due to his Early Bird Rights) if he re-signs.

                  If he signs with a new team, but for three years to earn Bird Rights before signing his 35% max (this would require he take an extra year to get there), or if he stays here for 2 years (to hit the 10 year threshold, we already have his Bird Rights), he’d be eligible for the full 5 years and 8% raises if he re-signs.
                  twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                  • DanH wrote: View Post

                    There is no all-NBA requirement. That’s for if a home grown player wants to get the 35% max before they hit 10 years experience. Kawhi’s chance at that disappeared with the trade to the Raptors.

                    No matter what he does between now and then (so long as he plays in the NBA), two summers from now he’ll be eligible to sign for the 35% max with any team that has the cap room or rights for him (assuming he is a free agent at that time).

                    The only difference is how long that contract can be when he signs it, and how big the raises can be from year to year. In your scenario where he stays one year, and switches teams next summer as well, re-signing with his team at that point would be no different than signing with a new team - 4 years maximum contract length, smaller 5% raises. In any of these scenarios

                    If he is with a team for two years before signing, he can still only get 4 years, but gets the bigger raises (8%, due to his Early Bird Rights) if he re-signs.

                    If he signs with a new team, but for three years to earn Bird Rights before signing his 35% max (this would require he take an extra year to get there), or if he stays here for 2 years (to hit the 10 year threshold, we already have his Bird Rights), he’d be eligible for the full 5 years and 8% raises if he re-signs.
                    In some ways, the CBA really doesn't do a good enough job giving the incumbent team a clear advantage. Not sure if I'm reading this correct, but if Kawhi is intent on retiring in L.A. AND also to getting a 5 year vet max, he's probably better off signing a 3-year deal with the Clippers asap to get the clock started, and then doing the 5-year veteran max right after the 3-year contract expires.

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                    • golden wrote: View Post

                      In some ways, the CBA really doesn't do a good enough job giving the incumbent team a clear advantage. Not sure if I'm reading this correct, but if Kawhi is intent on retiring in L.A. AND also to getting a 5 year vet max, he's probably better off signing a 3-year deal with the Clippers asap to get the clock started, and then doing the 5-year veteran max right after the 3-year contract expires.
                      The interesting counter point that players are starting to voice is that they shouldn't be penalized millions and millions of dollars for deciding to go somewhere else in free agency. I mean a team like say Milwaukee effectively lucks into a high lotto pick, drafts some guy, and now if that guy wants to play somewhere else 7-10 years down the line it's going to cost him personally $50-80 million dollars or something. From the player perspective that's kind of nuts, especially for guys who find themselves in mediocre organizations. I expect to see increasing pushback from the union on this, the league is going to have to figure out how to protect competitive balance and small market team without penalizing players.
                      "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                      • Thanks for clearing that up Dan

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                        • Jclaw wrote: View Post

                          you might be onto something. He could probably make half his contract over in sales. Let's see...30 million Canadians x $40 per shirt - labour costs...
                          Hopefully they make them in Bangladesh, where workers get 13 cents an hour! That way Kawhi can make more millions!

                          It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                          • Jclaw wrote: View Post

                            you might be onto something. He could probably make half his contract over in sales. Let's see...30 million Canadians x $40 per shirt - labour costs...
                            He’d be foolish not to sign at a 1+1, at a minimum, to milk the Canadian cash cow for at least one more season.

                            There’s a reason Uncle Dennis, the banker, looks so giddy these days.

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                            • S.R. wrote: View Post

                              The interesting counter point that players are starting to voice is that they shouldn't be penalized millions and millions of dollars for deciding to go somewhere else in free agency. I mean a team like say Milwaukee effectively lucks into a high lotto pick, drafts some guy, and now if that guy wants to play somewhere else 7-10 years down the line it's going to cost him personally $50-80 million dollars or something. From the player perspective that's kind of nuts, especially for guys who find themselves in mediocre organizations. I expect to see increasing pushback from the union on this, the league is going to have to figure out how to protect competitive balance and small market team without penalizing players.
                              Which is kind of impossible in this contaxt imo.

                              Call me crazy but I kind of want to see small markets even better protected, making it harder to create super teams in the largest markets. I think athletes should make all they can but won't shed a tear if it means playing in X market for $25M a year instead of another more preferable one (to them) for $35M a year .....

                              Why should a small market team almost never get even a sniff of the chip unleess they "effectively luck into a high lotto pick? It's those small makrket teams that contribute to the insane TV/cable leage sponsorship deals that allow for the $30M deals in the first place.

                              MLB is the best (worst?) example where the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs and Dodgers spend $200+M and 10 teams spend 100 or less to try and remain solvent? I'd like to see more teams succeed by how well they draft/develop and trade rahter than by how limitless their cheque book is .....

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                              • DanH wrote: View Post

                                There is no all-NBA requirement. That’s for if a home grown player wants to get the 35% max before they hit 10 years experience. Kawhi’s chance at that disappeared with the trade to the Raptors.

                                No matter what he does between now and then (so long as he plays in the NBA), two summers from now he’ll be eligible to sign for the 35% max with any team that has the cap room or rights for him (assuming he is a free agent at that time).

                                The only difference is how long that contract can be when he signs it, and how big the raises can be from year to year. In your scenario where he stays one year, and switches teams next summer as well, re-signing with his team at that point would be no different than signing with a new team - 4 years maximum contract length, smaller 5% raises. In any of these scenarios

                                If he is with a team for two years before signing, he can still only get 4 years, but gets the bigger raises (8%, due to his Early Bird Rights) if he re-signs.

                                If he signs with a new team, but for three years to earn Bird Rights before signing his 35% max (this would require he take an extra year to get there), or if he stays here for 2 years (to hit the 10 year threshold, we already have his Bird Rights), he’d be eligible for the full 5 years and 8% raises if he re-signs.
                                Ok ... I think I almost get that. Mostly. ha...

                                So, my confusion lies in ... if he's eligible for 35% of the cap, is that just for the first year and then the raises can take him above 35% in subsequent years?

                                If it's 35% no matter what, how can it be raised by different percentages according to those different scenarios.

                                (Thanks Dan for continually striving to make this stuff clear to us. )

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