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The Lockout & the Raptors: Players approve CBA, Owners too! (1944)

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  • Tim W. wrote: View Post
    The players have to learn the difference between restriction and incentive, among other things...
    http://www.wearingfilm.com/picketfen...-need-to-stfu/
    Nice article, Tim. Well written and well thought.

    Comment


    • http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baske...11-11-2011.pdf


      There is the actual proposal from USAToday.

      It does not get more concrete than this.


      *EDIT*

      New luxury tax rules do not kick in until year 3 of deal but the 4 of 5 years rule starts accumulating in '11-12.

      Carmelo Rule:
      Extension-and-trades prohibited. If a player signs a contract extension, then the team is prohibited from trading the player for a period of six months following the date of the extension. If a team acquires a player in a trade, then the team is prohibited from signing the player to a contract extension for a period of six months following the date of the trade.

      Big Z Rule:
      Waiting period for trading team to re-sign traded player who is waived by recipient team is extended until the earlier of (i) one year from the date of the trade, or (ii) the July 1 following the last season of player’s contract.

      Cap holds are decreased - good for free agents and teams with cap room looking to resign their own players and other teams FA's.

      New trade rules for non-taxpayer: lesser of 150% + $100K or salaries being traded plus $5M.
      o Traded Player Exception increased for non-taxpayers such that the
      amount a non-taxpaying team has available to replace a traded
      player or players equals the lesser of (i) 150% of salaries of
      players being traded plus $100,000, or (ii) the salaries of players
      being traded plus $5M. (For purposes of this rule, team is a nontaxpayer
      if its post-trade team salary is below the Tax level.)

      Traded Player Exception for taxpayers equals 125% of the salaries
      of players being traded plus $100,000 (same as under 2005 CBA).
      Teams that go over the luxury tax 4 out of 5 years in the fourth year get $1 added to each $5M tax interval:
      Tax rates for teams that are taxpayers in at least 4 out of
      any 5 seasons (starting in 2011-12) increase by $1 at
      each increment (e.g., for team salary $5M-$10M above
      the Tax level, the Tax rate for a repeat taxpayer is $2.75-
      for-$1 instead of $1.75-for-$1).
      Sign and trade max length is 4 years and raises of 3.5% regardless of taxpayer or not.... in other words, Birds Rights not transferable (5 years and 6.5% raises).

      The Raps could put in a bid to get an amnestied player: say pick up 60% of contract, waiving team would pay remaining 40%.
      A modified waiver process would be utilized for players waived pursuant
      to the Amnesty rule, under which teams with Room under the Cap could
      submit competing offers to assume some but not all of the player’s
      remaining contract. If a player’s contract is claimed in this manner, the
      remaining portion of the player’s salary will continue to be paid by the
      team that waived him.
      Last edited by mcHAPPY; Sun Nov 13, 2011, 09:17 PM.

      Comment


      • @daldridgetnt: "Awaiting @TheNBPA meeting in NYC this morning. Ran into player on the way. He said he still hadn't heard from his team's player rep. ***."
        ***, indeed. Etan Thomas, and the rest of the NBPA executive, should be embarassed. The players should be outraged. The agents are filling in the info gaps for the players, and that's not a good thing.

        Maybe they *should* decertify, because this union is NOT currently serving them very well.
        Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

        Comment


        • ps-- Anyone know why the acronym for "shaking my head" gets censored on here???
          Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

          Comment


          • jimmie wrote: View Post
            ps-- Anyone know why the acronym for "shaking my head" gets censored on here???
            The acronym was abused by a former poster who has since been banned. Look through the comments from a year to a year-and-a-half ago and you'll see why. In hindsight it is pretty funny.

            Comment


            • Larry Coon raises a good point:




              I think the owners should look at any proposed changes and ask themselves, "Is it worth a season?"

              If so, fine.

              But I can't see anything worth that.

              Comment


              • Matt52 wrote: View Post
                Larry Coon raises a good point:

                I think the owners should look at any proposed changes and ask themselves, "Is it worth a season?"

                If so, fine.

                But I can't see anything worth that.
                This is becoming like a house sale offer process. imo the decertification threat is posturing to squeeze the most. There is a about a 45 day wait before actual decertification occurs.
                The players are really calculating whether they want to miss another cheque.

                Did anyone follow that NBA Twitter dog&pony show. It's ridiculous that the complexities of a 4.5 billion dollar business disagreement are being discussed and information on its details disseminated in a social media forum restricting one to 140 words and is best used either for gossip or surreptitious comment by anon users trying to foment a revolution. And the process was like shooting fish in a barrel by Stern and his steno.

                Comment


                • Bendit wrote: View Post
                  This is becoming like a house sale offer process.
                  Soo kinda like .. Negotiating? Indeed. haha

                  Of course the Threat of Decertification is posturing.
                  But when you're up against the entity that is The NBA, you must utililize all cards in the deck.

                  But as Larry Coon points out, if the players wanted to play the same game that the NBA is currently playing, this process would be a LOT uglier.



                  And I also, was wholey disheartened by the amount of 'Twitter' present within the Negotiations.
                  Its ridiculous.

                  Comment


                  • Bendit wrote: View Post
                    This is becoming like a house sale offer process. imo the decertification threat is posturing to squeeze the most. There is a about a 45 day wait before actual decertification occurs.
                    The players are really calculating whether they want to miss another cheque.

                    Did anyone follow that NBA Twitter dog&pony show. It's ridiculous that the complexities of a 4.5 billion dollar business disagreement are being discussed and information on its details disseminated in a social media forum restricting one to 140 words and is best used either for gossip or surreptitious comment by anon users trying to foment a revolution. And the process was like shooting fish in a barrel by Stern and his steno.
                    I would agree with the analogy. The league is the one selling the house but the mortgage is paid off and they aren't in a rush to sell. The players who are buying the house have no leverage other than to walk away but they need a place to live because their house is sold and closing in 3 weeks.

                    The TwitterView was good intentioned I think but it did not have the desired effects. I found the media who covered it to be like the characters in the movie "Mean Girls". Wallace at ESPN sent out a tweet with something to the effect of I can't believe the comments from media covering this, this is not our fight.

                    Comment


                    • Bendit wrote: View Post
                      This is becoming like a house sale offer process. imo the decertification threat is posturing to squeeze the most. There is a about a 45 day wait before actual decertification occurs.
                      The players are really calculating whether they want to miss another cheque.
                      The 45 day wait is with decertification. The players are looking at disclaimer of interest which means the union stays in tact but it no longer represents the players in negotiations. Supposedly this is a much faster process with the same outcome if players are successful: the right to take the league to court with anti-trust law.

                      Given how much strongly the league is pushing this and unwilling to bend, I think they feel the players accusation (negotiating in bad faith) will not hold given the compromises they have made and the union's very public 'blood issue' proclamations.

                      The players should put out a counter proposal but be willing to accept deal as is if rejected ..... in my opinion.

                      Comment


                      • joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
                        Soo kinda like .. Negotiating? Indeed. haha

                        Of course the Threat of Decertification is posturing.
                        But when you're up against the entity that is The NBA, you must utililize all cards in the deck.

                        But as Larry Coon points out, if the players wanted to play the same game that the NBA is currently playing, this process would be a LOT uglier.



                        And I also, was wholey disheartened by the amount of 'Twitter' present within the Negotiations.
                        Its ridiculous.
                        All true. But when it comes down to it this is always about who blinks first. And that is pretty much based on "who has most to lose" or least leverage. The players side has a starting disadvantage...numbers of their membership vs. the owners. They also have their agents. Difficult to maintain a unified posture. It's also now about not making the PA feel like they got whipped too badly. Personally I would ease up on the financial side of the agreement in a couple of areas.

                        Comment


                        • Stern doesn't have Owners' support on current offer?

                          Source: Yahoo Sports

                          Comment


                          • Stern's memo directly to the players:

                            "MEMO TO: NBA PLAYERS", NBA.com

                            The Owners feel that the Players weren't being fed accurate information. This memo was their effort to right that wrong.

                            Comment


                            • Nuclear option

                              National Basketball Players Association executive director Billy Hunter said Monday the union has decided to end the collective bargaining process with the NBA and will soon file an antitrust lawsuit against the league.
                              The union chose to reject the deal, and Hunter said he has issued a disclaimer of interest that will dissolve the union.

                              Prior to Monday's NBPA meeting, the union was expected to reject owners' offer and issue a counterproposal.

                              Source

                              Comment


                              • Apollo wrote: View Post
                                "MEMO TO: NBA PLAYERS", NBA.com

                                The Owners feel that the Players weren't being fed accurate information. This memo was their effort to right that wrong.
                                Nice find Apollo.

                                Stern does manage to come off as reasonable and of sound mind in the Memo; just seems to have grown tired of the bickering.
                                Just trying to figure out if Stern is trying to save face with the players, now that the owners aren't all on board.

                                Comment

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