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  • Lupe wrote: View Post
    Let's stop calling Poeltl the #9 pick guys like it means something trade value wise. His value is significantly lower than what the value of that pick was before we actually drafted him because the uncertainty of potentially getting a special kind of prospect is gone. Zach Lowe explained this concept pretty well in one of his recent podcasts.
    slamdunk23 wrote: View Post
    Poeltl value is probably around a top 20 pick now.
    ...and what do you think their #12 pick Taurean's value is?! The same guy who is the only thing ATL has gotten as a result of losing Teague and Horford, just wondering.

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    • TRex wrote: View Post
      I'm not trading good, young, controllable assets like Powell or JV for a rental player like Millsap. There's just no way.

      Now, if we're talking Ross or Joseph + Sullinger + draft picks, then sure.
      I don't make any trade if I think its just a rental. If the FO is willing to go into the luxury tax there is no reason why they shouldn't be confident with signing Milsap with his bird rights.

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      • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
        ...and what do you think their #12 pick Taurean's value is?! The same guy who is the only thing has gotten as a result of losing Teague and Horford, just wondering.
        Probably top 25 (20-25) depending on a team's need. Pick's lose so much value after they are drafted becuase you lose the flexibility of drafting who you want and teams have seen a little of have they perform against NBA talent.

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        • slamdunk23 wrote: View Post
          Probably top 25 (20-25) depending on a team's need. Pick's lose so much value after they are drafted becuase you lose the flexibility of drafting who you want and teams have seem a little of have they perform against NBA talent.
          So he is lower value than Jakob who is only being suggested as a PIECE of a PACKAGE, yet ATL so far has accepted him ALONE with LOWER VALUE to Poeltl as you point out as consulation for losing their 2 younger pieces of their core but it's so unreasonable to think they would take a BETTER draft pick PLUS more young pieces when now they are out of trading chips and the GM's head is on the line???

          Come on now, not you in particular, but others need to stop making like it's not a decent offer when it's FAR more than what they've netted when they were in a far better situation.

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          • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
            So he is lower value than Jakob who is only being suggested as a PIECE of a PACKAGE, yet ATL so far has accepted him ALONE with LOWER VALUE to Poeltl as you point out as consulation for losing their 2 younger pieces of their core but it's so unreasonable to think they would take a BETTER draft pick PLUS more young pieces when now they are out of trading chips and the GM's head is on the line???

            Come on now, not you in particular, but others need to stop making like it's not a decent offer when it's FAR more than what they've netted when they were in a far better situation.
            Ya I completely agree. I think a package of Ross, 2pat/Sully, Poeltl & a pick can get it done if ATL really wants to trade him.

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            • A.I wrote: View Post
              If you're the Raptors you don't trade JV unless there is a guarantee you're getting someone like Noel in a 3 team trade or in a separate trade. Not saying this because I like JV, but because I'd rather not have Bebe starting.
              Bebe doesn't have to start. Sully will be back in a couple weeks.

              Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
              @Chr1st1anL

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              • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                Bebe doesn't have to start. Sully will be back in a couple weeks.

                Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                Sullinger as the starting C? yikes.
                Mamba Mentality

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                • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                  Bebe doesn't have to start. Sully will be back in a couple weeks.

                  Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk

                  Comment


                  • Lupe wrote: View Post
                    Exactly. Barton/Harris/Murray are all SGs so moving one of them isn't a big deal for them. Jokic is a lot better than Nurkic and this would let him play much more and really take the reigns as the #1 center. Faried gets replaced by Millsap. They can do better than a future lottery protected pick since they have theirs and Memphis' (unless it's top 5, which it won't be) this year.
                    I still don't undestand this move for DEN, why would the give up on Nurkic (who actually plays well alongside Jokic) and give up a pick for 2-3 years of Millsap?! What could they possibly hope happens in that window???

                    So instead of being #8 seed for the next few years and getting swept by GSW they give up a young C and pick to be 6-7th seed and lose to SAS, HOU or LAC instead?! lol Difference being in 2-3 years Millsap is washed up and Nurkic is only starting to truly bud as a good young player not to mention a lost pick. It seems like such a pointless move to give up young talent just for a 2-3 year window to get beat up by SAS, HOU or LAC instead of GSW.

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                    • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
                      He is also not the GM who will most certainly be fired if he losses Millsap for nothing....3 all-stars gone and you only get Taurean Prince as a return?! lol yeah that poster and others like him can go shove that type of comment up their collective you know whats.

                      It's FAR from delusinonal to think offering the #9 pick plus 3 other young players for the oldest of the core they have left is reasonable when all they got was the #12 pick as whole lol
                      It is a complete false dichotomy to suggest that it's either our package or Millsap walks. There are probably 10 other teams that would make an offer. We're not operating in a vacuum.

                      And Lupe is right, the #9 pick is just a number. That draft was considered to be eight deep and who knows where Poeltl would end up in the 2017 draft.

                      Comment


                      • First off, getting any minutes at all as a rookie on an elite team is nothing to sneeze at. Then, Poeltl has basically performed every time he's gotten on the court. His foot quickness gives him that added-value as a centre-prospect in the modern era, his athleticism verified.

                        His trade value is fine.

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                        • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
                          I still don't undestand this move for DEN, why would the give up on Nurkic (who actually plays well alongside Jokic) and give up a pick for 2-3 years of Millsap?! What could they possibly hope happens in that window???

                          So instead of being #8 seed for the next few years and getting swept by GSW they give up a young C and pick to be 6-7th seed and lose to SAS, HOU or LAC instead?! lol Difference being in 2-3 years Millsap is washed up and Nurkic is only starting to truly bud as a good young player not to mention a lost pick. It seems like such a pointless move to give up young talent just for a 2-3 year window to get beat up by SAS, HOU or LAC instead of GSW.
                          Nurkic and Jokic play terribly together that's why Denver and Jokic started the year so bad. They have now been starting Jokic and playing faried as the backup 4 with Nurkic getting a bunch of DNP's. I think he actually complained today about not playing enough so the nuggest may look to trade him.

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                          • KHD wrote: View Post
                            TRex wrote: View Post
                            Sullinger as the starting C? yikes.
                            The genius Brad Steven started him there last year for 71 games.

                            Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                            @Chr1st1anL

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                            • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                              Bebe doesn't have to start. Sully will be back in a couple weeks.

                              Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                              Personally I think you have a bit too much confidence in Sullinger as a starting center. I think he's a very good backup center who can play 4 as well in some lineups, but I would not want to start him at all. He's not a defensive anchor by any stretch of the imagination and is an even less intimidating rim protector than Valanciunas. Isn't that mobile either so won't be much of an improvement when it comes to hedging or guarding quicker players on the perimeter.

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                              • Scraptor wrote: View Post
                                It is a complete false dichotomy to suggest that it's either our package or Millsap walks. There are probably 10 other teams that would make an offer. We're not operating in a vacuum.

                                And Lupe is right, the #9 pick is just a number. That draft was considered to be eight deep and who knows where Poeltl would end up in the 2017 draft.
                                Not once did I say it was our offer or nothing, feel free to quote me on that before you make the comment about operating in a vacuum and I would like to see what "10 teams" you're referring to and what those sample trade packages would be and more importantly why would those teams need Millsap because any team that trades for him is banking on a 2-3 year window.

                                Then what's with this abstract conversation about the pick number being just a number?! lol That's not what the conversation is about.

                                Here's the simple fact....ATL has only netted a return of a #12 pick Taurean Prince for their troubles of losing the younger Teague AND Horford (who is fairly close to Millsap in terms of talent level) when they were in a far better position of power. Whatever measurement of previous drafts or future ones you want to give is rather meaningless. The point is they have already accepted what looks to be a lesser player (by himself) when they had bargaining power on their side than the player we're suggesting as a PIECE of a package that contains 3 more young players when Millsap is all they have left and the GM's ass is going to absolutely be on the line now yet some of you are making it out to be an unreasonable offer which is quite frankly is ridiculous.
                                Last edited by JamesNaismith; Mon Jan 2nd, 2017, 04:38 PM.

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