Everything Derozan

[slaw]

All these comments from those who defended DD for years, I just want to point out.....

You're cheering for the same person but you're not currently cheering the same player.


If this version of DD over the last 5 games, minus a few relapses here and there, had been the DD we consistently saw over the previous 4-5 SEASONS (essentially since he became a 1st or 2nd scoring threat) then there would not have been too much to DeBate.


The DeMar DeRozan we have been seeing thus far this season and the DeMar DeRozan we have seen over previous seasons is NOT the same player.

Yeah, but, as I've noted before, Derozan hasn't been the same player for the last 4-5 seasons. In his All-Star year, he changed his game significantly shooting more threes than he had in the previous two years combined, getting to the line 200 more times than the previous season, dishing out 100 more assists, and upping his AST% nearly 10 points. Those were drastic, material changes to his game. Last year he largely sustained this trend but his shooting was so bad it coloured everything else. His early season numbers are tracking pretty close to the last two seasons and the only thing that's really hurting his performance right now is the fact he is shooting worse than his career average which should tick up a couple percentage points.

For example, people are talking about his passing but his per game assist number is 4.2 vs. 4.0 in 2013-14 and is AST% is 20.7 vs. 18.9.

He's not a perfect player and you're going to have to live the mid-range jumpers and the not so great shooting percentages but he has absolutely been adapting his game over the last couple of seasons and this season is a continuation of that trend.

[Axel]

The whole DD is a "new player" is just some posters trying to cover up the fact that DD has proven them wrong once again.

Lets not act like DD wasn't playing out of his mind last year for last 2 months after being healthy.

The only difference is Masai has brought players(Carroll) that better complement his game. Which make him harder to guard.

DD has just continued from where he left off at the end of the regular season.

Hahaha this is why we will never have peace in the Everything Demar thread.

Even when DD was playing "out of his mind", he still had many of the warts (poor shot selection, and poor W-L) that people were looking to see change. DD has played, these last few games, without these warts. To say that he is playing the same way as he had during last season (or even his allstar season) is admitting that you don't even know what you are seeing or looking for and discounting the possibility that Demar has actually evolved his game.

[Wild-ling#1]

Wouldn't it be "proving his doubters right" if the reason he's playing better is him limiting what all the "doubters" brought up (that were also supported by a sh*t ton of statistics, articles and the eye test)?

It was flat out and very colourfully and oh-so-repeatedly [I]denied[/I] that he could "up" his game.

That was the clear, essential and un-deniable salience of #ProveEm: That he would prove you wrong.

And so for God's-sake people have to stop spinning the story of his recent improvement (however durable) by implying that his harshest critics can now take the credit for someone else's accomplishments!

Just stop!

[hotfuzz]

The whole DD is a "new player" is just some posters trying to cover up the fact that DD has proven them wrong once again.

Lets not act like DD wasn't playing out of his mind last year for last 2 months after being healthy.

The only difference is Masai has brought players(Carroll) that better complement his game. Which make him harder to guard.

DD has just continued from where he left off at the end of the regular season.

Oh god do you ever turn it off?

[Chr1s1anL]

Wouldn't it be "proving his doubters right" if the reason he's playing better is him limiting what all the "doubters" brought up (that were also supported by a sh*t ton of statistics, articles and the eye test)?

Whats so different about his game this year?

[Bandit]

Most "Doubters" and "Haters" never had a problem with Derozan.

Most "Doubters" and "Haters" simply said that the only thing that matters is what happens on court, and that his work ethic and drive only counts if he can get it to the court.

Most "Doubters" and "Haters" saw the potential in Derozan, but the apparent disregard to play to his strengths brought out such frustration.

He is playing a new style of game so far, don't pretend he isn't. He's making better decisions, taking better shots. He has better self-awareness and is playing hard on defense consistently.

You didn't like the whole District of Derozan thing so lets stop acting like everyone here is a "Doubter" or "Hater" because they criticized a talented players choice to play a flawed style of basketball that didn't help his talents, or contribute to team success.

[Nilanka]

Whats so different about his game this year?

He's taking less dumb shots.

[Miekenstien]

not even arguing about the player anymore. hahahaha

this thread is crazy

[Axel]

He's not a perfect player and you're going to have to live the mid-range jumpers and the not so great shooting percentages but he has absolutely been adapting his game over the last couple of seasons and this season is a continuation of that trend.

After watching the ball stick on offence for the last few years, simply cannot agree.

If his assists go up (or stay the same) but his usage comes down, you can't say that's the same playing style.

The ball is finally moving, which is what so many of us have been screaming for these past few years. Only a select few players are talented enough to excel in a ball stopper role, DD isn't in that class (and even those in that class struggle to win).

[tDotted]

Wouldn't it be "proving his doubters right" if the reason he's playing better is him limiting what all the "doubters" brought up (that were also supported by a sh*t ton of statistics, articles and the eye test)?

Too much sense in a DeMar thread. I don't like it.

[Bandit]

It was flat out and very colourfully and oh-so-repeatedly [I]denied[/I] that he could "up" his game.

And so for God's-sake people have to stop spinning the story of his recent improvement (however durable) by implying that his harshest critics can now take the credit for someone else's accomplishments!

Just stop!

So why do the people who ignore his flaws deserve to get credit for his accomplishments?

And who's trying to take credit?

I see people saying, "hey look, derozan has done some of the things that we thought would help him out! Cool. It seems to be going well!"

[Nilanka]

Agreed. I don't think "taking credit" is the proper term here. Nobody is saying, "DeRozan is playing well because of me".

[CalgaryRapsFan]

The whole DD is a "new player" is just some posters trying to cover up the fact that DD has proven them wrong once again.

Lets not act like DD wasn't playing out of his mind last year for last 2 months after being healthy.

The only difference is Masai has brought players(Carroll) that better complement his game. Which make him harder to guard.

DD has just continued from where he left off at the end of the regular season.

You have it completely backwards.

Shall we recap what the 'haters' have been saying for years?

1) Attack the basket and don't shy away from contact (from the early years) --> the way he attacks the basket and deliberately looks to draw contact, so he can make a living at the charity stripe, is the polar opposite from the marshmallow-soft way he played early in his career

2) Post-up smaller defenders --> this is one of his greatest strengths that he still doesn't rely on consistently enough, but when he does - as we've seen the past few nights - he can be incredibly effective shooting high-efficiency shots (while drawing and-1's - see #1)

3) Play facilitator instead of hero-ball --> it's evident in every measure - eye test, basic stats, advanced stats, game results - that DeRozan, his teammates, and the team in general are all better when he involves his teammates effectively, instead of only forcing his own game

4) Contribute in other ways than scoring --> when he commits to defense, rebounding and facilitating (see #3), he has a much broader and much more positive impact on the game, even when his own shot isn't falling efficiently

5) Don't rely on the worst shot in basketball and/or force bad/contested shots --> in his best games throughout his career, and for most of this season, him being 'good DeRozan' consistently has been the most impressive improvement we've seen from him; when he resorts to selfish hero-ball, 'bad DeRozan' can look like a d-leaguer that shoots his team right out of games (by wasting possessions and taking his teammates out of the game due to lack of offensive involvement)


--

It's really the same as Casey. His detractors argued that the scramble defensive strategy was horrendous and didn't play to the strengths of his personnel. The new defensive system is the exact opposite, allowing players - both perimeter and inside (especially JV) - to play to their strengths, which has made the entire roster look better and resulted in a top-tier looking defense get established so quickly out of the gate.

One of my pet peeves in this early season is listening to media talk about "players buying into Casey's defensive system this season" as the reason for the defensive turnaround. That's complete sh!t. The players are no more committed to the system this season; the system has changed and the new system is committed to the players on the roster.

Casey, like DeRozan, hasn't proven his doubters wrong. Instead, by having success with the changes made (the very changes that the 'haters' have been clamoring for), they're both proving the doubters correct. Us 'haters' are just enjoying the success the team is having, with both Casey and DeRozan, without the need to needle fellow posters with tripe like #ProveEM

[Axel]

It was flat out and very colourfully and oh-so-repeatedly [I]denied[/I] that he could "up" his game.

That was the clear, essential and un-deniable salience of #ProveEm: That he would prove you wrong.

And so for God's-sake people have to stop spinning the story of his recent improvement (however durable) by implying that his harshest critics can now take the credit for someone else's accomplishments!

Just stop!

If you ever tell another poster to stop, you will be banned. I don't care how many smiley faces you use to try and cover it up.

[SkywalkerAC]

It's funny that after years of being called a hater for criticizing Demar's game, now DD is finally demonstrating some of the concepts we've been talking about for years; it's an odd feeling.

5 games is still way too small a sample size to make any great determinations or judgement, but early returns are promising.

But why now? Why after years of being almost defiant in his shot selection is he making the effort to change his game? I believe a big part of the change is Carroll. DD seems a very social player and after years of running with guys like Gay & Lowry, he now has a new voice in his ear. Just a theory anyway.

Could be because, y'know, I told ya so.