Poeltl & Pascal - The 2016 Draft

[saints91]

Exactly! I chose not to put Ingram or Simmons lol it's possible 1 of the 5 could drop

[c-troop]

[saints91]

So 5 of the 8 guys you'd be content with are projected to go before we pick?

You really only need to rank 9 players and take the best available. If any slide then it's a no brainer.

Simmons
Ingram
Murray
Dunn
Hield
Chriss
Bender
Baldwin
Luwawu/Skal both are a toss up for me. I need to research them a bit more.

[lewro]

I wouldn't surprise me if Masai draft and stash kormaz and use 27 for a senior back up. He could trade back to get him and pick up other assets.
Not saying I want this but it's Masai so we're not taking ellenson. Bruno needs some friends.

[saints91]

You really only need to rank 9 players and take the best available. If any slide then it's a no brainer.

Simmons
Ingram
Murray
Dunn
Hield
Chriss
Bender
Baldwin
Luwawu/Skal both are a toss up for me. I need to research them a bit more.

**Actually slip Brown in after Dunn

[russellhantz]

lool

I think this is a pretty enlightening video. Masai describes player development as a key component. It's interesting we are here trying to figure out who will likely be stars when teams are looking for a players aptitude for development. There are some guys that are gonna walk onto the court and be able to game -- the superstars - but others its about how they fit in the system and our culture. Do you think the spurs keep hitting gems in the draft or do they have an unbelievable player development staff?

In recent interview with Masai he mentions a prospects mental fortitude to play behind someone until it's "their time." I'd love to hear how you guys think this changes the draft order? Cuz I don't think a player like hield would want to come in and play behind demar for x years when he already spent all that time in college.

[russellhantz]

Also can we stop over-valuing athleticism? Seriously there are a sea of players who have athleticism. To disregard ellenson or poetl because they can't play above the rim is ridiculous.

At a certain point the returns on athleticism are diminishing. Look at Gerald Green or Jeremy Evans. In an increasingly positionless NBA we need players who have good instincts and actually know how to play basketball.

[blackjitsu]

Also can we stop over-valuing athleticism? Seriously there are a sea of players who have athleticism. To disregard ellenson or poetl because they can't play above the rim is ridiculous.

At a certain point the returns on athleticism are diminishing. Look at Gerald Green or Jeremy Evans. In an increasingly positionless NBA we need players who have good instincts and actually know how to play basketball.

No one's over valuing athleticism.

Poeltl and Ellenson are two completely different kettle of fish -- don't group them together.

Poeltl can defend his position (He's a little slim, but that will come) He's solid, doesn't fit a need for the Raps. Or rather his game wouldn't replace what they lose from Biz. If they pick him, it's not the end of the world, but a more explosive big who can act as a counterpoint to Jonas and could potentially stretch the floor if needed would fit what most of us think the Raps need.

Ellenson can not defend his position. No one expects him to be a track star, but he has no lateral quickness, is a afraid of contact and is a poor defender. Because of his speed the likely hood that he will ever be an NBA average defender is low. Could he improve footwork, put on some muscle? Sure, but at best he may eventually be able to defend some centers --- but that fear of contact limits that likelihood as well. That's not a top 10 pick. You can't teach speed. Fearlessness and effort are skills too. Don't put a fearless kid like Poeltl and Ellenson in the same sentence again.

[russellhantz]

No one's over valuing athleticism.

Poeltl and Ellenson are two completely different kettle of fish -- don't group them together.

Poeltl can defend his position (He's a little slim, but that will come) He's solid, doesn't fit a need for the Raps. Or rather his game wouldn't replace what they lose from Biz. If they pick him, it's not the end of the world, but a more explosive big who can act as a counterpoint to Jonas and could potentially stretch the floor if needed would fit what most of us think the Raps need.

Ellenson can not defend his position. No one expects him to be a track star, but he has no lateral quickness, is a afraid of contact and is a poor defender. Because of his speed the likely hood that he will ever be an NBA average defender is low. Could he improve footwork, put on some muscle? Sure, but at best he may eventually be able to defend some centers --- but that fear of contact limits that likelihood as well. That's not a top 10 pick. You can't teach speed. Fearlessness and effort are skills too. Don't put a fearless kid like Poeltl and Ellenson in the same sentence again.

Chill bruh. I think we are overvaluing athleticism. Why does the board favor skal who has no proven track record? Why is the board bummed chriss is gonna get drafted before 9?

[Demographic Shift]

Also can we stop over-valuing athleticism? Seriously there are a sea of players who have athleticism. To disregard ellenson or poetl because they can't play above the rim is ridiculous.

At a certain point the returns on athleticism are diminishing. Look at Gerald Green or Jeremy Evans. In an increasingly positionless NBA we need players who have good instincts and actually know how to play basketball.

Larry Bird was not exactly a jump outta the gym athlete... good point....

[blackjitsu]

Chill bruh. I think we are overvaluing athleticism. Why does the board favor skal who has no proven track record? Why is the board bummed chriss is gonna get drafted before 9?

You and I are not brothers. I'm not overvaluing Skal. What posts have I praised Skal? He's an interesting stretch 4, but he's afraid of contact too.

I want Davis, if the choices are that group of PFs. He can defend out to the perimeter, isn't afraid of contact and has a stroke that can likely be stretched out.

I'm not overvaluing anything. Don't put words in peoples' mouths.

[blackjitsu]

Larry Bird was not exactly a jump outta the gym athlete... good point....

The Legend could defend his position -- multiple positions actually.

[blackjitsu]

Wait, did DS compare Ellenson, to Larry Legend?

I just threw up in my mouth.

[Demographic Shift]

The Legend could defend his position -- multiple positions actually.

That he could...
Was just suggesting that Russell has a point to consider... that athletiscm while being a valued aspect... shouldn't be the penultimate criteria to pick a guy..... sometimes there are just really good smart players out there who have a standing vertical of one inch but because they are always in the right place its not a big deal....

Drafting a guy with a combination of smarts and athletics ability is the dream of every team.

[Demographic Shift]

Wait, did DS compare Ellenson, to Larry Legend?

I just threw up in my mouth.

No.. i didn't compare the two players...so you can spit any time
I just put out there that being a jump out of the gym athelete does not always translate into being a great players.
There are other attributes that make you a great player.. smarts.. quickness... overall basketball skills such as passing and shooting ... Larry Legend had those and wasn't a jump outta the gym guy.
I am ambivalent towards Ellenson.